Enterohepatic peak timing?

[Elrik]

I'm sure many of you have had delayed peaks.
For me the typical pattern is a peak is less potent that it should have been then after the peak should be concluded I eat an apple core minus the seeds, sweet ginger, or I vomit and at T+3 to T+5 hours I suddenly have a second peak. Its widely hypothesized that the DMT gets stuck in the bile until its released and absorbed.
Today when trimming peyote and nibbling the extra fragments I had that rumbling in the gut that bitter cactus often triggers and I had the idea of eating a very small button or a dried Trichocereus chip on my next pharmahuasca trip as a preemptive measure to get any DMT containing bile released at the right moment to prevent potentially wasteful or awkward delays.
The question is, when would that optimal moment be?
If I vomit at +1:00 it reduces the strength of the trip so clearly its not all absorbed by then, if I vomit at +1:30 it doesnt seem to appreciably reduce the trip. Also, I start to glide up toward peak right around +1:30. So I'm thinking an hour and a half post-DMT would be the earliest to preemptively trigger bile release. I'm wondering if the effect would be more dramatic if waiting until +2:00, though.
Has anyone played with this variable? Do you try to trigger gut action just before peak, at the start of a peak, or the middle?
Has anyone used peyote to do it? Does that work noticeably better than ginger?

 

[Jagube]

I have food when I'm 1.5 - 2 hours in and it still hasn't come on.

One thing I wonder is how the potential return of the MAO affects it. Eating too late doesn't work, which would seem to suggest that the DMT 'activated' by the food is still subject to MAO.

 

[Elrik]

Yeah, thats half the reason I'm thinking about this- after some time the DMT is either metabolized where its stored or metabolized as its being reabsorbed/released.
From what I've seen the delayed peak has started to diminish compared to what it should be at 3 hours in. I've had second peaks triggered by food at 5 hours but they are always very short, no matter how potent.
I've almost never took food before the peak because its just not an appetizing thought so soon after nausea ends, not to mention the technical difficulty in operating an apple at that time
I have a fresh 2 gram peyote button and a strip of sweet ginger waiting for ~T+1:45

 

[Jagube]

What I would also like to know is whether there are ways to diminish this 'DMT storage' effect. Clearly it doesn't always happen, sometimes it just comes on fully, while other times I feel nothing until I eat. I'm guessing the state of the GI tract at the time of ingestion (how long fasted for, which parts of it have food and what kind of food) must be a major factor.

I prefer a protocol that doesn't involve food. Typically in group tea ceremonies you have 2-3 servings of tea and no food. If I eat after the 1st glass to bring it on, then my 2nd glass won't be on an empty stomach.

However, it seems that redosing can sometimes have a similar effect to food. I've noticed that especially with a particular batch of thick, oily Caapi tea that I have and didn't make myself.
Also the fact that the 2nd glass only takes ~30 minutes to come on, as opposed to the 1st glass which takes more like an hour (if it comes on at all), may suggest that the tea itself somehow triggers digestion or helps the previously ingested tea move along, and I would think that thick, crude teas work better in that regard than purified alkaloid solutions, but this has yet to be tested.

 

[Elrik]

Thats an interesting suggestion that it may be influenced by what is already in the GI tract before dosing.
I dont always get delayed or dual onset but it is common, and I have always dosed after fasting for around 19 hours [I prefer to do all drugs in a fasted state, even coffee. If I ever need to loose weight it would be as easy as a bottle of 80mg mescaline pills :lol: ]
I could try breaking that habit with DMT by consuming a banana and some juice or a spoon of honey an hour or two before dosing. I know from multiple day fasts that unsweetened black decaf coffee wont take me out of fasting mode, but a banana and juice sure will!

Last night I played with THH dose and timing [100mg at T-2:00 and 100mg at T-1:00 so I would go into a THH peak as I was dosing the DMT and again as peaking on the DMT] and a DMT peak hit me fast at 60 minutes. I managed a piece of sweet ginger at +1:30 and some strawberries at +2:00 and went into a strong second peak around +3:00. I think it took my body that long to come out of fasting mode. The same happens with mescaline, if I eat an apple too early in the trip it can give me a stomach ache and take an hour or two to start digesting. So it follows that one option would be to just not be in fasting state before dosing.