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Phragmites extraction fail

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reddog

reddog

Entheometrist
Hello, just wanted to report, even if it was a complete fail.

The following has been done:
0. FASA has been prepared by dissolving 500mg of fumaric acid in acetone and leaving it for two days, while agitating periodically (some FA remained undissolved)

1. Around 40g phragmites rhizomes have been retrieved (verified phragmites by comparing rhizomes and plant to lots of pictures on the internet) - gathered in late winter, when some new plants have already started growing

2. The rhizomes have been frozen and thawn a couple of times, then grinded to a wet powder
3. 50ml of acetic acid have been added
4. 150 ml of near boiling water have been added slowly while mixing - this made a mix of a soupy consistency
5. After an hour lime has been added (around 100g), until the consistency was that of a extremely thick soup
6. After one more hour one pull with 50ml xylene has been done (by rolling a closed glas container and using a turkey baster)
7. FASA has been added drop-wise to the xylene -> No precipitation has been observed
8. A second pull has been performed 24 hours later with the same result

Am I right to assume, that this plant doesn't have any relevant indoles?

The extraction has been done to get a feeling for the technique. There was not much hope for good results from a wild growing phragmites anyway.
 
Phragmite has very little if any tryptamine research behind it.. the history of its use may prove otherwise, but there's hardly any info to verify. I don't encourage its use just yet. I've read that desired compounds also occur in the flowers and roots.. but from what I know, the non-desirable's are real high and the tryptas-bcarbolines are real low.

The result material would need extensive analysis as phragmite plants suck up all the water from where they are growing.

Just my input on the matter.
 
Somewhere on a hard disk drive, I have a scientific article by some Korean researchers that I dug up years ago. The Koreans analyzed the tryptamine content of Phragmites rhizomes as a function of time and growth phase. What I can remember from their results is that DMT is mainly present in the cortex of new growth rhizomes. As the rhizomes age, the alkaloid content changes. I have been planning to investigate local Phragmites species during springtime and early summer, when new growth should be at a maximum. When I get to try or when I find back the article, I will post about it.
 
Somewhere I've a bottle of Phragmites flower tea somewhere that could do with a TLC analysis. Certainly sounds like it shouldn't be ingested without workup. That said, on searching Erowid the only reference to 'reed allergy' is with respect to Arundo donax, e.g., "At least one claimed an allergic reaction", here.

There appears (AFAICS) to be nothing at all about Phragmites on Erowid.

There was a pdf online somewhere describing someone's extraction of active alkaloid from Phragmites roots. It is of course entirely anecdotal and possibly a hoax but what I recall as salient points were that the roots were collected from deep water specimens that were easily removed from the water. They used a boat to do this. I've attached this pdf.
 

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I might experiment a bit more with newly grown roots in a couple of months. There is a patch of some 20 meters of this stuff growing 5 mins from my house. And green ones are sprouting already.
 
downwardsfromzero said:
Somewhere I've a bottle of Phragmites flower tea somewhere that could do with a TLC analysis. Certainly sounds like it shouldn't be ingested without workup. That said, on searching Erowid the only reference to 'reed allergy' is with respect to Arundo donax, e.g., "At least one claimed an allergic reaction", here.
There was a pdf online somewhere describing someone's extraction of active alkaloid from Phragmites roots. It is of course entirely anecdotal and possibly a hoax but what I recall as salient points were that the roots were collected from deep water specimens that were easily removed from the water. They used a boat to do this. I've attached this pdf.
Click to expand...

Thank you for correction! From what I recall, arundo was used for making instruments, as well as a material for building boats, weapons etc. Phragmites may have been used similarly.
 
Cognitive Heart said:
Thank you for correction! From what I recall, arundo was used for making instruments, as well as a material for building boats, weapons etc. Phragmites may have been used similarly.
Click to expand...
You're welcome! Yes, Arundo is the usual source of reeds for woodwind instruments. I've not seen Phragmites ever get substantial enough for that purpose. It's still farmed for thatching roofs to this day, however. Also the subject of reed boats is quite interesting. But I shall not digress further at this point!
 
pitubo said:
Somewhere on a hard disk drive, I have a scientific article by some Korean researchers that I dug up years ago. The Koreans analyzed the tryptamine content of Phragmites rhizomes as a function of time and growth phase. What I can remember from their results is that DMT is mainly present in the cortex of new growth rhizomes. As the rhizomes age, the alkaloid content changes. I have been planning to investigate local Phragmites species during springtime and early summer, when new growth should be at a maximum. When I get to try or when I find back the article, I will post about it.
Click to expand...

Please do so! All possible tryptamine plants may have potential. It grows everywhere here, too. I've always had a profound sense with these tall, over-encompassing beasts down near the river, on mushrooms. ;)
 
Cognitive Heart said:
Please do so! All possible tryptamine plants may have potential. It grows everywhere here, too. I've always had a profound sense with these tall, over-encompassing beasts down near the river, on mushrooms. ;)
Click to expand...
I will, but it requires me to do some serious digging.
 
There is a massive patch of what looks to be either arundo donax or phragmites growing directly across the street from my house on a pond bordering a wooded area.
If it is phargamites & not arundo donax, i may get some tlc plates & do extractions on different parts of the plant for tlc analysis when summer comes. If it looks promising i'll send some off to energy control.

Hopefully there is some tryptamine content & a way to separate out the other alkaloids present.

I'd love to have a dmt goldmine 25yards from my front door :lol:
 
Cognitive Heart said:
I've always had a profound sense with these tall, over-encompassing beasts down near the river, on mushrooms. ;)
Click to expand...
I know what you mean, I think; there's something about their blueish tinged foliage and those purple flowers. The flowers have been used for dye making of course so there's every reason to be picking them...
 
downwardsfromzero said:
Cognitive Heart said:
I've always had a profound sense with these tall, over-encompassing beasts down near the river, on mushrooms. ;)
Click to expand...
I know what you mean, I think; there's something about their blueish tinged foliage and those purple flowers. The flowers have been used for dye making of course so there's every reason to be picking them...
Click to expand...

The flowers are indeed beautiful. I've picked them before and stick it in my hair or belt. Maybe the city can pay me to take down humongous patches and take out the flowers and rhizomes. :p
 
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