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Casing methods / Recipies

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Xt

Xt

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Senior Member
OG Pioneer
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My friends just curious as to how you folks are making casings?
Do you use a Rubbermaid box and a heat source, or a heated propagator as a FC?

Do you use just vermiculite? Or do you use Coco-coir/verm/other mixtures.
And lastly, how to you make sure your casing layer doesn't contain any contamination? Pressure cooking it?
 
I'm hoping to do this for the first time in a few weeks. I've got everything I need except the spores to go ahead with the PF tek. For this I've heard a pressure cooker isn't necassary and some folk do this in a regular pan. I'm going to be using a vegetable steamer.

I think if you're using rye a pressure cooker is essential from what I've read.

It seems that you get out what you put in so obviously higher nutrient mixes will give bigger fruits than the standard flour/vermiculate.

I'll be using a small non-heated propagator for fruiting the casings with plenty of perlite. The average temperature here is around 22C so I imagine things aren't going to happen as quick as they would with extra heat.

I'm also very interested in what other folk have to say on this as I know there are folk around here who know their stuff on the matter.

Mycotopia and shroomery seem to be to bulky in over advanced and opinionated information respectively. I've read a good few tek's but little information in terms of the why.

I'd also be interested if folk are adding other product to the casing to disencourage mould or whether just keeping stuff as clean as possible is the only way to go.
 
Casing layer can be sterilised in a microwave with some water or in a PC but in general if your substrate is totally colonised and your casing materials have no nutrients then there is nothing to worry about. For grains a PC is needed, in fact you really cant be sure something is sterilised unless you pressure cook it. Short cuts will just end with infection and wasted weeks so read everything you can and do it right the first time. Also there is info at the shroomer in adding a ph buffer to the casing layer to make it less mold friendly. The shroomery is really the place to look up this info.

Oh and fruiting is initiated by fresh air exchange, light, and temperature drop. So having a heated fruiting chamber my delay pinning and fruiting.
 
My friend got some spores from spore ring europe. He took great great care with making the syringes...alcohol and flame desinfection after each innoculation. Out of 9 quarter pints, only one got green fungus (he did use a pressure cooker). He didn't read anything about casings before making the cakes, so he birthed them right into a shotgun terrarium with perlite. Now he knows, that going the extra mileage seems to be worth it and brf cakes can be used to spawn to substrate.

The cakes looked fine for 2 weeks but no pins! He found out that his perlite was bone dry. DON'T RINSE IT TOO WELL!! I NEEDS TO BE PRETTY WET! He poured some water over it and after a couple of weeks of misting and fanning tiny mushrooms appeared..maybe they're still pins, technically, but they're getting bigger everyday even though they grow pretty slow.

Unfortunatly, 2 cakes did not survive. One got trich, the other white mold and trich.
Thank hyperspace entity it wasn't a casing! That's seems to be the problem with casings...the loss is very big after contamination.

Good luck!!
 
xtechre said:
Do you use just vermiculite? Or do you use Coco-coir/verm/other mixtures.
And lastly, how to you make sure your casing layer doesn't contain any contamination? Pressure cooking it?
Click to expand...

I do a 50\50 vermiculite-coco coir, and add calcium carbonate to raise the pH (since shrooms like 7.6, app.)
I put it in jars, closed well, and sterilize everything in 90 minutes pressure cook.
Then you put to colonise again, in the hot dark. When like half of the layer is white, then you can put it to fruit.
Has always worked. You can see it has no contamination from color, smell, and other signs. Since is white and without smell, than it's ok.
 
There is a lot of info. at shroomtalk, and it's a much friendlier environment than the shroomery! I almost compare it to the atmosphere here!
Straight verm can be used as a casing. Jiffy mix or pro mix (with no compost added) can also be used. Just sift it first, and use the fine stuff. It's already been ph balanced to neutral, so you don't need to add buffers. I'm experimenting with 50:50 pro mix and verm right now.

Have fun and good luck!
 
My friend says thanks for this info. She just started looking at Pressure cookers and was not impressed with the price!
Which PC's are you guys using?
 
If you wish to take this hobby seriously, and have some success, you will need a pressure cooker. I use a Jazi (which is a cheap one), and have had no problems. I have heard good and bad things about the presto's. My next one will definitely be an all american. They are pricey, but bulletproof. They don't even have a seal to dry out, degrade and fail. They last a lifetime.
 
to xtechre...
Buy a bigger PC... Bigger the better.
It doesn't have to be a pricey one,
PC doesn't have a complicated mechanism,
so cheaper ones serve your purpose perfectly.

But if you buy a small PC, you will regret later,
you will feel very frustrated when you start bulk growing.
 
If you want an exact answer rogerabbit (love him or hate him) suggests:

10 parts ph balanced peat moss
10 parts vermiculite
1 part calcium carbonate (or 1/4 part hydrated lime)
1 part gypsum

Gypsum really makes the difference! great stuff.
 
WOW....whole new world for me here....i love mushrooms and work with them regularly but have yet to undertake growing my own. i just ordered a "grow kit" with "golden teacher" spores about a week ago. i've got my fingers crossed that all goes well...but the more i read about this new branch of creating magic, the more overwhelmed i get. it just seems SO EASY to fuggit all up!!

i will be spending more and more time in this room trying to learn the ropes...

thank god for you guys!

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!
 
antrocles said:
WOW....whole new world for me here....i love mushrooms and work with them regularly but have yet to undertake growing my own. i just ordered a "grow kit" with "golden teacher" spores about a week ago. i've got my fingers crossed that all goes well...but the more i read about this new branch of creating magic, the more overwhelmed i get. it just seems SO EASY to fuggit all up!!

i will be spending more and more time in this room trying to learn the ropes...

thank god for you guys!

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!
Click to expand...

The best advice I can give is a) get a PC, and b) do as much research as you can before you start, it will save a lot of headaches down the road. and c) pf tech is the best way to go for beginners. Once you get the hang of that, then you can try moving on to bulk methods. Good luck!

Here are a couple of my GT rye jars, that just got spawned to bulk sub. today:
DSCN1890.jpg


and one of my awesome LC's:

DSCN1866.jpg


I highly recommend the shroomtalk site for info.
 
xtechre said:
My friend says thanks for this info. She just started looking at Pressure cookers and was not impressed with the price!
Which PC's are you guys using?
Click to expand...
I use an Aeternum of 7.5 lt, and it's not bad at all.
 
Astralking said:
10 parts ph balanced peat moss
10 parts vermiculite
1 part calcium carbonate (or 1/4 part hydrated lime)
1 part gypsum
Click to expand...

^ What I use. DO NOT STERILIZE YOUR CASING (do not pressure cook it). Pasteurize it. You can pasteurize in bags or in microwave, but this has never pleased me.

What I do (taken almost exactly from RR's Lets Grow Mushrooms dvd):

Take out my 21qt pressure cooker.
Take 7 quart jars (or however much casing you need).
Fill jars with casing (3/4ths full).
Cover with lids or foil tops (one has to be just foil and no lid).
Put them in pressure cooker.
Add water up the the 3/4ths mark on the jars (as much water as you can without some getting into the jars).
Stick a meat thermometer in the middle jar (the one with the foil lid, so the thermometer is taking temp from inside).
Boil water until inside temp of the middle jar has reached 140 F.
Turn off and stove.
It should climb to 170 and stay there for 40 minutes to an hour.
Let them cool for HOURS.
Add.

This has worked for me EVERY time.
 
Casing has no nutrients to destroy. You can sterilize it, you can pressure cook it. They say not to sterilize, but instead pasturize your substrate, but even that has been proven to be a myth with cubes. Many people sterilize their substrate, poo and all, in a pressure cooker (myself included), and have excellent results, and far less contam. rates.
 
Ya, i know many have sterilized their sub and it still worked (which still kind of shocks me), but there is no DOUBT there are beneficial microbial life in hpoo (can read about it here) and other subs and sterilizing kills those beneficial bacteria. It is a MYTH that there are ZERO beneficial bacterias in casing. It is just unfounded.

For me, there is simply no reason to sterilize before I pasteurize my sub or casing. It is easier and more time manageable for me (i'm excluding microwave sterilization, I can't believe people do this).

I'm not trying to argue, but I have heard too many times that casing contains zero beneficial microbial life and that it should be sterilized. Even if there actually was none, it still would be better to pasteurize.

EDIT: And on the contam factor, I rarely get contams with pasteurizing all of my stuff. Only trich a few times and that was on my RYE jars, not even added sub or casing.

I don't know, maybe my house is just cleaner than some. I am cautious but still pretty lazy when it comes to ensuring a sterile environment..
 
Thank you all so much for visiting this thread. My friend would rather not join another forum so she asked me to ask you here.
To the meat of the post...

*So what temps are used for colonizing jars, and what temps are used to start pinning/fruiting?
**What PH should the fruiting chamber be?
***Can you mist the casings once they have been put into the Fruiting chamber?

****How deep do you folks make your substrate and how deep do you make your casing layer?
My friend has some trays that are 2 inches deep.
 
xtechre said:
Thank you all so much for visiting this thread. My friend would rather not join another forum so she asked me to ask you here.
To the meat of the post...

*So what temps are used for colonizing jars, and what temps are used to start pinning/fruiting?
**What PH should the fruiting chamber be?
***Can you mist the casings once they have been put into the Fruiting chamber?

****How deep do you folks make your substrate and how deep do you make your casing layer?
My friend has some trays that are 2 inches deep.
Click to expand...

Id suggest you pick up Stamets' The Mushroom Cultivator. There are pdfs online and all of your questions will be answered there (although SOME stuff is outdated, GGMM is also a good read).

*Colonization should be around 80-82 F. The inside of the jars are usually 4-6 hotter than the outside temp and colonization temps should not be above 86.
**PH in fruiting chamber? The FC shouldnt have a PH. The casing should start with a ph of 8 or so as it will go down over time. A neutral ph is good.
***You should mist the casing so it is shiny, but do not oversaturate it.
****Atleast 3 inches (although i'm testing sub depths right now) and no more than 5-6 inches.
 
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