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Bit of a dilemma...

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barfingmoron

barfingmoron

Rising Star
First off, hello nexus! I've been floating around here for many months now, and I am amazed by the fellowship this forum has been able to develop and maintain. I figured it was about time I officially threw my hat into the ring, while I also feel this community may be able to help me with an obstacle I have recently encountered in my life.

In the last several years, I have become fairly experienced with a handful of psychedelics, and have grown a great deal from them. One of which is Cannabis, but it happens to be a big part of my current dilemma. A few months ago, I vaporized some as I usually would, but several minutes into the effects I got an overwhelming feeling of panic that I could only relate to the panic you might feel on a difficult spice experience. To be clear, this was not just normal paranoia you might get from cannabis, it was like the overwhelming negativity one might feel during a really bad trip, but there was no drug, just our normal reality. Keep in mind, I had been smoking cannabis regularly for approximately 3 years before this incident and have never had any problems of this nature. It came in definite waves, each of which I would say lasted about 5 to 15 minutes and on average occurred every 5 to 10 minutes. During these waves I felt so incredibly alone, and detached from everything, and everyone, and no matter what I tried I could not find comfort in anything. It was so awful I thought I was either dying, had developed some form of psychosis, or had even been laced due to the strangely psychedelic nature of these waves. When I was not in the middle of a wave it was like everything was fine, and then another wave of despair would come on. I managed to make it through a few days with these intense waves until I was able to see a doctor. In that time the waves hadn't gotten much better, but I was able to deal with them better via meditation, and support from my family. I explained to the doctor as best I could what was happening and how it happened, and he thought they were just panic attacks and prescribed me effexor. Everyone was pressuring me into taking the effexor, but I figured whatever this problem is, it would be better for me to try to deal with it naturally and head-on rather then cover it up and run away from it, and in hind site I am glad I didn't take it.

A few months have gone by, and these waves eventually got less and less intense (or maybe I got better at dealing with them) until they were virtually gone. It's hard to explain, but my only problem now is I get the same intense negative feeling that I felt during those waves only less intense and very brief whenever I am around any negative energy, making me a far more energetically sensitive individual then I used to be, if that makes sense. I am worried about not being able to work with psychedelics anymore due to my current state. I haven't smoked cannabis since, in fear of going through the whole hellish cycle again, but I also am not sure it was even the cause of this. I feel strongly that it was related to the DMT experiences I had in the few weeks prior to the incident. I can't exactly explain how or why, I just really feel it is related. And while the whole affair has been the most emotionally challenging thing I have ever experienced, I also think I have learnt alot from it.

It is very difficult for me to portray what has happened and is happening, but I feel I have explained the jist of it. I have my theories as to what is going on, none of which are very solid. If anyone here has a helpful oppinion or advice whatsoever, I would love to hear it.
 
Hi barfingmoron... (I feel bad calling you this somehow) welcome to the nexus.

to get this straight - the panic attacks started after you vaporized weed but didn't stop when the effects wore off?

I guess what I would try to do is find out the source of fear. Like sit down with a pen and paper and start free-associate writing or something like this and listen in to what you are afraid of. At first you'll probably get all kinds of different things, but if you look long enough you will probably find some kind of pattern in these fears, some kind of central theme or core. I would try to find this and then try to integrate it, express it, work through it.

Also maybe some kind of physical exercises could help. Have you tried Chi Gong or something like this? These exercises focus on all kinds of different energies within us and while you are working with bodily energies you are also speaking really positive mantras and visualizing very positive things, so maybe this can help.
Also I think dancing can help, getting into a trance and dance until your fears break away...? Until everything dissolves into the motion of the music.

As for psychedelics I'm not sure if I would use any if I were you. If you are worried that this is a neuro-chemical problem then I would stay away from them. If you think this is merely psychological (is there such a thing) or at least not a serious organic problem then maybe one or the other could serve you to resolve this issue. But you would have to find out which for yourself.

I had a bad mushroom experience a while back, with panic attack and all and the breathing issues I got from that (clamp around my chest, having trouble getting enough air in) lasted for several weeks thereafter. Even now sometimes I can still feel myself constricting. I find it interesting when psychological issues become manifest in the body like this. It puts it kind of in-your-face and you HAVE to deal with it. For me taking other psychedelics or even mushrooms again didn't make it worse, but that's not to say it will be the same for you. I think concerning psychedelics the most helpful was acid, but I think that was mainly due to the fact that I tried to direct the experiences to dealing with these issues in one way or another.
so it could help, but I think it's something you have to consider very very well first. I would definitely try physical exercises and meditation some more first. yoga, chi gong, running, swimming, dancing, singing(!) in combination with accepting your emotions and trying to let them flow, instead of trying to make them stop... hopefully they will dissolve by themselves at some point.

also maybe find a different doctor you can talk to better. one that will not necessarily give you drugs to solve your problems but one that will give you some advice on how to deal with your problems psychologically, philosophically and spiritually. Try maybe a transpersonal psychologist if you can find one.

much love
Enoon
 
I get the same things sometimes, except its been going on since i was a kid. I personally think that there are evil forces in this universe that target us all the time, but many people just think these bad experiences and feelings they get are just all in their heads or a natural thing. I don't know this for sure, but with my experiences i am pretty confident in this theory.
 
@barfingmoron

Hi, first off, I'm currently studying in psychology, but am very far from a PhD, I am hoping to focus my studies on transpersonal psychology through meditation, holotropic breathing, psychedelik therapy. I'm telling you that so you know I am far from an expert but the focus of my life's 'research' is to help people get through phases like you had.

Transpersonal psychology was researched by only a few marginal Characters, Abraham Maslow, Stanislas Grof, Carlos Castaneda, Ken Wilber... it is an approach to psychology that finds its roots in Oriental philosophy, it was created in an attempt to break the paradigm of medicinal psychology that limits our 'spirit' or 'conscience' to chemical reactions, dooming our young people to be broken throught addictive unproven drugs. It suggests other states of mind out of the ego, out of your current 'universe of concepts', out of causality and time.

Now... on the same note, Stanislas Grof wrote about 'The Holotropic mind' wich suggests that our mind has access to some sort of a 'tree of possible futures' to actually focus on one possible future and make it happen, we usually call this determination... If you believe in it hard enough it happens. Wich is why the understanding of Eastern philosophy and the way they had for their people to find this internal force that is, to believe.

-I think what happened to you is a holotropic crisis, a moment where the possibilities explored by your mind overwhelmed your capacity to let go of them and chose the right one. If a doctor tells you 'you are bipolar son, take this and you'll feel better' and you take the thing, then you take the 'tunnel reality' the doctor tells you to take.

The way you explain it seems like you simply triggered it by smoking a little too much weed for a little too long, so my first suggestion is that you try smoking less often, it doesnt matter if when you smoke you smoke a cargoload, just... from now on, take Weed a little more seriously, take it like a psychedelik experience, take your time to recover from your trips... take your time to establish a creative setting just as you'd do for a mushroom trip.
I also consider that in the case of a public forum, you might not have told about events happening in your personal life that would have helped trigger your panic attacks, If this is the case, remember that interpersonal relationships might be the root of your problem, what you see as 'panic' might also be unhealthy emotions such as hate, jaleousy or guilt.

-You should really not take the effexor, it is very addictive and it breaks people, definitely, especially when taken with Tryptamines (LSD, DMT) if you end up taking it, at least remember not to do tryptamines... ever...sadly enuff... or very unexpectable events WILL happen.
-Go to a teashop and buy 3 things:
Hypericum (acts as Serotonine Inhibitor)
Hibiscus (acts as MAO)
Oregano essentail oil (immune system super power up)

-Before you sleep have a tea of Hibiscus mixed with Hypericum (I found it's a nice routine who makes people smile in the morning when they usually dont, it also helps your brain regulate serotonin while you sleep)
-When you wake up, take 5 drops of oregano oil under your tongue (after 3-4 seconds you feel like the bottom of your mouth will blow, after 15-20 seconds it's gone) not necessary to have a routine but it helps your body fight most of the bacterias / viruses that would otherwise... drain your joy.


About what is the 'name' of the phenomenon that happened to you, check out Stanislas Grof and The Holotropic crisis I think it'll be a good start.
Good luck, Good wind.

Peace

@cecil_cbr
You should not believe in such evil forces, it is how they actually exist around you and drain from you. If you reach a true sense of ego loss wich is not illusion, where all concepts are inexistant, no entities can exist to trouble you, inside or outside your head, 'real' or not.
 
Hey guys. I give my deepest apologies for taking so long to reply. I thought no one had replied and only checked today and saw what everyone has said. Again, sorry. Thank you for your replies. Let me update you on my situation.

My "panic attacks" have gotten ALOT better. I still get them, but they are very rare, and not nearly as intense when they do happen. I find they only happen when I think about it happening, or when I challenge them. You see when I'm not in the middle of one, I hardly think they're that big of a deal and that there is no longer anything wrong with me, so I try to bring one on to see if I can overcome it, and when it comes I immediately remember how irrationally terrifying they are and how stupid I was for trying to challenge it, so I calm myself down, which I have gotten very good at doing. It definitely seems like time has helped me move on, but I think I might just be burying it and not dealing with it properly. I would very much like to work with psychedelics again, but I haven't tried ever since this has all started in fear that it might either make my situation worse, or just ruin the experience altogether. To clarify, it was just the one cannabis experience that started this all, and I haven't used it ever since.

@cecil_cbr
I have seriously considered that it could be an evil force of some kind. Although I am leaning towards other possibilites, I don't write this idea off.

@De_Loused
Thank you very much for the recommendations and ideas you have presented. I'll look into them.

Also, I think I will be making a new account with a different name. Even I feel bad calling myself "barfingmoron". It is a username I have had for years for many different things, and unthinkingly used it here. I think I owe it to myself and this community to have a better name than that.

I will continue to check back here with my new user to see if anyone has replied, so please, if anyone has any more helpful thoughts on the matter, I would really love to hear them.

Thanks!
 
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