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Harmala+LSA warning

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A warning about combining harmala alkaloids and morning glory seeds or extracts, including HBWR.

Some of the alkaloids in Ipomoea species seeds can be agonists of TAAR1, there is some evidence to suggest that combining harmala alkaloids and TAAR1 agonists can result in hypertension and hyperthermia. To put it simply, they can increase blood pressure and body temperature in dangerous ways.

Some people have recently proposed this combination of Ipomoea alkaloids and harmala alkaloids. This is potentially unsafe and may endanger users. Ipomoea alkaloids themselves are notorious for their ability to raise blood pressure and their ingestion alone may pose risks to individuals with hypertension.

Incidentally, I believe that 5-meo-DMT is a potent TAAR1 agonist and the combination of it with harmalas has been known to cause hyperthermia and hypertension and has been reported to be a potentially fatal combination. I suspect very similar risks exist for certain ergot alkaloids that are found in some Ipomoea species.

Please avoid this combination, it is not well tested and is not known to be traditionally used by any culture.
 
Regular nn-DMT is also a TAAR1 agonist, as is Tryptamine itself, both of which seem safe in combination with Harmalas. Personally i've taken Tryptophan (up to 1 gram) an hour into heavy doses of Harmalas, and with the aid of vitamin B6 for the DOPA Decarboxylase (AADC) function was able to turn Tryptophan into Tryptamine and orally activate it via MAO-A inhibition, could definitely feel the TAAR1 agonism, had a similar feeling to DMT in that regard, but Tryptamine also has some Serotonin 4 agonism as well iirc which can release Acetylcholine apparently and yeah ime at 750mgs to 1 gram Tryptamine was definitely Cholinergic, but at 250 to 500mgs i could feel it's TAAR1 agonism. The only thing about TAAR1 agonism is that it can apparently increase Noradrenaline and Dopamine, from what i've read, and that could potentially lead to some temporary heightened blood pressure but it really shouldn't be any more so than what DMT would do, plus DMT has other actions like at Alpha Adrenergic 1A and Alpha Adrenergic 2A receptors, so DMT may be more likely to cause a rise in blood pressure compared to say Tryptamine for example. But as far as LSA goes, i can't speak to that, but i don't think TAAR1 agonism in general is an issue, since DMT also is a TAAR1 agonist which i've definitely felt many times, as far as i know many trace amines target the trace amine associated receptors (TAARs).
 
Sabnock1990 said:
Regular nn-DMT is also a TAAR1 agonist, as is Tryptamine itself, both of which seem safe in combination with Harmalas.
Click to expand...
Nearly all psychedelics have some agonistic effects at TAAR1.
As the affinity for the receptor increases, so too do the hypertensive and hyperthermic effects.
It is unwise to combine potent TAAR1 agonists, like amphetamines, with harmala alkaloids.

There is no problem combining mild TAAR1 agonists with Harmala alkaloids.
 
I admit, I am speculating here on the side of saftey, but with chemistry and pharmacology indicating that my speculation is not unsupported or unreasonable given currently available knowledge.

In terms of this, TAAR1 has been considered an amphetamine receptor, it has a very high affinity for things like amphetamines. Many of the things that act as agonists at it cross the brain blood barrier poorly and or are rapidly metabolized by monoamine oxidase. However it is well known that combining potent TAAR1 agonists like MDMA and various amphetamines with harmala alkaloids is unsafe. This may not actually be due to the TAAR1 agonism, but it might be and it is wise to err on the side of caution.
 
I would say in MDMA's case that likely has more to do with it's Serotonin reuptake and releasing properties. As for Amphetamine itself, idk, i've come across a couple or so people who apparently have done it, but i haven't taken Amphetamine in a long time so i wouldn't know. I have taken things like Methylphenidate, Isopropylphenidate, and L-Dopa alongside Harmalas though with no negative interactions noticed. I do think Noradrenaline can get a bit out of hand, maybe, if one isn't careful about it, but i don't see increased Noradrenaline in itself as being inherently bad, even with reversible MAO-A inhibition. As far as Harmalas go i'm mainly just concerned about things that increase Sertotonin too much, as i've had Serotonin Syndrome before in the past back when i was on SSRI's which thankfully i was off of because Aya came around. Dopamine on the contrary doesn't seem to be any issue that i've been able to tell, which iirc i think it's said L-Dopa and Dopamine are also TAAR1 agonists. Not saying potent TAAR1 agonists couldn't possibly have some issue but so far i personally haven't noticed an issue, but i will definitely be on the look out.
 
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