Conflicting ideologies before our first venture into hyperspace

[psychonautshaman]

Me and my two best friends will be trying DMT for the first time in about a week. It was my idea to do so after reading tons of trip reports, watching The Spirit Molecule, and hanging out on some forums and other subreddits with discussions of peoples experiences on DMT. I understand that its a powerful drug not to be taken lightly and has the capability of giving a lot of insight as well as let you have an intense spiritual experience. Of my two friends, one is an agnostic and is somewhat nervous about trying it but refuses to read any trip reports or learn anything about it besides what I tell her. My other friend is an atheist and he's a little more excited but he also hasn't done much learning on his own about what to expect besides watching The Spirit Molecule. They are both adamant that they will just lay there and mumble and see pretty lights and have a short recreational break from the real world. How do I convince them to take this more seriously? We already plan to smoke about 60 mgs each out of the Machine one at a time, helping each other take the final hits. I volunteered to go first, hoping that my trip goes well and that whatever I tell them before their turn will get them in the proper mindset. Also how do I convince them to do a little research about what they put in their bodies? I think its irresponsible. How do I put the nervous friend's mind at ease?

 

[joedirt]

My advice is to NOT even consider doing 60mgs for your first time.

Why not try something a little more sensible like 20-25mgs... Make sure you get it all in one hit.

As for convincing your friends... Not everyone has a spiritual experience with these drugs... In fact it seems to be more likely that those of us we seek the spiritual have these sorts of experiences. Give them a reasonable dose and let them decide for themselves. Trust me if you get 20-25mgs in one hit you will have a PLENTY deep experience for your first plunge in. 60mgs... hell no. I've accidentally take close to 40mgs once and there was nothing fun about it. No fancy visions just a white void that I felt like I was trapped in for ages.. 10 minutes later I sat up in bed gasping for air and when I opened my eye's I was still tripping harder than I ever had in my entire life... reality was wrapping in and around itself is a ferocious manner...and this was 10 minutes AFTER i took the hit. I didn't come down to baseline for another 30. I hope to NEVER ever repeat that experience.

Be smart, be safe. Start low and work your way up. Be mindful of the method you use for vaporization and you won't need nearly as much spice as you think you do.

Lastly I would ignore the word 'break through'. Forget that completely. Just take the experience for what it is. Words and labels will never do it justice. If you try to compare your experience to someone else's 'break through' you will never be satisfied. If there is one thing DMT is. It is completely unique to each individual. There may be similarities in experience, but your visions will be yours and yours alone..

just my two cents.

 

[Felnik]

Sounds like a setup for a potentially bad time for quite a few reasons .
Personally I don't agree with this whole 3 giant hit approach to begin with but
That's just me .
Someone could get a real ass spanking with that much loaded in the thing I've seen
That happen on a few occasions and it's not pretty and not fun. Especially people
That are just half listening to you about what could happen .

The fact that your friends have low expectations and won't take it
Seriously puts you in a tricky position among other things .

Spirit molecule movie can be misleading as vaping straight dmt
Is tricky to dial in. It's not as cut and dried as the movie might suggest .
There is a learning curve .

First attempts can range from super weird and nauseating to crazy funny
To the most terrifying experience of a persons life .
To say there's a wide range is putting it mildly . Getting
The dose right for 3 people is difficult .

I have a couple of suggestions , one is skip the friends
And do it on your own , work up slowly under good set and setting .
I'm not a fan of group sessions .

The other is to have enough spice to start with and work gradually
Over a few sessions with your friends getting the feel of the stuff.
Another is to get some caapi leaf . I'm also not a fan of straight up dmt anymore .

And lastly drop all expectations, take it as it comes .
Study basic harm reduction on nexus there is plenty to read .
At the very least focus on harm reduction with friends like deep breathing
I suggest one person should be a sitter and not go while others are going .
A person completely zonked on spice can sometimes seem crazy and deranged
And can be a danger to themselves .i've seen that .
Good luck

 

[OneFive]

My first time wasnt what i expected, infact it was a whole bunch of fail.
If i was you, i'd try 10mg and see how it goes.
Also outdoors is the place to be.Going from zero to hero indoors can be a big scare and a shock.
:roll:

 

[ZeroSignal]

I can't add too much that hasn't been said so I'll keep this short. Fully agree with the lower dosage, and definitely recommend making some changa. It's just easier to handle, takes most of the hit or miss factor out if you've made it correctly and you can choose how far you'd like to go.

I'd drop all expectations about spirituality and ideologies. It's not going to be what you expect. Let the molecule take you where it decides, and hold on and enjoy the ride.
I think it's important to have respect for it, but if one is fearful, give it a miss. At least have them sit the first ride out and observe. Then relay what you felt and saw back to them.

Try to be in a quiet place free from distraction also. Turn off your phones and any nearby televisions, and don't play loud abrasive music.
Safe travels.

edit: Empty your bladders. Changa seems to make me need to urinate badly at the worst possible time. It's very hard to stand and walk when you're a million miles away.

 

[anrchy]

At least half the people I have dosed had no drive to do their own research. This is fine. Nothing that you can read or watch will explain anything about what you are about to experience so don't worry so much.

Afterwards if they don't want want to dose, or don't show as much enthusiasm as you don't push it. You seem like your on the path and this experience is truly a personal one. You can't expect others to join you.

I only have one friend you is interested in doing an extraction. Another that relies on me. A few that dose every once in awhile, and a few that dose once in a blue moon.

All others have not pursued anything further. Let then do it how they feel.

Also DO NOT dose that much. Start low, no reason to ever load 60mg. Been there, done that.

 

[Lotus Petals]

So I'm getting that 60 Mg is never good for first time. Is it ever ok? What if I don't want a mild trip? My aim was 50 but now I'm second guessing.

 

[cyb]

So I'm getting that 60 Mg is never good for first time. Is it ever ok? What if I don't want a mild trip? My aim was 50 but now I'm second guessing.

20mg (vaped correctly in one hit and held till it's gone) should take you far and beyond and will certainly not be mild. IMO, there is never a time when 60 is appropriate, unless you are wasting it due to poor vape technique.
It's not about dose size, it's about getting the right amount into your bloodstream in one hit to cross the blood/brain barrier with enough power to do the deed, before your natural inhibitors negate the effect.

 

[Hiyo Quicksilver]

If folks just think they're in for pretty lights, I've learned to let them go their way without. There are some times when the mindset and situation is right, and the experience will deliver exactly what is needed (whether comprehensible or not)... There are others where it simply is the case that using DMT on that brain in particular is a waste of what the substance truly has to offer. There is generally no doubt when it really is appropriate to use.
For somebody who extracts, explores and/or studies DMT, it is often a very sincere honor and responsibility to introduce another to the substance, especially when one is very familiar with its personally powerful nature. The part of this most worth consideration, in my experience, is whether or not it should happen in the first place.

 

[waitwhatwhere]

I can't add too much that hasn't been said so I'll keep this short. Fully agree with the lower dosage, and definitely recommend making some changa. It's just easier to handle, takes most of the hit or miss factor out if you've made it correctly and you can choose how far you'd like to go.

I'd drop all expectations about spirituality and ideologies. It's not going to be what you expect. Let the molecule take you where it decides, and hold on and enjoy the ride.
I think it's important to have respect for it, but if one is fearful, give it a miss. At least have them sit the first ride out and observe. Then relay what you felt and saw back to them.

Try to be in a quiet place free from distraction also. Turn off your phones and any nearby televisions, and don't play loud abrasive music.
Safe travels.

edit: Empty your bladders. Changa seems to make me need to urinate badly at the worst possible time. It's very hard to stand and walk when you're a million miles away.

This is good advice. While a profound experience on indole alkaloids is a common occurrence, "profound" means different things to different people. Paul Krassner once related a story about a stock broker calling him in the middle of the night, elated, because LSD had given him the courage to sell short. To minimize his experience is to invalidate his perspective, similar to religious institutions persecuting heretics for not sticking with the program.