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BLAB Limonene doesn't separate

MonkeyJar

Rising Star
I'm doing my first extraction according to BLAB. I have done everything according to instructions _except_ my vinegar apparently is 10% and not 5%. After mixing the limonene for couple of hours and letting it sit until next morning (because no separation happened before) I could finally only pull only around 10 ml of limonene off the top. After which I tried adding another 100 ml and again it has disappeared into the soup. Now my tub is sitting in warm water and I am thinking of adding more lye since that is something that people here are suggesting in other threads. Can the 10% vinegar ruin the whole thing and does someone have any other suggestions on what to do? <3
 
disappeared into the soup
That sounds like your mixture has way too much water in it, if it's anything like liquid. It needs to have a consistency akin to cookie dough.

A fair proportion of the first pull gets "eaten" by the lime paste. This gets made up for on subsequent pulls. Still, a 90% loss is rather on the steep side!

Is your paste runny? If so, add lightly pre-moistened lime (so the powder doesn't disperse into the limonene) and mix it in thoroughly to thicken things up. You may get lucky and find a bit more limonene reappearing, but don't bank on it.

Are you absolutely sure you're using pure limonene as well?
 
Okay so to be clear I used
350g mhrb
800 ml vinegar
400 ml water + 200 g NaOH
1.3litrea of water

So far I have put in 200 ml of limonene Dextro.
And yes my mixture is definitely liquidy.

So you reckon I could add what amount of lime and is that referring to calcium oxide (CaO)?
 
Okay so to be clear I used
350g mhrb
800 ml vinegar
400 ml water + 200 g NaOH
1.3litrea of water

So far I have put in 200 ml of limonene Dextro.
And yes my mixture is definitely liquidy.

So you reckon I could add what amount of lime and is that referring to calcium oxide (CaO)?
Oops, sorry - saw "limonene" and had a brain fart! (I have a rotten cold today 🤧) You may have to disregard the bits about lime and consistency.

Often limonene gets used with lime (slaked/pickling lime, calcium hydroxide) - perhaps because the smaller volume of basic material reduces solvent losses. Calcium oxide is known as burnt lime, and reacts vigorously with water to form the aforementioned hydroxide (hence, "slaked").

Looking at your ingredients, that seems like you've used rather a lot of vinegar, as well as having committed an awful lot of bark to a first extraction with this method, except that's less than what the actual BLAB document suggests and you've scaled it all just fine for the amount of bark you put in. Hm.

*The BLAB page on the old wiki actually has a more detailed ingredients list which seems to have been omitted from the migrated version, above. Which version did you work from? Here is the list, just to be sure:
Materials RequiredChecklist.png
Source Material:
  • 450g(one pound) MHRB (powdered)
Solvents:
  • 473ml(16fl oz) bottle of 99% IPA. If one cant get IPA, there are alternative ways described below
  • 2.5 liters of water
  • 500ml of D-limonene (100ml per pull)
Reagents/Desiccants:
  • 5g of Fumaric acid (probably way more than enough). If one can't get fumaric acid, there are alternative ways described below
  • 250g Sodium hydroxide
  • 100g Sodium carbonate (only needed if you want a smokable product. For oral ingestion, no need)
  • 1 liter of 5% Vinegar. If one doesn't have fumaric acid, needs another 500ml of vinegar.
Equipment:
  • Pipette or Turkey Baster
  • 1 US Gallon (3.8L) Milk Jug(HDPE #2 plastic) or big glass container (e.g. a 4.5L demijohn)
  • Two 800ml(as close as you can) glass jars
  • One 100ml(also as close as you can get) glass jar
  • Safety goggles and gloves
Does this also align with the rest of your method so far?

I'm still wondering if there's something up with your limonene - some products are mixed with ethanol or detergents: did you definitely use something that really only contains limonene and no further additives?

I'm puzzled, tbh - as well as kind of being left thinking that the BLAB tek could be a poor method, especially for a beginner.

It would be prudent to search the forum for other threads discussing BLAB and its troubleshooting. I'm a bit short of time rn.
 
Hi! Yes that is the exact BLAB that I have been following. Definitely realising now that I should have tried out with way less bark, I was just too excited. 🫣

I'm really very sure that the limonene is just pure limonene. Also I have got all the ingredients from someone who has used them successfully before. Does limonene (or other ingredients) get old after opening...? :D

I have seen in other threads some people suggesting adding more lye but I'm a little hesitant to try it.
 
I added lye water which produced no difference. Every time after letting the mixture sit for some hours there is a thin layer of limonene, of which I can pull maybe 5 ml or so. :D not sure if that is going to keep happening forever so that I could just really slowly gather all of it.
 
Another option is to add more water to help with separation of two phases.
I added more lye water and when that didn't do anything added a splash of water which produced a very distinctive layer on the top part of the mixture. (Picture) Any idea what that indicates of or is it just normal way it should behave?

Anyway I then mixed and put the whole thing in hot water tub again and now this morning there was a bigger separation of limonene on the top, still missing a lot though. I guess I will keep experimenting with the warmth?

Is there such a thing that the limonene is sitting in the mixture for too long? It has been many days since I added the first 100 ml already so just wondering... :) thanks for replying!
 

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Most likely the layer on top is your limonene which has been released from the mix due to higher amount of water.

I would suck out the limonene and add again some water.

I am not sure about stability of limonene in such environment.
 
Most likely the layer on top is your limonene which has been released from the mix due to higher amount of water.

I would suck out the limonene and add again some water.

I am not sure about stability of limonene in such environment.
Thank you! Adding still more water totally worked and the separation is happening now, hooray!
 
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