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Changa/Enhanced Leaf Questions

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Wan Hu

Wan Hu

Esteemed member
Hi

I have up until this point used a vaporiser, but for various reasons am looking to try other methods to see if there is a more suitable one for me.

After some research, I was thinking of making some leaf infused with spice only, and some infused with rue only, so as to be able to fine tune. For all of its advantages, I chose to go with mullein as my base.

My questions are:

From your experiences, how much spice can mullein absorb?

How pure does the rue extract have to be? I know from experience that the powder that results from evaporating all of the water from tea isn't enough concentrated and doesn't smoke well on it's own, but is it necessary to do the full extraction?

Finally, any suggestions on smoking methods? How efficient would a joint be?

Any thoughts are welcome, thanks
 
If I recall correctly, my enhanced leaf is 1g DMT and 1g mullein. It's pretty absorbent. Allow the mix to sit in whatever solvent you use to aid in fuller absorption.

I've heard of people using crude extract with no issue. I'd say follow through to the end of whatever extraction you're using to cover all of your bases.

I smoalk my changa or enhanced leaf either out of a GVG or a bubbler. I'd advise against a joint if you're trying to breakthrough, as that's an increased fire risk.

Best of luck.

One love
 
Good point about the fire risk with a joint!
Also, joint is pretty inefficient. It can get you far, but it takes 2-3x the dose to do it, compared to a bong. That's with changa - idk if it works for enhanced leaf, since there's no harmalas in that i could imagine that quick inhalation of the full dose is important.

Yeah crude harmala freebase works ok. I'd say the minimum tek is something like: boil whole rue seeds, filter (keep the liquid), base, filter (keep the solids), wash, dry.
 
I save the burnt herbs from my changa bowls for joints with cannabis. It's something I've found to be a nice combination that doesn't take one so far that their bodily function reduces beyond their usual control. But otherwise, I get nervous if I put a fresh dose in anything that stays lit on its own.

One love
 
Thanks Voidmatrix, I did 1:1 as per your suggestion, more concentrated would only be more complicated to dose anyways, I asked because I saw a method on the psychonaut wiki that calls for infusing 500mg of spice and 500-700mg of FB rue into only 250mg of mullein, which seems like a lot.

Why use a GVG with leaf? Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that the point of the GVG was to vaporise FB, and that the point of leaf was to smoke using more standard devices, one would believe the GVG cannot reach the higher temperatures required by leaf. I feel like a joint is easier to manipulate and put down than a pipe, but I see your point on the fire hazard. I have a spoon pipe, I think I will use that.

Thanks Homo Trypens, that is exactly what I wanted to know, could you please just explain what you mean by wash? Also is Sodium Carbonate good to base? Would a purer extract present any considerable advantages?

Thanks!
 
JackOutsideTheBox said:
Thanks Voidmatrix, I did 1:1 as per your suggestion, more concentrated would only be more complicated to dose anyways, I asked because I saw a method on the psychonaut wiki that calls for infusing 500mg of spice and 500-700mg of FB rue into only 250mg of mullein, which seems like a lot.

Why use a GVG with leaf? Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought that the point of the GVG was to vaporise FB, and that the point of leaf was to smoke using more standard devices, one would believe the GVG cannot reach the higher temperatures required by leaf. I feel like a joint is easier to manipulate and put down than a pipe, but I see your point on the fire hazard. I have a spoon pipe, I think I will use that.

Thanks Homo Trypens, that is exactly what I wanted to know, could you please just explain what you mean by wash? Also is Sodium Carbonate good to base? Would a purer extract present any considerable advantages?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

:lol: that's so much more than what is being infused into that I'm not sure that would even work at all.

Well, theoretically, that may be the case. My thinking was: if people put changa in a Silver Surfer vaporizer, then why not the GVG? So I gave it a try and find it pretty awesome. I give a few hard and quick pulls to quickly increase the heat in the chamber, and then have a consistent strong draw thereafter. The one thing is that it may not get all of the harmala content. All the same, due to ease, I use my bubbler more.

Wash is to rinse in order to lower the ph to a safe level for use.

Many teks use sodium carb. That should be fine. :)

One love
 
By wash, i mean rinsing the harmala freebase that's in the coffee filter, with distilled water or very weak sodcarb solution. If you think you have a lot of base contamination, you can even put it back in a glass, fill it with water, mix well, let it settle, and filter again to collect the washed freebase. You can repeat as many times as you want. Ideally until the water doesn't pick up color anymore and is near pH neutral (can cause some loss of yield).

It takes quite a lot of sodcarb to base. I'm not even sure if it's strong enough to base tea - it does work ok for basing after redissolving harmala HCl that was obtained in a Manske. I'd use sodium hydroxide or ammonia for basing the tea. Ammonia stinks but it evaporates, in case you don't wash well enough. Lye doesn't smell but is quite undesirable in your end product, so you have to make sure you wash well.

What i usually do starts out like i described, using lye for the base, but then redissolve the crude freebase, Manske once or twice, then convert the resulting HCl back to freebase using ammonia. That gives me near white freebase. I have used both crude and white, both for changa and oral, and tbh there wasn't really much difference in potency.
 
I see, so FB rue is not water soluble I suppose. I will use lye and wash thoroughly then, thanks for the inputs.

One last question, is Isopropyl Alcohol a good solvent to infuse the leaf with rue?
 
JackOutsideTheBox said:
I see, so FB rue is not water soluble I suppose. I will use lye and wash thoroughly then, thanks for the inputs.

One last question, is Isopropyl Alcohol a good solvent to infuse the leaf with rue?
Click to expand...

I used to use iso, but was directed towards information (that I presnetly cannot remember the specifics of) with regard to toxicity, I use everclear now.

One love

Edit:
HT said:
It takes quite a lot of sodcarb to base. I'm not even sure if it's strong enough to base tea - it does work ok for basing after redissolving harmala HCl that was obtained in a Manske.
Click to expand...

Very good to know thank you.
 
So I did as discussed, I did a few boils of a couple hours each on 150g of whole seeds, filtered, reduced all the boils together to more or less 1L and filtered again. I then added in a solution of 200ml of water and 20g of lye, the tea went milky tan and not long after the tan part started forming clumps, and the tea overall got a bit darker again, I let it settle overnight in the fridge and filtred again. I then mixed the resulting solids in a glass of water, filtered again and kept running water through the filter until it came out almost as clear as it came in, I should note that the liquids shone brighter than the solids under UV light. I then used heat to evaporate the leftover moisture and was left with 7.5g of a brown crystalline powder, so a 5% yield. I tried dissolving 1g of that powder in 40ml of iso with heat but it doesn’t seem to dissolve, and some white deposit that looks like limestone covered the walls of the container above the surface of the iso. I kept the based tea and the water from the washes to be able to retrieve the goods in case I made a mistake.

My questions are:
-Did I mess something up, such as basing too much?
-What could the white deposit be?
-Is there a reason why my supposed crude FB doesn’t dissolve into the iso?
 
Solubility of harmala bases in IPA is pretty poor, from what I gather. And if you used tap water you may have precipitated some calcium salts in any of several ways.

There are quite a few things the white deposit could be, you'd be best ascertaining some of its properties in numerous ways - does it melt more or less easily? Does it vaporise? Does It dissolve in acid, and if so, does it fizz? To name but a few.
 
What solvent should I use then? I can't find a clear consensus on that.

I used distilled water only.

There isn't so much that I could collect any to perform tests, it is a thin hard white layer on the walls of the glass, it seems to mix into iso.
 
From your description, it's likely just freebase harmalas depositing as the solvent evaporates from where it has stuck to the vessel walls, maybe also from the solvent absorbing moisture from the air reducing the solubility as well. Once you have dissolved the residue in the minimum of solvent, it can be added back to the changa blend. Rinse and repeat as necessary! Although, given the amount of residue, it might not even be worth the trouble.

If you have IPA and it works well enough then stick with that, as long as you don't need to use so much that the same deposit keeps occurring of course.
 
JackOutsideTheBox said:
Is there a reason why my supposed crude FB doesn’t dissolve into the iso?
Click to expand...

Thinking back, I am not sure that I've ever gotten any harmalas, extracted from rue or caapi, to fully disolve in whatever alcohol that I use to make my changa without having to use extra to get more to dissolve.

What I tend to do to remedy this is add more everclear (that's what I use), and let it sit with a lid on for several days, shaking occasionally. I will then open the lid of whatever jar I'm making my changa in to allow some of the alcohol to evaporate, then put the lid back on for a day. I continue this process, allowing there to be less residual haramala to be left on the vessel, until I'm ready to allow all of it to evaporate, leaving me with my changa infusion.

One love
 
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