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Help me use as little hexane as possible

Migrated topic.
anonhippie

anonhippie

Rising Star
Here is a hypothetical tek that I would appreciate some feedback on.

Goals:
* As little evaporation and boiling as possible. I live in a place with 100% humidity. I also need to keep smells down.
* As food grade ingredients as possible. This will take place in a kitchen, and we like to cook all of our meals.
* Quick filtering steps. Vacuum source is loud and can't run it for too long.
* Clean product. End goal is to smoke it.
* Possibly reusable hexane. Even though its not expensive it comes in a 90ml pharmaceutical grade bottle and I don't want to make too many trips to the pharmacy to get tons of it.
* Process should take place over several sessions not consisting of more than 2 hours of work. Between sessions there can be long periods of mostly passive work.
* Good yield.

Ingredients:
100g MHRB
300ml + 200ml Veggie Oil
1L + 200ml + 300ml + 200ml Distilled Water
300ml + 100ml 6% White Vinegar
100g + 20g + 20g Sodium Carbonate
90ml Hexane

Equipment:
Pressure cooker
1L container
2 1.5L container
Precip container
30ml erlanmeyer flask
250 erlanmeyer flask to prepare washes
500ml Separatory funnel
600ml Beaker to hold water during pulls
Buchner funnel, vacuum source, medium lab filter papers, coffee filters
PH Strips
Fridge + Freezer

Steps:

Session 1:
1. Place 333ml water + 100ml vinegar in pressure cooker with MHRB. Stir and close pressure cooker. Cook for 30 minutes. Repeat for a total of 3 pulls.
2. Place pulls in 1L container and put in fridge for 1 week.

Session 2:
3. Filter 1L acidic pulls with filter setup, placing coffee filters on top to avoid early clogging. Place in 1.5L container.
4. Basify with 100g sodium carbonate. Confirm PH reaches 11. Add 100ml oil. Swirl and shake over several days. Pour off oil (some water coming with is ok) into other 1.5L container). Repeat for total of 3 pulls.

Session 3:
5. Separate the oil completely from the water with separatory funnel. Then wash the oil with 200ml water + 20g sodium carbonate in two separate washes.
6. Heat up 300ml + 100ml white vinegar. Add this to the separatory funnel 100ml at a time for a total of 4 pulls to retrieve DMT from the oil. Wash the vinegar pulls with 200ml clean oil across 2 separate pulls.

Session 4:
7. Basify acidic solution with sodium carbonate.
8. Heat up 30ml hexane at a time in a double boiler setup. Add to solution in separatory funnel, swirl for 10 minutes and then separate. Total of 3 pulls.
9. Clean hexane with two pulls of sodium bicarbonate wash 20g and 200ml water.
10. Add hexane to precip container, close lid and put in freezer overnight.
11. Decant hexane from crystals and let any remaining hexane on crystals evap off before scrapping up product.

Questions:
1. Where could this go wrong?
2. Where might this tek spend too much time?
3. Where might this tek not spend enough time?
4. Alternative tek with nearly same ingredients (and the quantity available)?
5. Do the ratios seem right? Could I extract from more MHRB powder while still keeping the other ingredient amounts constant?

Thank you in advance for your considerations and feedback!

Edit: Changed subject from "BLAB with Veggie Oil and a Hexane Cleanup" so anyone trying to get help with veggie oil teks doesn't go searching through here, there's nothing helpful here on that subject. This post was just me trying to get around some material constraints.
 
anonhippie said:
7. Heat up 30ml hexane at a time in a double boiler setup. Add to acidic solution in separatory funnel, swirl for 10 minutes and then separate. Total of 3 pulls.
Click to expand...

DMT acetate is not soluble in Hexane, so I don't see this step working. You would need to base again with Sodium Carbonate and then pull.

The amount of cleanup steps seem unnecessary. You could even go without any cleanup steps as a full spectrum extract might be desirable.

If you wanted a simple, foodsafe, and quick tek why dont you just follow q21q21's tek and use veggie oil instead of limonene (and perhaps sodium carbonate instead of calcium hydroxide).
 
DMT acetate is not soluble in Hexane, so I don't see this step working. You would need to base again with Sodium Carbonate and then pull.
Click to expand...

ROFL I knew that. Fixed!

The amount of cleanup steps seem unnecessary. You could even go without any cleanup steps as a full spectrum extract might be desirable.
Click to expand...

Yeah I agree, thats great feedback. On the point of "full spectrum" though, is that not a myth? IE jimjam is just DMT + oils. Which is pretty undesirable for a smokable product. Especially if one were to put it in an ecig.

If you wanted a simple, foodsafe, and quick tek why dont you just follow q21q21's tek and use veggie oil instead of limonene (and perhaps sodium carbonate instead of calcium hydroxide).
Click to expand...

I assume you mean tek 1, the jimjam party? Well, these teks are all really the same IMHO. That said SWIM is looking to refine particular steps for an easier and cleaner extraction. One major difference with the jimjam party is the use of slurry rather than aqueous solutions. Slurrys cannot be filtered. Which means you can't remove waxes before pulling with NPS. Also you cannot cleanly separate the water + solid part of the slurry away from the NPS.

That being said I would be VERY interested in finding reports of the Q21Q21 tek using veggie oil. I've done some searching but haven't turned anything up.
 
anonhippie said:
On the point of "full spectrum" though, is that not a myth? IE jimjam is just DMT + oils.
Click to expand...

Here is an in depth thread which says a bit about this topic.

anonhippie said:
Which is pretty undesirable for a smokable product. Especially if one were to put it in an ecig.
Click to expand...

I have read on the nexus that oils can protect the DMT from burning and therefore might make the smoke less harsh and the experience stronger.

Do you plan on using the e-mesh setup or mixing your DMT with e-juice? I have personally tried the e-juice method with strong ratios and for some reason struggled to get desirable results. It seems some have success but a decent amount have similar experiences to me. A method which I have not tried but which will be my next ROA is the direct e-mesh setup as it seems from user reports to be very effective.

anonhippie said:
One major difference with the jimjam party is the use of slurry rather than aqueous solutions. Slurrys cannot be filtered. Which means you can't remove waxes before pulling with NPS. Also you cannot cleanly separate the water + solid part of the slurry away from the NPS.
Click to expand...
I personally did not find pouring the solvent off without any solid chunks coming along too hard. I think it highly depends on what consistency you have. As for the waxes, MH is not very high in fats. How do you remove these before pulling with NPS in an aqueous solution? If you do a defat this can also be done in a dry tek. Anyways when using veggie oil regardless if it is an aqueous solution or not it is going to pull a fair bit of gunk.

One last thing to note of your tek is you may run into issues with emulsions as sodium carbonate is not a very strong base and this makes it harder for solutions to seperate (especially veggie oil with such a high viscocity). I don't however have experience with sodium carb and veggie oil so this so this is purely based on what I have read. It might be another reason to go for a dry tek in which you used sodium carb as your base.
 
Thanks for the link to the jimjam guide!

For an ROA SWIM just had a failed experiment with reusing pax era carts. The cannabis oil left in the wick was enough to color the trip too much, and seemed to absorb some material from the ejuice, making the last half that was left over too weak to cause much of an effect.

Also used the sublingual "mouthwash" method with some crude harmalas HCL extract to make the effects longer for a longer smoking time.

Previously SWIM was using a much bigger tank style e-cig probably going keep doing that for a while, as some good effects were obtained. Probably with some Harmalas break through could be possible.

SWIM has a vapor genie with some e-mesh, but honestly feels uncomfortable using it in his house... seems to extreme. Likes to keep things a bit more down-low.

So SWIM has been thinking about the next extraction a lot and is thinking of something much simpler:

1. Vinegar pressure cook 300g MHRB with 3L water.
2. Intermediate filtering with almond milk filter bag
3. Reduce to ~800ml (1-3 will be performed together over 2 hours hopefully)
4. Put in fridge to settle for a couple of days.
5. Vacuum filter.
6. Base with NaOH.
7. 5 pulls of 90ml hexane (using 180 ml hexane total)
7.a) each pull over a day with no heating, just a lot of shaking
7.b) pull goes into fridge and last pull gets reused on
8. (optional) re-x with hexane for cleanup if necessary.
 
If you are new to extracting dmt, keep it simple and effective. I reccomend a standard A/B: powder your bark, 3x acetic boils, collect and reduce. Base with NaOH using 1/4 weight of bark in lye (25 grams to base tea made from 100 grams bark). Before basing make sure solution fits in 1L glass bottle with secure lid (a juice bottle works well, an Erlenmeyer with rubber stopper is my gear of choice) with room for solvent. Pull using VM&P Naphtha, I use 75 to 100 ml pulls at a time. Freezer. Collect. Smoalk. Become reborn.
 
Yeah A/B seems like the way to go. Did Endlessness's Ethanol tek, Nomans and now a "mostly cold" A/B on the same source material, and got the highest yield from the A/B (.8% vs .5% for the other two) I thought I just had really bad bark but maybe the technique was lacking.

By "mostly cold" I mean I did 3 citric acid pulls (50g acid, 1L water) on 150g MHRB. These were done room temp over several days each with lots of shaking. Once separated it was allowed to settle and then filtered with a vacuum filter.

I then tried to reduce (by boiling) the 3 liters into 1L. This started causing lots of foaming. Later I added back more water to get about 1.5L.

I then based with NaOH until PH strips read 13. This seemed to take a long time and a lot of NaOH, presumably because I used so much citric acid. Then I pulled with 90ml hexane at room temp. It was clean enough I could shake a little bit throughout several days without building up an emulsion. However I recently got a magnetic stirrer and after leaving a last pull on all night I got significant no separation issues I resolved with more water and NaOH (and as a side effect heat).

My Hexane looks super clean still and I think I can reuse it several more times, a big win for me. Except for issues caused by too much reducing and too much acid, it was pretty low effort. The product itself looks excellent, super white and bigger crystals than I've gotten before. This took weeks but I don't mind as most steps where just little chores that I could use to help break up the boredom of lockdown.

Next time I'm thinking about no reducing and increasing the source material but lowering water and citric acid so that each water pull just covers the source material. Since I have the vacuum filter I can remove the powder from the water easily.

Then rather than combining the acid pulls I'll base and pull them separately. They should fit in my separatory funnel then so more efficiency in terms of separation and therefore yield. Also I'll be able to tell when I need to stop pulling from the source material by doing each pull separately.

This forum has been such an amazing resource, thank you everyone who replied here and also to so many others who have posted on the nexus throughout the years. It's great to have "standard" teks to compare to, and then enough knowledge and help to develop a personal tek that works given the resources available.
 
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