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Interesting topic, OIE. To some degree, I can relate to the concept presented here, but I will continue on that later.

What has to be pointed out is that after being initiated in some of the psychedelic states, a spark will take place within the mind of the initiated, even the minutest one and, after its seed has been sown, there will rarely be cases of retrograde... Consciousness itself has the active purpose of evolving and, as such, beings gifted with consciousness will follow on the same principle. And, yes, in most cases there will be a desire to look deeper into these things. But in times as such when information is made widely and freely available, the greater percentage of people will try to quench their individual curiosities online.. and that's a good thing. But the good thing is not only the vast database that exist online regarding the subject of sacraments in general, but also that these individuals, unique in their own way, are all searching, in their own unique way for the exact bits of information that fit their own, unique, experience. And that in its turn is extremely empowering. To my understanding of these things through time, I can only say that this is one of the most beneficial aspects in ones experience, being able to (having the freedom to search for) learn by oneself... Do not mind my analogy, but once knocking at these doors, doesn't the "middlemen concept" become pretty much useless ? Do you know what I mean?
I feel that culturally we have been stripped of our powers for far too long and, bits at a time, this unbalance has to be restored. Of course that one could stress the fact that, in times when all possible information is made widely and freely available, one might at least benefit from some guiding, still I could not disagree more because losing/finding ones self is all part of the experience and of the experiential nature of human life, more so when it comes to such high pitched experiences... it actually is the way we evolved.

Returning to what I said at the beginning, that I can relate, I just wanted to note that when venturing within deeper realms of the subconscious/inner worlds, past the fresh curiosities, the need of a suitable discipline (or WAY) of opening/entering the inner realms becomes very obvious (I would not split it into categories as in the OP, but that's just me). It becomes vividly obvious that without one such technique to apply there will be issues arising that are well known and feared by some of the psychonauts around here, specifically hyperslaps, closeouts/denied entrances, dark states, bad trips etc. Whilst in contrary to the lack of such a method, already developing/having one will likely open and enrich these experiences in very powerful aspects. Although, IME, these things are extremely unique, individual dependent and seem to be passed on only during the psychedelic experiences... in a sense, the only manner to know these things is through real practice, not so much in theory.. if you know what I mean. I could agree that at such point the need for some guidance might arise, but I feel this is where harm reduction should play its part... other than that, with all respect possible to all beings material and immaterial, cultures, sciences and arts of this world, please keep your yoga, your shamanism, drumming and singing, and please let the plants speak for themselves. This is the greatest favor you could do to anyone or anything regarding this subject. Let us not forget why we got here in the first place, or who the actual teachers are.

<blockquote data-quote="Nereus" data-source="post: 3860664" data-attributes="member: 28533">Interesting topic, OIE. To some degree, I can relate to the concept presented here, but I will continue on that later.What has to be pointed out is that after being initiated in some of the psychedelic states, a spark will take place within the mind of the initiated, even the minutest one and, after its seed has been sown, there will rarely be cases of retrograde... Consciousness itself has the active purpose of evolving and, as such, beings gifted with consciousness will follow on the same principle. And, yes, in most cases there will be a desire to look deeper into these things. But in times as such when information is made widely and freely available, the greater percentage of people will try to quench their individual curiosities online.. and that&#039;s a good thing. But the good thing is not only the vast database that exist online regarding the subject of sacraments in general, but also that these individuals, unique in their own way, are all searching, in their own unique way <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> for the exact bits of information that fit their own, unique, experience. And that in its turn is extremely empowering. To my understanding of these things through time, I can only say that this is one of the most beneficial aspects in ones experience, being able to (having the freedom to search for) learn by oneself... Do not mind my analogy, but once knocking at these doors, doesn&#039;t the &quot;middlemen concept&quot; become pretty much useless ? Do you know what I mean?I feel that culturally we have been stripped of our powers for far too long and, bits at a time, this unbalance has to be restored. Of course that one could stress the fact that, in times when all possible information is made widely and freely available, one might at least benefit from some guiding, still I could not disagree more because losing/finding ones self is all part of the experience and of the experiential nature of human life, more so when it comes to such high pitched experiences... it actually is the way we evolved.Returning to what I said at the beginning, that I can relate, I just wanted to note that when venturing within deeper realms of the subconscious/inner worlds, past the fresh curiosities, the need of a suitable discipline (or WAY) of opening/entering the inner realms becomes very obvious (I would not split it into categories as in the OP, but that&#039;s just me). It becomes vividly obvious that without one such technique to apply there will be issues arising that are well known and feared by some of the psychonauts around here, specifically hyperslaps, closeouts/denied entrances, dark states, bad trips etc. Whilst in contrary to the lack of such a method, already developing/having one will likely open and enrich these experiences in very powerful aspects. Although, IME, these things are extremely unique, individual dependent and seem to be passed on only during the psychedelic experiences... in a sense, the only manner to know these things is through real practice, not so much in theory.. if you know what I mean. I could agree that at such point the need for some guidance might arise, but I feel this is where harm reduction should play its part... other than that, with all respect possible to all beings material and immaterial, cultures, sciences and arts of this world, please keep your yoga, your shamanism, drumming and singing, and please let the plants speak for themselves. This is the greatest favor you could do to anyone or anything regarding this subject. Let us not forget why we got here in the first place, or who the actual teachers are.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Nereus, post: 3860664, member: 28533"] Interesting topic, OIE. To some degree, I can relate to the concept presented here, but I will continue on that later. What has to be pointed out is that after being initiated in some of the psychedelic states, a spark will take place within the mind of the initiated, even the minutest one and, after its seed has been sown, there will rarely be cases of retrograde... Consciousness itself has the active purpose of evolving and, as such, beings gifted with consciousness will follow on the same principle. And, yes, in most cases there will be a desire to look deeper into these things. But in times as such when information is made widely and freely available, the greater percentage of people will try to quench their individual curiosities online.. and that's a good thing. But the good thing is not only the vast database that exist online regarding the subject of sacraments in general, but also that these individuals, unique in their own way, are all searching, in their own unique way :) for the exact bits of information that fit their own, unique, experience. And that in its turn is extremely empowering. To my understanding of these things through time, I can only say that this is one of the most beneficial aspects in ones experience, being able to (having the freedom to search for) learn by oneself... Do not mind my analogy, but once knocking at these doors, doesn't the "middlemen concept" become pretty much useless ? Do you know what I mean? I feel that culturally we have been stripped of our powers for far too long and, bits at a time, this unbalance has to be restored. Of course that one could stress the fact that, in times when all possible information is made widely and freely available, one might at least benefit from some guiding, still I could not disagree more because losing/finding ones self is all part of the experience and of the experiential nature of human life, more so when it comes to such high pitched experiences... it actually is the way we evolved. Returning to what I said at the beginning, that I can relate, I just wanted to note that when venturing within deeper realms of the subconscious/inner worlds, past the fresh curiosities, the need of a suitable discipline (or WAY) of opening/entering the inner realms becomes very obvious (I would not split it into categories as in the OP, but that's just me). It becomes vividly obvious that without one such technique to apply there will be issues arising that are well known and feared by some of the psychonauts around here, specifically hyperslaps, closeouts/denied entrances, dark states, bad trips etc. Whilst in contrary to the lack of such a method, already developing/having one will likely open and enrich these experiences in very powerful aspects. Although, IME, these things are extremely unique, individual dependent and seem to be passed on only during the psychedelic experiences... in a sense, the only manner to know these things is through real practice, not so much in theory.. if you know what I mean. I could agree that at such point the need for some guidance might arise, but I feel this is where harm reduction should play its part... other than that, with all respect possible to all beings material and immaterial, cultures, sciences and arts of this world, please keep your yoga, your shamanism, drumming and singing, and please let the plants speak for themselves. This is the greatest favor you could do to anyone or anything regarding this subject. Let us not forget why we got here in the first place, or who the actual teachers are. [/QUOTE]