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I'm Quite Afraid To Try Again...

A

Angel_Above

Rising Star
And it sucks, because I have over 4 grams haha.

It all started yesterday. I did a bad, bad thing... I smoked DMT at 2 in the morning, and unknown amount that I just loaded up into my lightbulb and took the biggest hit I could, I did it with everyone home, and alone in my room.

Well, the alone part isn't too bad. But the setting could not have been more spontaneous. Just kind of "felt" like I should do what I did.

After I did, I feel like the DMT entities targeted me. I feel victimized. I kept seeing human people that I've known my whole life (family members, friends, etc.) but then I started seeing people I didn't know and they were mocking me.

I go into these experiences to reinforce my beliefs or to completely shatter them, and allow me to accept a new view of this universe.

They were saying such bad things though. I really can't repeat what they said because you guys would be like "wow..." and I would feel weird telling you.

Just know they're very, very horrible things.

There was nothing blissful about this experience. I kind of think it was a set/setting problem, but what if it wasn't? What if I angered the DMT entities and they never want me to return?

THere was one moment where I was sick of being targeted, and I took a deep breath in, and all of it seemingly went away. It came back as this wall that was moving in all directions; in and out, left and right, up and down, etc.

OTher than that, there was nothing good about this experience, and I feel I can't learn anything from it.



I'm quite scared to go back into the realm. I took another hit about 20 minutes after the first, and that trip was much milder.

I just don't get why the trip ended up so bad. Maybe it felt I don't respect it? Idk.

I do respect these entheogens, very much.
 
First of all, keep returning. Do not let the irrational fear from a bad journey scare you off. You did well with blasting off again 20 minutes later. Blast off again sometime soon, when you've been thinking about this journey.

This might have been because of your setting and/or maybe you smoked too much? Or this may be something within you that got up to the surface. You said you felt victimized, they were mocking you, saying bad things. Do you love yourself brother? How is your self esteem? Have you had problems with being victimized and mocked in the past? Do you feel victimized in general? Maybe this experience tells you that this is an aspect of your life you should take a more careful look at. Or maybe it simply says that you must continue your use more thoughtfully and carefully. Whatever you do I urge you to not fear, but to return and keep working with this. Listen and look closer.

And do not say that there is nothing to learn from this, because I really think it is.

Good luck to you, may peace and love find your being. Stay safe and don't fear =)
 
I've been a bit depressed lately, figure it's best to accept that than deny it.

I like your thinking.

I remember one point where they were saying I was dumb for thinking spirituality can be seen or experienced on psychedelics in general, but maybe it was, in fact, my ego trying to sway me away from what's real?


There was one moment in the trip where I felt like my ego was targeting me, and maybe it ALL stemmed from that.


I wonder, can one smoke too much DMT? I feel like I can return once I'm a little better, but I think tonight might be a good night because NO ONE will be home and I can focus on meditating for a good amount of time before the experience, perhaps come up with a good intention of exactly why I want to do it.

I feel like right after I exhaled I said this "I have no intention, Idk why I'm here"

That's probably what did it....

It's really weird though, it felt as if I was just watching a bunch of people that I knew just living their life.

I gotta stop using the word "weird" when I describe DMT trips... that's what it's known for!
 
Angel_Above said:
OTher than that, there was nothing good about this experience, and I feel I can't learn anything from it.
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Hi Angel_Above,

Hang in there soulmate! I understand about the nothng good part but are you positive there is nothing to be learned? Even about yourself? Sometimes it takes some processing/integrating time.

I really feel you, as DMT gave me religon and is my sacrament but I am so very fearful. I got my ass KICKED AGAIN:cry: last night. Seven to eight attempts in just a few more days of trying to face my fear and get through my blocks/resistances. Still not there yet.

I am going to take some time off from vaping spice. I have to. Otherwise I will never be able to do it again. I have dug myself a deep mental grave and it will take a lot of processing and work to get out of it so that I may successfully "die" again.

DMT is so very complex and constantly challenging. It is also good at letting us know when we should take a break - all psychedelics seem to be self-limiting in this respect. I like to think I can take a hint but I have now been repeatedly slapped in the face with a blunt object (metaphorically).

I really, really do feel where you are coming from. But, please meditate/think on this some more. I honestly do not think that either you or I have done anything to anger the DMT entities. But, we may both share something deep in our psyches related to mental set issues (resistance, acceptance, surrender, control, . . ?) that are setting us up for negative-energy encounters. Just speculation. The entities love you and are always glad when you arrive - now the party/play/lessons/exams/journeys can truly get started; your head full of DMT molecules is as much a hyperdimensional gateway to them as it is to you! You were not truly dead - you were tripping on DMT. Thus, though likely disconnected from your body, I suspect it's chemistry and mental states were having an effect on your "soul" in hyperspace.

Also, on the slim chance we have somehow angered the hyperdimensional entities, please consider this: It is all forgiven and forgotten. Hyperspace is not a realm of petty human concerns and emotions - it is much more energetic and beyond things like life and death. Time works so, so differently in there. Let a few days pass out here (in my experience) and things have progressed so much as to have completely changed - the appearance, colors, geometry and even culture of the entities.

I do not know the solution to fear, but I do know that a lot of the breakthrough/hyperspace content is still getting "filtered" through our still-living bodies, whether we are aware of it or not. Is your body in pain? Malfunctioning? Ill? How about your mind, which is mediated through the physical body substrate of your brain? All super important factors in my book.

For me, I am giving vaporization a break but continuing with pharma. But, I will ensure that my break is not too long even if I have to puke and shit ten times before I hit, my teeth are chattering in 90 degrees and my hand is shaking so hard I can barely aim the torch (Yeah, there's a sorry-ass precedent here.).

Good luck to you.

Peace & Love,
Pandora
 
"I remember one point where they were saying I was dumb for thinking spirituality can be seen or experienced on psychedelics in general"

Perhaps all that really means is you have some work here in this world to do, along with your work with spice. DMT is like a light bulb..it shows you things..but it wont simply fix everything for you..it can show you where YOU can do some work to improve things..

You dont just take DMT and all of a sudden you are buddha...you might feel that way for abit though..but even if you think you need to try to be buddha than there is work to do there..each one of us is a shining light already..once you see that you realize that things like fear are pointless..

Psychedelics can make you more spiritually aware..the hard part is integrating that into your life and acting upon it..making the changes in your life that allign with the paradigms found within psychedelic revelation.

I have come out of entheogenic experiences feeling like I all I got was a taste of my own medicine, and it tasted like shit. Noone is perfect compared to anyone else..everyone is what they should be and that is what is important..psychedelics can teach us that..but they can also help to illuminate our individual paths here on planet earth and show us how there is always work to be done.
 
Angel_Above said:
I wonder, can one smoke too much DMT? I feel like I can return once I'm a little better, but I think tonight might be a good night because NO ONE will be home and I can focus on meditating for a good amount of time before the experience, perhaps come up with a good intention of exactly why I want to do it.
/quote]

Angel_Above,

Citta's post was right on the money and I admired your reply.

I do not believe it is possible to OD on vaporized DMT physically. Of course, if you are already at a toxic level of hypertension or heart disease all bets are off. Otherwise, I strongly suspect that even if you filled the entire bulb of a crack pipe (what would that be? between half and a gram at least?), you would launch or loose consciousness before you absorbed a physically toxic dose.

But, of course, most psychedelic users understand that OD's are psychological, not physical. I know mine was. Please be careful. Some people like to ease their way in with a series of smaller doses before trying for the big breakthrough dose, just to test the waters. Also, if you don't own a milligram scale, you can get a cheap jeweler's/carat/mg scale at Amazon.com for under $40 (US).

I like/admire your idea of returning tonight. Wish I had the guts. I believe tonight is a FULL MOON as well as the New Year celebration to a new decade as well. May I respectfully suggest that just before midnight might be a good time. I wish you a most fantastic, mystical journey that sends you to a shiny realm of extreme and unimaginable beauty and brings you back tasting sweet air and realizing to the depth of your soul that THIS is why you have been drawn to DMT.

Peace & Love,
Pandora
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I like this forum!

I was expecting some small little answers but got very insightful responses. Lovely!


I rarely get the opportunity to do this, at least now that I'm home.

I have salvia too, maybe a DMT/salvia combo is something I should try once I feel ready again?


And I know I can't OD on it, but I was asking if there is a place of "no return?"

like if I smoke x amount being who I am, I won't be able to return to a normal sober state.

That's a big fear of mine, and it's probably silly, but there IS a no return place from everything, at least in my eyes.


I have broken through on DMT once before, and salvia twice.

I know what a breakthrough is like. THe DMT breakthrough is so beyond the salvia ones though... it was also very scary. I went to a dungeon for not having an intention (I guess I don't spend enough time building up to an experience) and I kept hearing things saying things, but this time it was audible.

"Anger, hatred, jealously" stuff like that.

THen I had to find a way out, so I brought up the idea of love, and I discovered whatever the hell it was that was looking at me menacingly and trying to make me focus on all the negative emotions found it impossible to comprehend love.

I figured it was an evil being.
 
maybe try some lower doses..sub-breakthroughs..and go like 3 or 4 times in a sitting...that always helps to me get back into a place of love and empathy after a shattering breakthrough that leaves me weary of spice.
 
What I really hate is that the inside of my lightbulb has vapor all around it. It's very chalky inside, and I don't want to end up smoking a lot more than I have to.

I think I should clean it.

Trying to smoke 20mg and ending up smoking 50 is a big difference!

How many "hits" will 20mg make? I remember I took 2 hits last time and there was still vapor in there. No matter what amount I put in there, there always seems to be residue after.
 
Angel_Above,

"So you would agree a break is necessary?"

Only you can decide. Please try to be extremely honest with yourself. Do you truly "hear the call?" Honestly with ourselves is not always easy in this culture we live in. One of the many lessons DMT has taught me is that I have got to quit lying to myself so damned much if I want to make any progress at all. I am personally very blessed as those around me offer thoughts and advice but never advise changing consumption or dosing, they let me find my own path. Of course, I am in my 40's.:(

Although, I would like to respectuflly suggest that a combination is not called for at this point and could get you into deeper waters of the sort you do not want to explore.

"I was asking if htere is a place of "no return?"" Great question. I believe that for most people, the answer is no. You can be psychologically traumatized, even terrorized by any psychedelic experience, but simply abstaining brings the filters firmly back into place and grounds one in consensual reality nicely and reassuringly. The older you are, the better this works. Makes me think of Morpheus in "The Matrix" telling Neo that beyond a certain age, most of the Coppertops would actively fight to maintain the system. Think of the system as consensual reality and sanity. The older/more experienced one is in dealing with stressors/trauma, the easier it is for one's brain/mind to stay sane and plugged in, no matter the insanities and curveballs encountered.

But, there is a small percentage of (mostly) young people who have a date with a psychotic break/illness in their future. They cannot prevent this date. It is going to happen no matter what. Somehow, their physiology, upbringing and/or society have set them up for it. I am not talking about symptoms of depression here. For these people, a powerful, dissociative, overwhelming, psychedelic experience can be the stimulus to push them into the world of the psychotic and they get stuck.

Peace & Love,
Pandora
 
I have to disagree with using anything under 30mgs of DMT.

Many find it to be unpleasant. In fact, I have one friend that I only gave 20mgs to that will never touch it again, she'll eat 5-10grams of cubes no problem... She said that visually it was underwhelming, but it was dysphoric and put her on edge.

Fear is VERY normal. I do promise you that it gets easier. The fear will still be there, even after 150+ launches I still have some anxiety before lifting off.

May I suggest:

1) taking a nice bath before hand. Feeling clean helps
2) light some nice smelling insence, nothing too powerful though
3) take a few minutes to close your eyes and relax. If you know any form of meditation this is VERY useful.
4) anything else that might be relaxing for you

You will probably still feel very nervous right before you start smoking, BUT you should push past this. As soon as I start smoking all of my fear leaves...in for a penny...in for a pound.

I hope this helped...best of luck to you!!!
 
I'm quite the experienced tripper.

I dislike that I'm 19 though. I'm too young to be of any significance to society, and that's all I want to do is help people to help themselves. Using myself as the guinea pig, I've used these to try and "find the light" in a sense; knowing I've been a depressed kid my whole life, and I figure I can give hope to people who find themselves in similar waters but being the guy who fixed himself through himself.

From a very young age I just knew that God has to exist somehow, in someway because nonexistance after life is just pish-posh to me, and it would make life so uninteresting to just die off and not exist.

My salvia trips showed me the eternity that exists beyond separation from the physical self during death. It's funny, I guess you could say I found "God" with these entheogens.

It's not that I found God, really, but more I found a WAY to believe in God. I'm following my calling, because even in 4th grade I was contemplating solipsism (without even knowing it haha). I'm glad I wrote this post, I just remembered a lot about my trips and remembered why I do what I do.


I feel like that needs explaining, the 4th grade contemplation of solipsism. I remember the day so well... I looked at one of my girl friends, and I'm like "I don't know what it's like to see through your eyes. I can only see through mine. Maybe I'm all there is" Of course the girl just looked at me like I was crazy, but I knew I was making at least some sense. WHen I was younger, I used to contemplate God all the time too. I used to be catholic, but now I've found that I must find my own path to follow, and not to follow something because someone else had a "spiritual experience" that leads them to believe certain things. I'm not denying their experiences, but if I want to find God, I have to see God first-hand (Which I felt I have done).

I was a weird little kid. ALl my friends know this.

I'm the only one in my town doing what I'm doing... dosing not for fun, not for the beauty, but merely to learn. I honestly feel like I have this inner warrior spirit that keeps me going. I could easily do whatever I have to to allow myself to carry on normally.



But you know how people feel they have that one thing they're meant to do? I feel doing what I'm doing is what I'm meant to do...
I'm studying physics right now, maybe that's not the best choice, but I know that quantum physics is amazing, and gives me more reason to believe in "God."

Hopefully I'll be someone you all know when I grow up. I just want to help people, at any cost.
 
Soulmate,

You are in the right place and hopefully feel welcome and at home here at the Nexus. No one will pull punches. The honesty will be brutal. The ideas will be "weird," oh boy will they.

Many of us share or have shared your feelings. I suspect at age 19 you are well "ahead of the curve," especially in your enlightened understanding that your path to spirituality is individual - between you and the numinous. I believe no one's path will be successfully mediated by any spiritual leader on Earth asking you for faith, to tithe your money and mind and determining what you wear, what you think, who you see, who you fuck, how you fuck, what you think, what you read, who you go to war with, etc, etc. Sorry for being so brash, but you seem to be on a higher path than these lower-level Earth-bound religons. You know there is something higher because you have had DIRECT EXPERIENCE. Not to insult your upbrining, but compare the spiritual power of our current sacrament to what you experienced in communion as a catholic child.

Revel in being 19! You are on a cusp. Childhood is pretty much over, but your adult path has NOT YET BEEN DETERMINED. This is a time of TREMENDOUS potential. This is an opportunity to work hard for a long-term investment that will enable you (one way or another) to help people to help themselves. This is a worthy goal and worth a long-term committment (e.g. college).

I have personally found that a form of mild Solipism can be helpful in dealing with depression. It is not easy, requires effort and can be summed up as, "I create my own reality, therefore I am not going to be depressed today, no matter what happens. It's okay to be sad over specific stressors but I will not be depressed on general principles or just to be depressed." Whether or not this works, depends on the severity of the depressive symptoms. I have also found that psychedelics in general (probably because they blast my precious few remaining Serotonin receptors) have a mood lifting effect. I am completely and utterly intellectually bummed today because I am taking a break from the spice after getting my ass thoroughly kicked, yet I have a disgustingly cheerful outlook, energy and a bizarre, language-pun, based sense of humor to share with NemoAmicus today.

Peace & Love,
Pandora
 
I just hope physics is the right choice. I'm honestly only getting into it because I'm interested in quantum theory.

I used to be a biochemistry major, trying to be a doctor, but I feel like medicine is one way to help people, but what I want to do doesn't involve anything external, but the purity of the internal self within us all, our so-called "inner divinity."


Thank you for your responses all. You have helped a great deal :D

Happy trails.
 
Angel_Above,

There is no "right or wrong" about what you study, but more about where your heart leads you and where your passion is. The quantum aspect is like spice, multiple layers and sort of unfathomable, but it draws many like a magnet. Check out "Quantum Enigma: Physics Encounters Consciousness" by Rosenblum and Kuttner, and of course the classics by Peter Russell (White Hole in Time, From Science to God). And that is just the start.
 
Both my salvia breakthroughs were solo.

I don't use them to get high, the drugs I mean.

I'm honest with my mother about my entheogen use because she tried acid before.
Granted she had a bad trip, saw "black monk people dancing around her room" all night, but she understands to a point.

My father doesn't.
 
Hi Angel,

Don't worry about being scared to go back into hyperspace. It's scary strapping yourself to a rocket. Others often say to go in again, but I say don't do it unless you feel deep inside that it's what you want to do. My dreamer went in 50-100 times when he first discovered it, but he hasn't been in in a long time now. The work is done for him, because it was a tool on the path to inner contentment for him, and he has found that now.

I believe that what you see in hyperspace depends on the state of your subconscious. Citta's approach of analysing why you saw these things, like how a psychoanalyst analyses dreams, is I think a good one. No need to overanalyse though, you don't want to end up as neurotic as Woody Allen!

About your depression- please look for my depression threads in the healing section. I recommend reading "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy" by David D.Burns MD. All you really need from that book is this: Something happens, you think a thought about it, then your body makes you happy or sad etc depending on the thought you just had. I swear this is how it works, so your attitude is everything. That is the key to contentment, practice it. Stop yourself every time you think a negative thought, then replace it with a more positive one instead. Such as, if you crash your car: not "This is awful, that car was expensive, it's depressing, why did this happen to me?", but instead "Wow, I am so lucky to have survived, life is precious and I love being alive."

This knowledge is important but plants may help get you out of the negative rut. Have you tried drinking ayawaska, or microdosing it a la Acolon_5? People say it grows you new seratonin neurones, and it's proven to have cured depression.

Good luck, and happy new year :)
 
ohayoco said:
Hi Angel,

Don't worry about being scared to go back into hyperspace. It's scary strapping yourself to a rocket. Others often say to go in again, but I say don't do it unless you feel deep inside that it's what you want to do. My dreamer went in 50-100 times when he first discovered it, but he hasn't been in in a long time now. The work is done for him, because it was a tool on the path to inner contentment for him, and he has found that now.

I believe that what you see in hyperspace depends on the state of your subconscious. Citta's approach of analysing why you saw these things, like how a psychoanalyst analyses dreams, is I think a good one. No need to overanalyse though, you don't want to end up as neurotic as Woody Allen!

About your depression- please look for my depression threads in the healing section. I recommend reading "Feeling Good: The New Mood Therapy" by David D.Burns MD. All you really need from that book is this: Something happens, you think a thought about it, then your body makes you happy or sad etc depending on the thought you just had. I swear this is how it works, so your attitude is everything. That is the key to contentment, practice it. Stop yourself every time you think a negative thought, then replace it with a more positive one instead. Such as, if you crash your car: not "This is awful, that car was expensive, it's depressing, why did this happen to me?", but instead "Wow, I am so lucky to have survived, life is precious and I love being alive."

This knowledge is important but plants may help get you out of the negative rut. Have you tried drinking ayawaska, or microdosing it a la Acolon_5? People say it grows you new seratonin neurones, and it's proven to have cured depression.

Good luck, and happy new year :)
Click to expand...



Definitely want to try ayahuasca, but I have no MAOIs and can't order things to my house, so I'd have to wait until I go back to school.

What is a good MAOI to order? Is it easier to make the brew with the bark or with the freebase? I can't really "make" the brew at school with the school's kitchen, though.

SO what is the easiest way to make it without really having to prepare anything/
 
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