joedirt said:
Welcome to Pratyahara. Once you can maintain awareness into the sleep state you will realize that you have cut of your sense physical senses. This is actually the last stage before true meditation begins!
Shades of Patanjali's Ashtanga Yoga Sutras and the complex science which it encoded within the soul of Indian humankind! There, I said Patanjali and Science in one sentence... and did not get struck by lightning. Imagine that?
Burnt,
benzyme and
۩ will no doubt appear and challenge any claim that Yoga is a legitimate scientific field of research. But hey, this is pertaining to dreaming, visualization, astral projection and other mysterious, non-rational, right-brained human activities.
Or is this something much, much more transpiring in dreaming states, than any hemispheric mechanism at work?
Patanjali said:
Yogas chitta-vritti nirodha (Yoga is the restraint of the thought-waves of the mind.) When the five senses and the mind are still, and the reasoning intellect rests in silence, then begins the highest path. This calm steadiness of the senses is called Yoga. So, when one experiences, through meditation, that one's true, constant identity is above and beyond thought, beyond the individual body and soul, one ceases to identify with these ephemera, and begins to identify with the witnessing Consciousness, and to view one's own thoughts, feelings, and daily activities from a vantage point that is detached and supremely secure.
Shankaracharya said:
The fool thinks, "I am the just the body"; the intelligent man thinks, "I am an individual soul united within the body, as Atman." But the wise man, in the greatness of his knowledge and depth of spiritual discrimination, sees the Self as the only reality and thinks, "I am Brahman." The universe is truly Brahman, ... for that which is superimposed (the universe) has no separate existence from its substratum (Brahman).
BTW, I'm delighted that it was you who integrated the Yogic cosmology into our Nexian dialog. I have been hesitant for a number of reasons, given the seeming need for contemporary psychonauts to find new terminologies and methodologies to express and communicate about these states of mind.
Nice to know that brilliantly pragmatic individuals can also gravitate to the metaphysical, as well as residing within the company of mathematicians, erudite logicians and clinical researchers. The voodoo that you do? You are a most unique soul,
joedirt. You're a pretty cool scientist. Actually, we are all pretty cool in this Nexian community, each soul a most unique character. 8)
You remind me of my dear friend who is a quantum physicist. He confided to me, that after getting tied-up with his rationalizations and theoretical hypothesis' for decades, he simply gave up and surrendered to the realm of the metaphysical. He is convinced that Einstein was indeed correct, one could live a thousand lifetimes in unbroken succession and still never be able to logically prove the existence of a unified filed of energy/
The Godhead, or deduce any equation, by which we might contain the workings of the mysterious nature of the unmanifested state of Brahman. I wholly agree.
He's got this crazy wisdom and childlike enthusiasm about him, a sparkle-eyed expression, when he gets to this point in the dialog.
Alan said:
Sometimes, you just have to leave the rational mind behind, and just jump right in to the emptiness of the Void, trusting intuition alone, to carry your awareness into the white light. You've gotta have faith or it's just mere speculation and the revolving mind-game of the human intellect.
I am intrigued by the idea that you feel that within lucid dream states, when we are withdrawn from the physical senses, we have the unique opportunity to interphase with, as
BoyPony labels it,
God Mode? In such
lucid dreaming, I seem to be able to notice my sensory receptors but not be as concretely bound by the limitations and restrictions, by which they control my definition of reality (while awake).
I just have one question for you. Please, can you elucidate further? I am certain that Patanjali as well as Shankara, taught that The Vivekachudamani or
Crest Jewel of Discrimination is a consciousness expanding process, not an unconsciousness expanding process. Let me clarify, as I do not disagree with anything you suggest, speculate about or imply. OK? I am curious about how your semantics resonate with mine and our other 'white light junkies', within the hallowed halls of the Nexian community.
I have been exploring these Indian cosmologies for some 30+ years now and have come to believe that there is a distinct differentiation between the waking, sleeping and mystical states of spiritual consciousness. Basically, mind is mind, the vast sea of thought forms and ideas... but
mind manifests itself in myriad ways, with an infinity of alternate variations and minute degrees.
As I stated, I do not challenge you in any way, I sincerely want your perspective in relation to these areas of mind. Your words imply a fusion of an almost Carlos Castaneda-like, Native American Shamanism and classical East Indian Yogic theology. I've been inclined to explore this complicated symbiosis of ideologies, myself.
As I was saying, in the acquisition of Advaita (non dualism), Atman purposefully shuts off the temporal fixations of the senses and re-enters the unbound state of Brahman (indivisible consciousness). It has been described by the Rishis as "
The Awakened State". :idea:
In every description, sleep and dreaming are dismissed as elements of Maya (duality) and therefore, technically... not exactly heralded as the most direct path towards
enlightenment. According to the illuminated Yogis, of course. For they label the non-dreaming self, as the 'awakened self'. Essentially, this is what I refer to as
The Awakening of the Omniself.
As you well know, within the Kriya Yogic terminology of Sri Swami Yukteswar and Swami Paramahansa Yogananda (in direct transmission of the illuminated teachings of Sri Mahavatar Babaji Maharaj), Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi translates into
super-consciousness. The Sages emphatically state that this greatest Samadhi shines above both, the unconscious and conscious divisions within the human mind. This link has a clearly defined and somewhat traditional brake-down of the varied states of consciousness within the human mind (no... it's not the Self Realization Fellowship).
http://www.perception9.com/psychic-...insight=States of Consciousness&item=00000151
While there is no physical hemisphere for this 'third attention', by the very definition of the word, is decidedly not a
hemi-sphere it is essentially a
uni-sphere of mind. Or an
Omnisphere? Exactly! But does it have a physical location in the human brain or does it exist purely in the auric body? Much to ponder, eh mates?
Do you folks find it more accessible to grasp Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi from a vantage point of dreaming deep meditation? Or is it the very same realization as non-dreaming deep meditation? Just from a less constricting dimensional space, like within an
astral plane, so to speak?
Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi, in the classic sense, is a level of non-dual 'supra-consciousness'. Not the domain of the right hemisphere nor the left hemisphere, rather, a transcendent state above Maya (duality), in the
indivisible awareness of Advaita. So they do stress that the dreaming self is based on illusory misconceptions, thus, exist as a component of imagination; itself a potential tangent in the trajectory of our dawning awakening. So too, the rational world of sentient mind, is also referred to as a veritable 'mirage' and therefore, also a dream within a dream.
Lord Buddha made reference to Bodhi and Nirvana. He is reputed to have placed an emphasis on peraonl enlightenment and the attainment of 'wakefulness' and so, inspired countless billions of human beings to dive deeply into the regular practice of meditation and the responsibility of their own salvation, through said wakefulness. One of the names assocoatyed with Lord Buddha is,
'The Awakened One'.
Sri Ramana Maharshi said:
In sleep the mind is alive but merged in oblivion. In Kevala Nirvikalpa Samadhi, the mind is alive but merged in light, like a bucket with rope lowered into a well, that can be drawn out again. - In Sahaja Nirvikalpa Samadhi, the mind is dead , resolved into the Self, like a river discharged into the ocean - its identity lost - and which can never be re-directed from the ocean, once discharged into it.
Where I find this exploration gets quite fascinating, is here in the now. As we have but two halves to our paradoxical nature and but the two hemispheres to our brain activities (decidedly not three)... how do you use lucid dreaming to access the undifferentiated plane of Advaita? Do you feel that the absence of concrete laws and the immense gravity of the set parameters of 'reality', are less of a barrier to immersion within the light of lights?
BTW folks, I had one more partial-awakening with my lucid dreaming, last night. I became consciously aware that I was within a dream and willed myself to enter a meditative state of mind. I was careful not to allow myself to think about what I was doing, lest I awaken into
normal waking existence. So in an empty stillness, I waited to see what I might witness or perhaps, realize about deep meditation on the other side of the looking glass.
I felt my internal energy moving upwards through my spinal column, onwards into my head. the anti-gravity of soul flight. Yes, I accessed the doorway, the Mind's Eye and entered into the breathless state and expanded perceptually, as my crown chakra blossomed open into the Indivisibility of the Grid. Just shy of an actual whiteout. :shock:
Too bad I slipped back into thinking about the experience. Unfortunately... as I realized that the fringes of the supra-consciousness of Samadhi can be accessed form BOTH hemispheres of the brain... I was drawn back into wakefulness. I was laying on my back in the dark, once more. What time is it, I wondered?
So do you feel that working within what Sigmund Freud labeled the subconscious mind and Carl Jung labeled the unconscious mind, the realm of dreams and their plasticity of potentiality... is particularly useful for the Yogin? From my vantage point, I believe we should seek the Light if Advaita in all states. Awake or dreaming, high on psychedelics or sober, centered and grounded on two feet.
I would expect that the slightly less than 1/3 of our lifetime spent sleeping, is a lot of potentiality to embrace. I think we all know that the REM phase is where we process the dimensionality of these dreamscapes. How does this impact our assessment of waking reality? It sure seems to be the mirrored opposite of the nine-to-five, work-a-day mirage we create in our daily conscious lives.
What should I look for next, when I attempt to meditate in Dreamland again? I know not to exclaim, "Aha, I have found my center while dreaming!" Only to have ruined the whole unfoldment with mental dialog. What stance is best to have when meditating within
The Dreamscape? Should I look for the clear light of Spirit? I usually do...
Thanks in advance, for any insights, perspectives or comments. I am psyched to move forward with this dreaming practice!
Aum Mani Padme Hum
Peace, love & light