darellmatt
Rising Star
Here is a link to the use of psychedelics in Buddhism that I found helpful.
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are psychedelics useful in buddhism?
- Thread starter darellmatt
- Start date
While the historical Gautama Buddha discouraged the use of alcohol and "intoxicants "... in my own small world, without psychedelics, I would have never gleaned any understanding of the Void or for that matter, Nirvana. So, it seems that by ruling out enthegens as "intoxicants ", it's difficult to know how Lord Buddha would have viewed DMT. IMO, it is true that, "all things in measure ". And this most certainly applies to psychedelics. Meditation, on the other hand, is a way of life and a constant companion. The two work remarkably well together! 
Well, to start off I will admit that I am not really into Buddhism..it just does not resonate with me personally..considering my ancestral past has been hidden from me by the church I feel most aligned at this time with other "indigenous" peoples worldviews, the Native American peoples in particular..as well as Australian ideas..
..but I say who cares? Who cares what Buddha said or what anyone else said? I would say that any spiritual system that says psychedelics are not useful is one you should question carefully..for me that would be a sign that what I am looking for is not there.
..but I say who cares? Who cares what Buddha said or what anyone else said? I would say that any spiritual system that says psychedelics are not useful is one you should question carefully..for me that would be a sign that what I am looking for is not there.
BTW..Personally I believe that Buddhism has roots in a much older history of "shamanic" practices..especially Tibetan shamanism. Even the Dali Lama conciders Bon a Buddhist path at this time.
What I find most interesting though, is that the Dali Lama himself consults with a "shaman" all the time..I mean this is how he plans things etc..watch this video.
I find the portrayal of Buddhism in the west pretty shallow tbh..which is part of why I moved away from it maybe. I used to be really into it but I found western "Buddhism" sterile and unappealing.
What I find most interesting though, is that the Dali Lama himself consults with a "shaman" all the time..I mean this is how he plans things etc..watch this video.
I find the portrayal of Buddhism in the west pretty shallow tbh..which is part of why I moved away from it maybe. I used to be really into it but I found western "Buddhism" sterile and unappealing.
Nathanial.Dread
Esteemed member
I too would not have found Buddhism to resonate with me as deeply as it does if I hadn't already started thinking about states like Nirvana on my own, with the help of psychedelics. I would not consider myself a Buddhist (and I would never refer to anyone as Lord Anything), but a lot of the tenants really line up with the work I've done with psychedelics.Rising Spirit said:While the historical Gautama Buddha discouraged the use of alcohol and "intoxicants "... in my own small world, without psychedelics, I would have never gleaned any understanding of the Void or for that matter, Nirvana. So, it seems that by ruling out enthegens as "intoxicants ", it's difficult to know how Lord Buddha would have viewed DMT. IMO, it is true that, "all things in measure ". And this most certainly applies to psychedelics. Meditation, on the other hand, is a way of life and a constant companion. The two work remarkably well together!
And while yes, the Buddha exhorted us to avoid intoxicants, I would hardly consider a serotonergic psychedelic an intoxicant. Alcohol and Fentanyl are intoxicants, they damp my ability to explore the world and appreciate the world. On psychedelics I feel LESS intoxicated then I am even when I'm sober.
Blessings
~ND
d-T-r
Rising Star
Secret Drugs Of Budhism
"While investigating the obscure origins of the Vajrayāna the author became intrigued by the pivotal role played by a ritual sacrament known as “the elixir of immortality” (Skt., amṛita). The Vajrayāna tradition makes extensive use of this sacrament: some form of amṛita is consumed at the outset of all its major rituals. While modern “amṛita” is an innocuous concoction of herbs, grains and saffron, the word amṛita originally denoted a potion made from psychoactive mushrooms, most notably fly agaric and Psilocybe cubensis. By the time of the later Buddhist tāntras, a concoction of five psychoactive plants, known in Sanskrit as pañcāmṛita, were being used as the sacrament.1 This work provides copious evidence that, in historical times, several psychedelic plants were used sacramentally within the Buddhist tradition."
There are key differences between the Buddhas original teachings and advised practices and those that emerged when Buddhism reached tibet. As Jamie said, Tibetan budhism is essentially a mixture of Buddhism and the much older Bön shamanic and ritual perspectives.
Personally, i think psychedelics can be useful in any practice because it's pretty much a given for most that they can help you reach states of mind and meditation you might struggle to normally. Of course part of the emphasis in Buddhism is non-attachment, so using them is think is fine, but relying and depending on them is a problem in of it's self.
"While investigating the obscure origins of the Vajrayāna the author became intrigued by the pivotal role played by a ritual sacrament known as “the elixir of immortality” (Skt., amṛita). The Vajrayāna tradition makes extensive use of this sacrament: some form of amṛita is consumed at the outset of all its major rituals. While modern “amṛita” is an innocuous concoction of herbs, grains and saffron, the word amṛita originally denoted a potion made from psychoactive mushrooms, most notably fly agaric and Psilocybe cubensis. By the time of the later Buddhist tāntras, a concoction of five psychoactive plants, known in Sanskrit as pañcāmṛita, were being used as the sacrament.1 This work provides copious evidence that, in historical times, several psychedelic plants were used sacramentally within the Buddhist tradition."
There are key differences between the Buddhas original teachings and advised practices and those that emerged when Buddhism reached tibet. As Jamie said, Tibetan budhism is essentially a mixture of Buddhism and the much older Bön shamanic and ritual perspectives.
Personally, i think psychedelics can be useful in any practice because it's pretty much a given for most that they can help you reach states of mind and meditation you might struggle to normally. Of course part of the emphasis in Buddhism is non-attachment, so using them is think is fine, but relying and depending on them is a problem in of it's self.
SHroomtroll
Rising Star
Buddhism like all religions has been kidnapped by greedy suits with their own agendas it seems, just look up the dali lamas nazi connections etc...
I was recently in dharamsala where there is alot of tibetan buddhist and something just struck me the wrong way seing all of these dressed up monks with there iphones lol
I was recently in dharamsala where there is alot of tibetan buddhist and something just struck me the wrong way seing all of these dressed up monks with there iphones lol
d-T-r
Rising Star
I think that's more a sympton of the old world merging with globalization than anything else.
Probably easier for a Monk with an Iphone to learn about the entire world and find certain texts with iphone than without it.
'Enlightenment' today is both the same and very different to what it is back then. globalization brings a new context.
Also, Dalai Lama has always operated under a strict code of non-violence. A lot of the darker stuff people bring up about him seems as if it has it's own agenda quite often.
I don't deny certain parts of the more ritualistic Buddhism can be as dark as certain parts of Roman-Catholicism, but it's important not to forget the overall aim and application of Buddhism,
To generate compassion to ease suffering for the sake of all beings.
It doesn't add up to me that the Dalai lama is secretly a 'bad guy' in disguise considering the extent that he encourages inter-faith tolerance and peaceful cooperation around the world in general.
If anything he is in favour of encouraging Secular-ethics , Ethics beyond religion and spirituality, even beyond Buddhism.
Probably easier for a Monk with an Iphone to learn about the entire world and find certain texts with iphone than without it.
'Enlightenment' today is both the same and very different to what it is back then. globalization brings a new context.
Also, Dalai Lama has always operated under a strict code of non-violence. A lot of the darker stuff people bring up about him seems as if it has it's own agenda quite often.
I don't deny certain parts of the more ritualistic Buddhism can be as dark as certain parts of Roman-Catholicism, but it's important not to forget the overall aim and application of Buddhism,
To generate compassion to ease suffering for the sake of all beings.
It doesn't add up to me that the Dalai lama is secretly a 'bad guy' in disguise considering the extent that he encourages inter-faith tolerance and peaceful cooperation around the world in general.
If anything he is in favour of encouraging Secular-ethics , Ethics beyond religion and spirituality, even beyond Buddhism.
See I look at things a little differently. First I don't take anything from the sole point if view of the whole practice. We find this evident with things like DMT. Your experience differs, that's just how everything else works in my opinion. And monks with cell phones, I mean is that really an issue? They had paper before right? iPhones are just upgraded paper.
I personally find a lot of connections between Buddhism and my own experience here. The idea about western Buddhism is that it has western influence mixed with it. I dont personally follow any western beliefs so I wouldn't myself mix that in as part of my scope of my experience anyways. Everything is as its influence dictates. As ideas spread they get mixed in with the cultures that are flooded with it and it gets adapted. I like the idea of Buddhism and think it hits home more so than any other but I don't take anything as it is.
The idea is there. I believe it's closer to actuality than any other system out there. When I combined DMT with the Bhagavad Gita sung in Sanskrit it resonated so strongly that I cannot deny that there is something connected between psychedelics and Buddhism.
I personally find a lot of connections between Buddhism and my own experience here. The idea about western Buddhism is that it has western influence mixed with it. I dont personally follow any western beliefs so I wouldn't myself mix that in as part of my scope of my experience anyways. Everything is as its influence dictates. As ideas spread they get mixed in with the cultures that are flooded with it and it gets adapted. I like the idea of Buddhism and think it hits home more so than any other but I don't take anything as it is.
The idea is there. I believe it's closer to actuality than any other system out there. When I combined DMT with the Bhagavad Gita sung in Sanskrit it resonated so strongly that I cannot deny that there is something connected between psychedelics and Buddhism.