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I didn’t go back to look, but I think most of the quotes you’ve taken were comments I directed at posts from other members (Saidin in particular) and they’re now out of context. Anyhow…

To choose for no reason is to choose at random. Just another way of saying it. An even more precise way of saying it is “choosing for something that is not a reason”.

It’s like asserting the existence of a shape that is not a circle - not asserting the existence of a square circle.

This notion of choice extends beyond biological systems, and even beyond physical systems, but for simplicity, lets look at biological systems.

In your everyday life, do you ever violate physical laws?

If you answer yes, then I’d like to know how.
If the answer is no, then how is anything you do, including thinking, making choices, and acting on those choices free?

Your brain is not free to violate physical laws. Everything it does, conforms to physical laws. All thoughts, choices, actions, are products of extremely long and complex sequences of neural and other biological activity, none of which “you” control.

Imagine a causal chain that begins with photons entering your eyes and striking your retinas, signals traveling to your visual cortex and other regions, and after astoundingly complex neural and biological activity, signals being sent to your muscles causing your body to jump out of the way from an oncoming car.

From the moment those photons entered your eye to the moment you jump, were any physical laws violated? If yes, explain. If no, then explain how free will is involved.

“Choosing for no reason” could be phrased as “choosing for something that is not a reason” or “choosing at random”. So tautologically, we have “choosing for a reason or choosing for something that is not a reason”.
Your gravity example would be tautologically phrased as “we fall due to gravity or we fall due to something that is not gravity”.

A choice is not “a choice + a reason for a choice”. I’m not even sure what that means.

A choice is the satisfaction of certain conditions which is typically followed by an action dependent on the choice. Here’s a simple “computer code” example:

if (x>5) n=n+1;

The condition is (x>5). If the condition is satisfied, then the choice is made to perform the action n=n+1. If the condition is not satisfied, then the choice is made to do nothing (to take no action).

<blockquote data-quote="gibran2" data-source="post: 3354147" data-attributes="member: 4390">I didn’t go back to look, but I think most of the quotes you’ve taken were comments I directed at posts from other members (Saidin in particular) and they’re now out of context. Anyhow…To choose for no reason is to choose at random. Just another way of saying it. An even more precise way of saying it is “choosing for something that is not a reason”.It’s like asserting the existence of a shape that is not a circle - not asserting the existence of a square circle.This notion of choice extends beyond biological systems, and even beyond physical systems, but for simplicity, lets look at biological systems.In your everyday life, do you ever violate physical laws?If you answer yes, then I’d like to know how.If the answer is no, then how is anything you do, including thinking, making choices, and acting on those choices free?Your brain is not free to violate physical laws. Everything it does, conforms to physical laws. All thoughts, choices, actions, are products of extremely long and complex sequences of neural and other biological activity, none of which “you” control.Imagine a causal chain that begins with photons entering your eyes and striking your retinas, signals traveling to your visual cortex and other regions, and after astoundingly complex neural and biological activity, signals being sent to your muscles causing your body to jump out of the way from an oncoming car.From the moment those photons entered your eye to the moment you jump, were any physical laws violated? If yes, explain. If no, then explain how free will is involved.“Choosing for no reason” could be phrased as “choosing for something that is not a reason” or “choosing at random”.&nbsp; So tautologically, we have “choosing for a reason or choosing for something that is not a reason”.Your gravity example would be tautologically phrased as “we fall due to gravity or we fall due to something that is not gravity”.A choice is not “a choice + a reason for a choice”. I’m not even sure what that means.A choice is the satisfaction of certain conditions which is typically followed by an action dependent on the choice. Here’s a simple “computer code” example:if (x&gt;5) n=n+1;The condition is (x&gt;5). If the condition is satisfied, then the choice is made to perform the action n=n+1. If the condition is not satisfied, then the choice is made to do nothing (to take no action).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="gibran2, post: 3354147, member: 4390"] I didn’t go back to look, but I think most of the quotes you’ve taken were comments I directed at posts from other members (Saidin in particular) and they’re now out of context. Anyhow… To choose for no reason is to choose at random. Just another way of saying it. An even more precise way of saying it is “choosing for something that is not a reason”. It’s like asserting the existence of a shape that is not a circle - not asserting the existence of a square circle. This notion of choice extends beyond biological systems, and even beyond physical systems, but for simplicity, lets look at biological systems. In your everyday life, do you ever violate physical laws? If you answer yes, then I’d like to know how. If the answer is no, then how is anything you do, including thinking, making choices, and acting on those choices free? Your brain is not free to violate physical laws. [b]Everything[/b] it does, conforms to physical laws. All thoughts, choices, actions, are products of extremely long and complex sequences of neural and other biological activity, none of which “you” control. Imagine a causal chain that begins with photons entering your eyes and striking your retinas, signals traveling to your visual cortex and other regions, and after astoundingly complex neural and biological activity, signals being sent to your muscles causing your body to jump out of the way from an oncoming car. From the moment those photons entered your eye to the moment you jump, were any physical laws violated? If yes, explain. If no, then explain how free will is involved. “Choosing for no reason” could be phrased as “choosing for something that is not a reason” or “choosing at random”. So tautologically, we have “choosing for a reason or choosing for something that is not a reason”. Your gravity example would be tautologically phrased as “we fall due to gravity or we fall due to something that is not gravity”. A choice is not “a choice + a reason for a choice”. I’m not even sure what that means. A choice is the satisfaction of certain conditions which is typically followed by an action dependent on the choice. Here’s a simple “computer code” example: if (x>5) n=n+1; The condition is (x>5). If the condition is satisfied, then the choice is made to perform the action n=n+1. If the condition is not satisfied, then the choice is made to do nothing (to take no action). [/QUOTE]