Please avoid the book "The Spirit Molecule"!!!!

[DubRules]

im not sure how you guys will feel about this, so please voice your opinions.

i have many books on psychedelics and recently picked up Strassmans "the spirit molecule".
i have had 0 contact with other deemers in real life and as i began to read it, i became very excited about hearing what others experienced on dmt.
i refrained from using dmt myself until i was about 3/4 of the way through the book.
(my previous experience was super tough and i had been taking a needed break..)
when i finally felt up to a deem mission, i loaded my pipe and took a few hits.
immediately, my brain began to attempt to make all these connections between what i was experiencing and what subjects in "tsm" described.
sounds, shapes, beings, etc.
this was the first time i could feel my brain bouncing around in my skull, trying to get out, but failing miserably.
from then on out, i couldnt have a "successful" trip to save my life.
i eventually just had to quit again.

"inner paths to outer space" is another terrible book that will just try and mold the way your mind and soul function on psychedelics.
same with learys "the psychedelic experience".

these guys all try so hard to steer people away from conventional religion and thought but all they do is create a psychedelic cult church of their own.
when i think about how many young minds leary led astray with his bullshit, it really pisses me off.
that line at the end of "fear and loathing" says it best.
depp says that leary "crashed around america selling consciousness expansion to anyone that would take it. but what he didnt realize is that he was creating a generation of cripples and failed seekers who just pulled down their own culture."

this is the number one sign of an addict, and i am one, but i do drugs by myself mostly.
especially with psychedelics, i find that having people around just ruins the experience.
i like to dive deep down inside myself and do some exploring.
its been a long while since ive had a friend ive felt comfortable tripping with.
i think what it boils down to is that i do drugs for myself.
not because its cool or even that i have addictions.
i use different chemicals for getting myself different places.
i need to clear my own path and carry myself through the session.

whats the point of journeys if you have a roadmap that someone else drew??

 

[benzyme]

the book was merely an account of administering the compound to a group of individuals, to record their subjective experiences. it also proposed some theories. I don't think it was meant as attempt to gather people behind a belief, that would be Dianetics.

you can't pigeonhole spirituality, it means different things to different people.

and wth is a "deemer"? :?

 

[jamie]

"when i think about how many young minds leary led astray with his bullshit, it really pisses me off.
that line at the end of "fear and loathing" says it best.
depp says that leary "crashed around america selling consciousness expansion to anyone that would take it. but what he didnt realize is that he was creating a generation of cripples and failed seekers who just pulled down their own culture."


People create their own futures...its so easy to just sit there and blame other people..im getting sick and tired of hearing people point the finger at leary as if he was responciple for the downfall of modern culture or something...maybe go read some of his other books..leary wasnt into religion at all.

Shall we next blame Mckenna for all the flocks of kids that misinterprete what he was really saying..running around spewing out rediculous 2012 doomsday theories?

The problem is and always was..that people just hear what they want to hear.

 

[88]

Wow, quite a mental book burning bonfire of a post!

Sounds like people generally just piss you off. Maybe you should try to figure out why that is.

best of luck

 

[smokeydaze]

Hmm yea, I thought it was an awesome book. To no extent do others views effect my own experiences though, you have to be subjective and decorrelate what is yours and what isn't..

 

[Pokey]

That book is how I came to be here, with all of you.:d

Nuff said.

Pokey

 

[TheNtt]

I would recommend both of these books to anyone interested in psychedelics/spirituality. I think it's pretty clear that your experience with these books results from something internal, rather than the books themselves, and it really sounds like you read these books with a biased view point to begin with.

 

[soulfood]

I found spirit molecule a little boring, just because it wasn't what I had expected... but "inner paths to outer space"! That's an awesome book

The only books that colour my trips are my manga comics when a pharma dose is just kicking in. I see lots of characters and what not

 

[Redguard]

How can anyone hate on this man?
youtube
yah i know loaded question, but i still love the guy!

 

[Morphane]

I get what you are saying DubRules.

It is clear that what people bring to hyperspace is what they get. If they're in an experiement setting, with doctors and nurses and syringes and clinical atmosphere, it is no surprise they find themselves being probed by aliens and UFOs, getting experimented upon and such.

The primivite shaman gets what he expects - his ideas of gods and ancestors, snakes and pyramids. Likewise, the person who immerses himself in shaman culture - surprise, surprise, gets a hyperspace full of such motifs.

Whatever hyperspace is in itself, is not something we can experience. We impose - subconsciously, meaning. In itself it is probably just a rorschach blot that the brain makes sense of.

Therefore, if one wishes a unique experience, avoid books like the Spirit Molecule, and the DMT reports of this site. These descriptions of hyperspace fills the imagination, so that when you go there for yourself, you get what others have imagined.

This is why set and setting is so important.

I watched a show about hot air ballons yesterday, and when a hot air ballon is airborn, it has no steering, and is dependent upon the weather. Therefore, the ballon pilot has to plan the flight before leaving the ground. He must study the weather, know the forcast, and be flexible when it comes to places to land.

The psychonaut needs to be the same. By carefully preparing set and setting, and cultivating a certain mental culture - perhaps for as long as a few months, the psychonaut can pilot the unpredictable passage of hyperspace.

 

[TheNtt]

Therefore, if one wishes a unique experience, avoid books like the Spirit Molecule, and the DMT reports of this site. These descriptions of hyperspace fills the imagination, so that when you go there for yourself, you get what others have imagined.

I view this as an internal problem. Certainly reading such things will embed expectations into your mind, but that's why it is so emphasized in this community to beginners that they need to rid all expectations from their mind before launching. It's a crucial step in any psychedelic exploration. This becomes easier with time and practice.

 

[jamie]

"It is clear that what people bring to hyperspace is what they get. If they're in an experiement setting, with doctors and nurses and syringes and clinical atmosphere, it is no surprise they find themselves being probed by aliens and UFOs, getting experimented upon and such.

The primivite shaman gets what he expects - his ideas of gods and ancestors, snakes and pyramids. Likewise, the person who immerses himself in shaman culture - surprise, surprise, gets a hyperspace full of such motifs."


Uhh..is it really THAT clear?..have you ever taken DMT?
The "primitive" shaman gets what he expects?..have you seen some ayahuasca artwork done by these shamans?..especially othe ones with the flying machines in them??..it doesnt all seem to be as simple as you might think..

Maybe you need to go do some real research..spend some time in an anthroplogy classroom and you will find out haw many ancient cultures had the UFO motif, tablets of "flying machines" etc..what you are doing is like half-assed armchair speculation..(no offence its just that i have studied this stuff at college and its alot deeper than you may think Morphane)

I do agree that set and setting is important and definatily effects the experience..but trust me those beings are there either way..I dont take tryptamines in an experimental setting with doctors and nurses and syringes etc..and i still see aliens and strange robtos, angels, pixies etc..and I do these things alone in a dark room..

What do you rally mean by a person who immerses himself in shaman cultures?..thats such an ambigous statement...sort of steriotypical as well dont you think? gods and ancestors, snakes and pyramids?.. Look at christian cultures and they're wachy ideas of gods and ancestors..

To attempt to sum things up the way you have by dumbing things down is a bit presumptious and seriousily makes me wonder if you have ever smoked DMT or ingested psychedelic tryptamines...

In my opinion when i take psilocybin or bufotenine i see distinctly mayan/aztec/chavin etc motifs, simply because its part of the experience..you cannot seperate it from very nature of the experience itself..it looks mayan or aztec becasue when they took these things thats exactly what they saw..these things meant more to them in their society, were widespread and so they modeled they're artwork and archetecture after the motifs found within that experience..THAT is why we see a commonality between the content of the visions and cultures of the past..becasue we are looking at the same damn thing.

 

[DubRules]

im not trying to place blame on anyone.
im simply stating how the books effected my thinking and subsequently my dmt journeys.
i was super stoked on "tsm" at first, but realized that it was more of a story book than anything else. by the time i stopped reading, my head was swimming with so many ideas. some of his propositions make total sense. some of them are eerily close to some thoughts i have had. but by the same token, if you read it as a work of fiction, it almost seems as such. i also couldnt get over the fact that ALL the dmt was administered in hospital rooms, mri machines, etc.. that element right there is enough to throw the whole experiment. it would cause me to have nightmares of trips..

i suppose my point is, i find it almost insulting that "authorities" on psychedelics would even consider attempting to write a "spiritual" guide to psychedelics.
the first person i introduced to dmt actually got upset with me because i kept trying to guide her in how to handle certain situations. i meant no harm and was merely trying to share what i had learned over the years and save her a little mental anguish. she insisted that my ways were mine and hers were hers.
since that day, ive realized that she does experience totally different things than i do. she cant go off without music and i rarely ever do. i fight my demons and she fights the illness inside her. i come back with a somber face and shes laughing so hard shes crying. i cant imagine if my trips ran like hers.
id have an aneurysm.
now that ive thought about it a lot, having no guidance whatsoever is the way to go.
were talking space travel here.
its something you do on your own.
i dont believe in sitters for dmt at all.
for me, they cant do anything useful other than cpr.
in my worst dmt trips, i knew that if anything interrupted my trance, it would be detrimental and ruin everything.
i cant trust people enough to leave me alone.
i had a friend back in the day that i literally nearly killed one night on acid. he kept contorting his face just to fuck with me. slowly his eyes and eventually his whole face melted into a demons likeness.
of course, demons must die, so i went after him.
obviously i dont put myself around those people anymore, but even my girlfriend simply patting my head while it was in her lap sent me over the edge one night.
i cant handle any outside stimulus at all.
maybe thats just me though.
my first dmt trip was an accidental huge dose of ~60mg.
im so glad i dove in headfirst and didnt pussyfoot around.
i love it and have been trying to push myself by using it ever since that day.
dmt changes over time though.
it grows with you.
never do i expect to go to the carnival or the keebler elf tree house anymore.
no colors or even fractals to speak of.
those days are gone.
now i look forward to running into the black cloud and down the tunnel to see whats waiting at the end.
sometimes its pure bliss and other times its completely horrifying.
i cant afford to have anything not go my way when im helpless on all fronts.
humans pose too large of a threat to me in that situation.
really clawing down into your insides is hard to do when there is another soul floating next to you.
i swear sometimes i can feel our energies colliding.
its not pleasant.

it took me a while to figure it out, but psychedelics and spirituality cant go together.
at least not for me.
i understand that many people feel that "higher being" and feel "spiritually rejuvenated" after a dmt trip, but its just a wishful placebo effect.
i fear that some people search too much for faith in drugs, especially psychedelics.
drugs can expand horizons and open doors, but only you in your natural sober form can truly find the faith within and believe.
the way drugs act on the brain, (speaking for my brain) it would be too easy to be misguided and mistakenly misplace your faith without realizing it.
to me, even as a fairly hard drug user, my time with God needs to be straight.
its just too big of a deal to get high before doing, you know..?
were talking a relationship with our Lord and souls everlasting.
not worth the risk of accidentally fucking it up to me..

 

[jamie]

"to me, even as a fairly hard drug user, my time with God needs to be straight.
its just too big of a deal to get high before doing, you know..?
were talking a relationship with our Lord and souls everlasting.
not worth the risk of accidentally fucking it up to me.."

To me god is everywhere..sober or not..doesnt matter..god is source..Im not sure what you mean by accidentally "fucking it up"..do you mean not realizing that god flows through all?..thats what psychedelics have taught me...god is both the light and the dark..i dont believe in something as dualistic as a "devil" so..

If we fall into darkness..its for a reason..the darkness is there so that we can realise why the light is there..thats it..

 

[Redguard]

I think both Fractal Enchantment and Morphane both bring up some good points, yet Morphane believes that our minds influince what we see 100 percent which i believe is completely wrong. It could very well be that 2 people could have the same exact experience but one person's mind views it one way, and another person's minds views it another way. One thing i've learned about DMT is just how powerful the mind is. When i go into a dmt experience my thoughts change what i see. One time i lime juiced an eigth of mushrooms and smoked dmt on the peak. I was blasted into a reality where my brain controlled every aspect of what i saw. Everything i thought would instantly appear infront of me. It started to scare me and as soon as i got scared my hallucinations reflected my scared thoughts and i literally started experiencing every fear i had in my head.

It could be fractal that you randomly saw distinct mayan/azte/chavin motifs and therefore believed it is part of the experience. Hence every time you smoke it you will see these things. My experiences on dmt are usually pretty random because i go into the experience with an open mind. I think it's foolish to try to mold it into anything.

 

[jamie]

I am not talking about DMT...i dont see such distinct mayan motifs with DMT..only with psilocin and bufotenine have i seen these things so far..with psilocin before i ever knew anything about the mayans..let alone who they ever were...if you read the reports with both of these tryptamines, its clear that there is an underlying qaulity to the visions that seems to parallel with the motifs of these culutres where bufotenine and psilocin were widely used.

It doesnt even make sense to me anymore that this could just be subconcious content comming up..each tryptamine presents itself with a set of distinct visionary qualities..and they are repeatable over and over again with each one..i have done this hundreds of times now..buotenine and psilocin are the closest related..DMT is alot like psilocin as well..but not as distincly mayan/aztec feeling..

For me I am convinved that the mayans just modeled they're culutre after the visions found within the experience of the typtamines they were ingesting..I mean, thats the most rational explanation there is so far..far far far more rational than the idea of people seeing mayan motifs and then later hallucinating them randomly..

Take a look at psychedelic artwork from diff places..there is def a commonality there..look at alex grey, then look at luke brown etc..its obvious these people have seen the same things.

 

[soulfood]

Salvia land is not often spoken of as shipibo art and what not, but what people see and what I see are very close indeed. I 100% had no knoledge of what salvia was going to do to me. Then years later you meet a guy who saw the same world.

It's the same for me with all entheogens.

 

[jamie]

To think that what we see is all based on subconcious stuff is really like sooo so out of date as well..this isnt the 60's anymore where we still think that all psychedelics do exactly the same thing..I mean if it really is just all based on what we bring into the trip..than why is there a difference between something like mescaline and psilocybin..lsa and bufotenine..acid and salvinorin..??

There is a difference there becasue there IS a differene there..and its pharmacological..doesnt it make sense that we see distinct things with each seperate substance becasue each once interacts with our nervous system and visual cortex in a specific way?..

We are all humans..weather your a mayan or japanese..you take a certain tryptamine and its going to interact with the human nervous system in a specific way..there will always be commonalities within the visions of people who work with these things..becasue we have the same wetware.

 

[Redguard]

Ahh woops, i haven't tried bufo yet but i am in the process of getting aquainted with this substance I'm not trying to completely disprove your arguement, i believe both of you are right in certain ways, i just don't think that the power of the brain to shape psychadelic experiences should be completely ignored. Now i can't really comment on what is seen on bufo, before i try to understand what you say by psilocin do you mean eating the entire mushroom itself and all that goes with it or extracting actually psilocin and taking that?

 

[Ginkgo]

(...) do you mean eating the entire mushroom itself and all that goes with it or extracting actually psilocin and taking that?

What would the difference be? In either case, the visions produced are because of psilocin. Very few extract psilocin from their mushrooms, making a tea does the trick. I would not recommend eating the whole mushroom in any higher dosages than around 2 g, as it is very hard for the stomach to digest and creates a lot of intestinal air.