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Intro & First Moclobemide Trial

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LostInTheLight

Rising Star
Hi All,

First post here - long time reader of this site and thankful for all of the knowledge here!

I recently came upon a decent amount of DMT after much searching and have begun diving in to this brand new world that this beautiful chemical offers. I have tons of experience with mescaline, LSD, and shrooms and was ready to take the next step so to speak. My first trials were vaping the freebase form and after achieving 10+ breakthroughs via that ROA I was excited to start working with pharmahuasca.

Last weekend I took 300mg moclobemide followed by 75mg of DMT freebase dissolved in lemon juice and had an awesome experience. Definitely intense but still manageable, very reminiscent of a prolonged but slowed down vaped experience. I chose moclobemide to minimize the nausea and even though I still had a decent amount of nausea it was manageable and didn’t negatively impact the experience.

The questions I was hoping to ask from peoples experience here (that I couldn’t find by searching) are:

1. Is there a way to dose the moclobemide to extend the experience? My trip lasted roughly 1 hour from first onset of visuals (a little over two hours from first body effects) until I was back to baseline. There was a afterglow that lasted until I went to sleep however. Is it a function of taking more DMT or could I say take 300mgs, wait an hour, and dose 300mgs and the DMT to extend the experience? 75mgs was a good time but I could certainly have handled more.

2. Has anyone ever combined moclobemide and a smaller dose than normal of Harmalas, for their distinct effects? I am ok with nausea and a purge, but I have had several shroom experiences where it felt like I had been poisoned and I’m not keen on repeating that experience if possible. I’ve seen this combo mentioned in passing but haven’t seen a report detailing that combination.

Thanks in advance for any and all advice!
 
Welcome to the Nexus!

I´m sorry I don´t have any info to add on the moclobemide question, since I have no experience with that substance.

Generally with harmalas, if you have a very short experience as you described, it means you have not taken enough of them to fully inhibit the MAOs... I´m not sure of the safety of moclobemide in higher doses, but if you look into it and consider it safe you could up the dosage a little and see if duration improves.

Another option is to simply switch to harmalas. I know you said you don´t want nausea, and that is a possibility with almost any substance, but if you´re not taking brews but rather extracts, the chances of nausea are reduced. You can also consume some ginger (like a gram of dry powder) which should also significantly reduce nausea. Or you can try something like this. You could start taking just some harmalas on their own, see how it feels. For example start with 150mg mixed harmalas.. If you get too nauseated even with the anti-nausea tricks above, then you know its not for you, and you don´t consume it anymore. If you don´t feel anything at all, you need to up the dosage. Ideally you want to find a dosage of pure harmalas where you get a bit of tracers, slightly altered headspace, some light sensitivity. When you find that dose, next time take that with a bit of DMT.

Lastly, if you plan on experimenting a lot with psychedelics, I think it´s important to accept that nausea can be a part of some experiences, though usually its more at the come up. If it happens despite taking care (eating light, not overdoing on other drugs or food before, taking ginger or similar, etc), then I think best to have a mentality where you accept nausea and purge if necessary, and take it as a reminder of your mortality, as a boost to your happiness when the nausea is gone :)

Either way, good luck, please do tell us how your future experiments go, and thanks for sharing your experience :)
 
I don't share the idea of nausea being the integral part of the experience and prefer entering, flowing and exiting without the body discomfort. There is a way how to avoid the nausea and overall unpleasant body awareness caused by stomach absorption - rectal ROA.

LostInTheLight said:
1. Is there a way to dose the moclobemide to extend the experience? My trip lasted roughly 1 hour from first onset of visuals (a little over two hours from first body effects) until I was back to baseline. There was a afterglow that lasted until I went to sleep however. Is it a function of taking more DMT or could I say take 300mgs, wait an hour, and dose 300mgs and the DMT to extend the experience? 75mgs was a good time but I could certainly have handled more.
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I would not go over 300mg of moclobemide. It is quite long lasting and even 150mg might be sufficient to activate the dmt. I don't have direct experience with moclobemide for oral dmt, but 300mg is more than enough for rectal ROA.

The usual rectal dose of dmt for me is about 75mg. My oral experience is limited, but it seems to be rather higher - about 200mg or more. But this may vary for everyone so it is wise to start lower.

You write you have broken through with vaping, so you seem to know what it means to get into hyperspace. Alter the dosage to line up the intensity of effects for both vaping and oral ROA and you may find it prolongs the duration quite significantly.

In my opinion for intensive travels it is much more convenient to use the rectal ROA than oral ROA, as the onset is much faster and the return as well. One hour in hyperspace seems to be more than enough. But it certainly depends on your expectations, as every ROA has its own pros and cons.
 
Thanks for the replies!

endlessness - to clarify on the nausea aspect, it’s not so much the nausea/vomiting aspect per se, as I’ve had both from shrooms and mescaline. What I don’t care for is the feeling that I’ve had a few times on shrooms where essentially right after dosing I’ve felt like I’ve been poisoned and the severe nausea and attempts at vomiting up the contents of my empty stomach prevents any real exploration due to bodily concerns. I’ve since found that with both mescaline, shrooms, and DMT that what I eat 24-36 hours beforehand doesn’t eliminate the nausea but keeps it a manageable level that I don’t feel colors the experience and I’m able to meditate and let go to go deep :)

Even with moclobemide, which according to reports is supposedly nausea free, I still had a decent amount of nausea but it wasn’t anything major. I do have Harmala extracts (2:1 harmine:harmaline FB and THH Hcl) so I may try lower dosages of those (150mg or so) and see how that treats me.

Pete666 - I don’t have any hang ups of the rectal ROA but I would prefer the oral route for the extended stay in hyperspace that I’m after. I may come to a point where I will go that route - especially with mescaline to shorten the experience a bit since it’s so long that losing an hour or two isn’t such a big deal.

I will give the Harmalas by themselves a shot and see how I feel and I may also try starting low on both moclobemide and Harmalas to see if that is a worthwhile endeavor or if I experience any complications that folks considering the same should be aware of. Either way I’ll report back and let everyone know how it goes.

Thanks again!
 
I've used Moclobemide a good sized handful of times, i have a lot more experience using Harmalas/Rue, but Moclobemide has been cool too. I've taken up to like 375mgs or so of Moclobemide. The duration of oral DMT depends not only on dosage/amount of MAO-A inhibition, but also the timing between the MAO-A inhibitor/Moclobemide/Harmalas and the oral DMT. With Harmalas, 30 minutes to an hour apart seems to be good for me, with Moclobemide things seemed a little trickier but i was also having some sluggish digestion back when i was experimenting around with Moclobemide so my timing could've been thrown off a little, but i would say the usual time delay i would think would still apply, so like 30 minutes to an hour, an hour preferably.

One thing you could perhaps try, is taking 150mgs of Moclobemide, then maybe a couple or so hours later take the other 150mgs and then 30 to 45 minutes to an hour later take the DMT. The first time i tried Moclobemide i had taken it that way, took 150mgs as soon as i got it out of the mailbox to see what it was like, and then later that night took another 150mgs and 30 minutes later took a few Mimosa powder capsules and BAM! it hit me like a freight train. Can't remember the duration of that experience, but i was mainly scared shitless and trying my best to throw up even though i have no gut issues and no nausea or forced purging, it was a psychological purge due to panic lol. But it did last a little bit though iirc.

Whatever you do though, try to keep the dosage of oral DMT down lowish until you figure out the right dosage and timing of the Moclobemide, because if you take too much DMT and accidentally dose it correctly, you could be in for a terrifying surprise/shocker lol, so just be prepared i would say, and when in doubt, throw up, it helps, you'll calm down over a few minutes or so, also some good music with headphones can help, and 3 to 4.5 grams of Lemon Balm tea consumed with the DMT can help smooth out the come up, and of course, reassurance that you're alright can help too.

As for Moclobemide and Harmala mixing, Moclobemide inhibits CYP2D6, which Harmalas are metabolized by, but also inhibits, i'm sure there could be some potentiation of the Harmalas by the Moclobemide, and i've tried the mixture a few times without DMT iirc, but things didn't feel right to me but could've just been dosage related on either end. It could be worth exploring, and certainly nothing bad would come from mixing Moclobemide and Harmalas, i'm pretty sure, but i've always just preferred the Harmalas, because potential nausea/vomiting aside, Harmalas just have so much more offer than mere MAO-A inhibition and Moclobemide may get the DMT-side of things going, but without the Harmalas, that "Huasca" effect/dimension is definitely missing and it's that effect/dimension which is said to be Ayahuasca anyways so without the Harmalas it's just oral DMT (or the plant containing it) which can be cool too no doubt and is worthy of exploration, but i just prefer what all the Harmalas add to the mix. I still do recommend some Lemon Balm tea though with the DMT, even when using Moclobemide, it offers the same kind of experience/feel/personality that you get when using the Harmalas, just minus the Harmala aspects, so it opens up further exploration into admixture plants with the DMT using Moclobemide, and i think that'd be cool.

In terms of redosing, you'd need to redose the Moclobemide, wait a little bit and then take the DMT, since reversible MAO-A inhibitors like Harmalas and Moclobemide only temporarily inhibit the gut's MAO-A, which only lasts maybe an hour or so, even though the brain's MAO-A is still inhibited for a longer period of time. So in order to redose the DMT, you'd need to re-inhibit the gut's MAO-A and then consume the DMT again. But ime, i've never really needed to redose because one dose of DMT lasting 4 to 5 hours with an hour or two more of the afterglow and the Harmala's residual effects is good enough for me lol.
 
Thank you very much for the info ShamenStamens!

I ordered some lemon balm tea and will give that a go. I have the 300mg tablets of moclobemide so I am thinking of splitting them in two and spacing them out by 30 minutes or so to see if I can extend the duration a bit.

In terms of a “lowish” dose of DMT, what would you recommend? 75mg was fun but not particularly deep or intense, but I do understand the “you can always take more but you can never take less” aspect of psychedelics and being new to MAOI’s I will certainly follow your recommendation to keep it low until MAO inhibition is better understood in terms of how it impacts my particular biology.

Another question I have - is there any tolerance from pharma? I’d like to have a few trials over the next month or so to dial in my dosage/timing. If I can do it each weekend until I sort it out that would be great, but if tolerance does develop I will go every other weekend or so.

Thanks again!
 
There doesn't seem to be any tolerance to DMT that i've noticed, i took it daily/near daily for 4 years lol, but most of that was with Harmalas though it still seemed to work fine with Moclobemide.

Idk the dosage for DMT, i've always used the plants themselves, Mimosa and Acacia, but generally they say anywhere from i think 25 to 50 to 75mgs of oral DMT with proper and full on MAO-A inhibition can be extremely intense for some people, whereas some others may need to increase the dosage of DMT. One thing i've noticed, is the stronger the MAO-A inhibition is, the less of the DMT you will need, so as the MAO-A inhibition is figured out, you may find 75mgs to be what you need, or may need to lower it some, but if the MAO-A inhibition is proper, and you find you need to raise the oral DMT dosage, that's fine, just be careful/cautious and if be prepared if you should take more than you thought or if it seems difficult to handle and get overwhelmed, just remember it won't last forever, the come up of oral DMT is like maybe half an hour to an hour and after that things will stabilize/even out, but the Lemon Balm tea will definitely help calm things down a few notches to make things more comfortable especially if you should find yourself in deep waters.
 
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