Harmalas fumarates

[karloff]

Hi nexians!

recently, I finished my first extraction from peganum harmala seeds (100 gr. seeds gave me almost 3 gr. of quite pure alkaloids).

Now, I want to convert part of those freebases into fumarates, to use them in pharmahuasca. I have successfully done this process previously with DMT. I made the calculations taking into acount that fumaric acid is a diprotic acid (2 mol dmt combine with 1 mol fumaric) and then using the molar masses to calculate the final proportions.

My question is: can I use the same logic to calculate the proportions with harmalas? Specifically, I am not sure if I can assume that fumaric acid behaves as diprotic also with harmalas.
If this is so, these are the calculations I will do:

Harmine molar mass: 212.25
Harmaline molar mass: 214.263
Fumaric acid molar mass: 116.07

Since I don't know what the actual ratio of harmine/armaline is in my freebases, I will use the average molar mass of both (fortunately their values are very close): 213.16

Then, if I want to convert 1 gr. of freebases to fumarates, I calculate how much fumaric acid I need:

116.07 / (213.16 * 2) = 0.272 gr = 272 mg. of fumaric acid

Are these calculations correct?
Thanks in advance!

 

[pitubo]

You don't need harmala fumarates for pharmahuasca, really. The yellow crystals you get from NaCl salting (the Manske procedure) are hydrochloride salts and these are as good as fumarates.

In fact you can use both harmala freebase and dmt freebase for pharmahuasca preparations: simply dissolve the freebases in just enough dilute food grade acid, such as vinegar or citric acid.

 

[karloff]

Yes, I know, but I want the fumarates to ensure good long term storage, since I think they are more stable. And, of course, this will allow me to use them straight in pharmahuasca whenever I want.

 

[Sabnock1990]

I just use freebase Rue extract and it works fine. Doesn't degrade, easy to fill up a capsule and weigh out a dose, can be taken orally or smoked, works everytime. I also use ground Rue seed in capsules from time to time.

 

[karloff]

hmmm... that's interesting. Is it possible that harmalas are as good in freebase form as in salt form, for storage and for consumption? I was thinking the opposite, but that was extrapolating what happens with DMT and other indoles.

 

[pitubo]

The HCl salts of harmine and harmaline are very stable. I have stored them for many years without any signs of degradation. Freebase harmalas kept in a plastic ziploc bag tend to slowly become a bit reddish after a while.

 

[karloff]

So, what I could do is to dissolve the freebase alkaloids in hot acidified water and then manske with salt like I did in the extraction process.
My only concern is how can I wash it to eliminate all the excess of salt. This was not a problem while extracting because I did the basification after each manske, but now I am not sure how to proceed to obtain clean Hcl product.

 

[pitubo]

Use no more than 100 grams salt per liter. After filtering the crystals, press the filter cake repeatedly between paper towels. The paper absorbs the salty liquid. When pressing no longer pulls moisture, you can weigh the cake at that stage and compare the weight when fully dried. The difference is evaporated residual moisture, of which approximately 10% was salt that did not evaporate and is still left in the dry cake.

 

[karloff]

Clever idea! I will do that for sure, so I will know if there is too much salt there. Many thanks.