Vast fear of no coming back

[Hyena]

So I took the third toke, long and slow, I vaporized.

But this time the hyperspace was different. As soon as I noticed myself in this new realm I switched off the light and went to bed. I closed my eyes but the fractal patterns were scary (never happened before, they are always pure love). So I opened my eyes in this dim little room of mine and went into a meditative position. The vibe totally resembled me my last terror trip with DMT in August when I went so far that I seriously thought I have died until I accepted my own death. The world however, was totally different than anything before and to make matters worse I suddenly got this Deja Vu feeling and started wishing it was already over. I mean I've seen this alien world before and already thought I can handle its every aspect so I was filled with awe when I understood that DMT is full of surprises (including the negative ones).

I tried to keep calm but my heart rate went up because I got these weird fear based thoughts that this is it, and I'm not getting a second chance this time. I concentrated on breathing and looked my watch to see how much time it is left until the affects should start wearing off. But when I looked my watch I quickly understood that time had no meaning at that moment. The round glass of my hand watch was metallic and polished like this:

I tried to meditate (think of nothing) but I got this very strong and annoying feeling that if lose every contact with the real reality I might not find my way back. So I started to imagine a girl that I love but who isn't mine yet. Thinking of her got me through the worst in August so I knew that it might work again. If I was a religious person I would have prayed to find a way back but I wasn't so there really were not many anchors to hold on. I concentrated on her face for a while, thinking how beautiful she is and it worked. I wasn't afraid any more so I kept doing it until I opened my eyes for a while and saw that my room is getting normal again.

Then I cried as if I had just escaped a den full of hungry lions while already having accepted that this might be it for me. This was the second time I was willing to quit DMT forever if it would have brought me back from that disturbing unreality. It's a pity that fearful experiences like that can occur, although they have been rare. The best trips have been the ones where I get to experience the eternal joy of being and pure love escorted by fantastic closed eye visuals.

I've been experimenting with an intention to learn more about this place where we are but such strong experiences make me seriously consider that I should pass the pipe to some other adventurer and retire.

 

[Felnik]

There are many flavors to a dmt experience. Sometimes some
Of them just have to be endured . The good news is no matter how
Deep you go you always return. once I realized that it got easier to deal with.
I recognize the thing your describing , it's kind of a
Super intense kelidescopic thing unrelenting morphing patterns
In your face . Funny but I only got that with plain dmt when I journeyed laying in bed in the dark.

Dose can play role in these kind of things. Sounds like
You took too much. Once panic sets in its bad obviously .
What your describing really sounds like your taking too much .
Also for me dmt by itself without caapi leaf or vine in some form is a no no .
I stopped plain dmt a long time ago .

It took a long time to learn how to dial in the good experiences .
There's a serious learning curve. Learning to cope with fear is one of the big lessons.
A general approach of slow steady small dosing with changa is the ticket
To blissville at Least for me . This balls to the wall 3 giant hits thing is insane to me without
Testing the waters first . Sometimes it's just a bad time to go but you don't know that
Til it's too late . Gradual ramping up is the ticket .

 

[Doodazzle]

I've had rough times myself--Felnik has good advice.

 

[Hyena]

the thing your describing , it's kind of a
Super intense kelidescopic thing unrelenting morphing patterns
In your face .

Thanks for your reply and for using this wording. It's exactly what it was and I wasn't able to find the right words for it these polished rapid kaleidoscopic visuals in combination with ultra light body weight feeling and having almost nothing resembling me the good old natural world that I left by was so scary to witness that I didn't even want to look at these features. It was just too much for that moment to handle. It's weird though that I haven't met any entities yet, I've been experimenting with DMT for half a year now and I'm always alone in these new realms I get to visit.

 

[Mr.Peabody]

It is a hard thing to learn, but you can somewhat disconnect yourself from the experience when it is rough. I just remind myself to take the experience for what it is, good or bad, and just accept it and accept my fate. This gets hard when your mind is on the "Oh god! I'm dying!" track, but just remember, you will not die, and you will come back.

I've been exactly where you are, so I know the urge to hang it up. I am so glad I didn't hang it up, though. When you think about it, it is sort of like riding a bicycle. You can't just jump on a bike and ride your first time. It takes practice to learn, and I think in many ways it takes practice to learn to navigate the peaks and pitfalls of hyperspace. That being said, unlike a bike, you will still encounter the unexpected. It would be like if your bike turned into a kitten one day, and a wolverine the next. To me, the unexpected is what I love about DMT. It is a guaranteed cure for the mundane!

I definitely encourage you to hang in there, but if you feel that ending your explorations with DMT is the right thing for you, then you should certainly do that.

 

[Felnik]

It's a weird thing but there is a strange evolution
To the experiences if you continue on a regular basis .
I'm not sure why or how that is . But the types of things I
Was getting when I first started are not the same as now.

I used to think I was being tested by some outside alien force but it's possible that
As your body adjusts to molecule over time the experiences can
Change. There are quite a few themes that seem consistent .
Moreover your ability to cope with fear and various intense experiences also
Evolves and you simply get better at it .

I used to think that that particular kelidescopic thing
Would be absolutely terrifying to someone first starting out .
I honestly endured that on quite a few occasions.

I'm going to say that I've learned and gained a strong bond
With my deep inner self .
I suggest learning and building a strong grounded inner self - inner voice .
This has been one of the most positive aspects of my personal growth with
These remarkable substances .

A strong and grounded inner voice can really hold you steady
During some of these occasional dmt onslaughts . Start by talking aloud to yourself
When it's intense , tell yourself your ok like a coach even if you don't believe it .

Always hold firm , witness , breath , stay steady , don't panic and be cool
The bad will pass the good will flow to you .

As antrocles used to say " purity of intent "

 

[Hyena]

Always hold firm , witness , breath , stay steady , don't panic and be cool
The bad will pass the good will flow to you .

Yes! And this time I actually already knew what to do when the experience gets horrific. I knew that if I breath then it's a sign of being alive, also starting to whisper my good intentions towards my special someone and hearing my own voice made it a lot easier. Nevertheless, it was scary as hell because I felt so lost and had a feeling that this is not going to end and I must stay in that crazy environment forever so, my first reaction was to quit this stuff but now as I see that I actually did much better this time and helped myself to get out of this unpleasant abyss I'm starting to think that it might still have something to teach me.

I wonder what's going on in hyperspace. What's the meaning of that reality, why it exists and what could be the possible explanations of it. I sort of believe in the stuff like the hollow earth theory, David Icke's insights, holographic universe and us being in some sort of a machine or Matrix. Also that love has something to do with everything and DMT seems to be an important piece of the puzzle but I'm not yet sure how to connect it with the other pieces.

When I first started out with vaping I once vaped until I was unable to take another toke simply because I wasn't able to understand where my mouth is relatively to the pipe and the torch. I therefore concluded that there can't be such thing as too much DMT but I was wrong. The load I put on the pipe last night got me 2x to the hyperspace. First time was not intense though so I went for what was remaining in the mesh and the second time, it got burnt a bit and almost coughed it out as suddenly a mother load of DMT got vaporized and all into my lungs at once. Horrors began from that moment

 

[Felnik]

I think we all learn the hard way with dose. Quite a few years back before I knew what I was dealing with I was having a series of fantastic positive experiences and became complacent and not careful about measuring. Needless to say it was one of the most terrifying
experiences of my life.
My first reaction was to destroy all my spice and never do it again.
The biggest problem with one of these catastrophic trips is this thought that you will never come out of it and that some kind of line has been crossed and you will remain in this splintered state for eternity. That's a bad one to negotiate. Once that level of panic sets its very hard to pull out. Everything is meaningless in the face of that.
Its just pure fear and panic, Ive been there I know it. One thing it does do is let you
know exactly the power and potential of this stuff.

I encourage you to try adding caapi leaf or vine, make a changa blend.
Its kind of a game changer from plain dmt. Ramping up slowly is where its at for me.

For some, like me the insatiable quest to understand these experiences is
a common byproduct. Piles of books from library on all subjects, endless research in all fields of study
microscopes, telescopes you name it.

Terrence had a great suggestion in one of his lectures he said to keep all theories about hyperspace "provisional" in other words we are always building on our understanding. I try not to get stuck on one perspective . I try like crazy to not impose too many human constructs on it, not easy to do
sounds like your on the right track, also one more thing taking a break for a while is always a good thing when it gets too intense and weird.

 

[Hiyo Quicksilver]

Sometimes the most useful tool I can find in looking at all experiences, including psychedelic ones, is to consider not just what happens to me, but how I respond in the face of it, the consequences of my actions... and in the end, how it all plays out as its own story with its own meaning inside. The truly important messages seem to show themselves perfectly after awhile.

Sometimes life throws a curveball to remind us what's really important. From what I can tell, you did everything just right. Have no regrets.

Happy Trails. :thumb_up:

 

[adam]

DMT experiences seem to have wide variation. A number of factors play into this, dose being a big one. But another factor in comfort of a trip is how fast you go from sober to hyperspace. Having some harmalas in the system or smoking a smaller dose before you smoke a "breakthrough" dose are things that help me digest the whole experience.

I also like Hiyo Quicksilvers advice, its more about how you react then anything else. Fear is a natural response though the first time you enter those realms terror, but after a while you learn to face the fear, and in my experience it evaporates as soon as you make the decision that it can't actually harm you if you don't let it. You are the master of your destiny, that can be hard to accept in the midst of these experiences but I still believe its true.

 

[Hiyo Quicksilver]

You are the master of your destiny, that can be hard to accept in the midst of these experiences but I still believe its true.

 

[Tosee]

I can certainly relate to the not coming back "this is it" end of everything feeling.
drank two teas, Syrian rue and Too much acacia confusa rootbark tea.
the most intense profound terrifying beautiful experience to date. no need go that far again

 

[Global]

I see this thread is from a few months ago, but since it has been revived, I will throw in my two cents. Piggy-backing off of Felnik's first post, there are two thoughts that got me through most trips that were overly intense or overwhelming.

#1 I'm coming back
#2 I'll be back soon (whether I like it or not)

In the case of Tosee taking too much syrian rue and ACRB tea, #2 might not hold as much, but with regular ole DMT, a little bit of patience and endurance is asked for. For longer experiences, there is stamina that comes into question as well I suppose. Mostly though, it's important to get those thoughts ingrained in your subconscious so they come up like reflexes when panic first sets in.

 

[Atlas_]

For some, like me the insatiable quest to understand these experiences is
a common byproduct. Piles of books from library on all subjects, endless research in all fields of study
microscopes, telescopes you name it.

Terrence had a great suggestion in one of his lectures he said to keep all theories about hyperspace "provisional" in other words we are always building on our understanding. I try not to get stuck on one perspective . I try like crazy to not impose too many human constructs on it, not easy to do
sounds like your on the right track, also one more thing taking a break for a while is always a good thing when it gets too intense and weird.

I still consider myself very new and at this point i'm still feeling out the lower relms as suggested by others and I hope to make some changa since Felik's advice sounds so right.

Regardless I just wanted to say how much this quote from Felnik rings true. There was a thread getting attention the other day that was asking "does dmt make you smarter" I'd definetly say it makes you more curious which leads to being smarter if you apply it. To me that is a huge, huge positive side effect. Rome wasn't built in a day and therefore you don't have to just break through for the heck of it as there are many different sides to this thing.....why rush through it just for the big cannon blast when you can take your time and truely integrate.

In the movie colors theres a great line "[to his new partner] There's two bulls standing on top of a mountain. The younger one says to the older one: "Hey pop, let's say we run down there and f@#k one of them cows". The older one says: "No son. Lets walk down and f(*& 'em all".

 

[HumbleTraveler]

I completely popped myself into that situation right now by the words Hyena used to describe it, crazy how vivid the pictures became too. Thats something that would totally happen to me, Id go look at a clock to try to calm myself and it'd just be washed out and blank. I put my phone on silent always so it doesnt distract me, and grabbed my phone once to see what time it was when I was stuck in limbo and it looked like it was the size of an SD memory card in my hand. Its a very scary and true feeling. Crossing that line where youre 110% convinced that youre dead, or if youre not dead, youre stuck in limbo is no joke. You cant truly appreciate the words without actually being there.

 

[Hyena]

Id go look at a clock to try to calm myself and it'd just be washed out and blank. I put my phone on silent always so it doesnt distract me, and grabbed my phone once to see what time it was when I was stuck in limbo and it looked like it was the size of an SD memory card in my hand.

That's a cool piece of information. I'm always happy if I can bring something back from the hyperspace that could be described to others. My friend has experienced that his laptop had Windows98 in hyperspace while in reality there was Windows 7.

I had pharmahuasca (with syrian rue) a month ago. It was my first time experience with oral DMT. I was scared that I'd end up in the fear-zone of the hyperspace again and because oral trips last much longer it made it very reasonable to be afraid of the hyperspace . Believe it or not but oral DMT gave me a rush when it first came on, the body feel was very funny and I soon felt the same taste as if I had vaped the spice instead. And then a life lesson came to me. I noticed that trip started to fade away and I was already happy because it meant I'm not going to the scary place. I presumingly started to make fun of DMT and I started to yawn A LOT. I yawned so deeply and so many times that I couldn't resist but to ask from my fellow trippers rhetorically just after yawning "would it be possible to die of yawning?". That was the stupidest question I've ever asked and I immediately got the whipping. No one answered to my question, they just turned their heads away and I felt this disturbing adrenaline filling my body as my hands deformed and I recognized the scary place. I had to go to pee but I was afraid to see my hands so I had gloves on . I had to take them off but I was scared. Then I said to myself "a man can't be that much of a coward" and finished my procedure. When returning to others I said something simple and it made it much better to hear my own voice. I noticed that this alien world faded away as I calmed down and love-based happy visuals took its place as I lied in bed and Divine Moments of Truth started playing. From that I deduced that even ONE WORD can dramatically change the experience that you're having and how you make other people feel is ultimately how you make yourself feel. Never again I will ask such stupid questions, even if they seem harmless in my mind.

 

[Archmage]

Hi all,

Just adding to the overall conversation.

I too, am currently struggling with the possibility of not coming back when engaging in psychedelics.

I am currently spending every day telling myself that I will definitely come back, but I'm having difficulty convincing myself.

I have a very very happy life. Beautiful wife, 4 amazing little boys, a good career and everything a happy man needs to be satisfied.
I tripped a bunch of times when I was younger loving every minute of them until I had one poor experience related to "not-so-nice" people screwing with my mind while I was tripping.
Now I love my life and am very satisfied with everything, but...

I also long to travel through the use of psychedelics and currently am struggling very hard with the whole "might not get back" perspective. Not that I'm dead, but that I might not make it back to this particular reality.

I

 

[Hyena]

I have a very very happy life. Beautiful wife, 4 amazing little boys, a good career and everything a happy man needs to be satisfied.

Congratulations for having a beautiful wife, that's pretty important achievement in my opinion. I've been after one particular angel myself for a year now (trying hard to win her over from her current boyfriend and luckily lately I've started to finally get some real progress). She has been the core of my will to return back to this reality during the most intense and terrifying DMT trips. I think she might be THE ONE and this feeling justifies the foul act of going after another man's girlfriend .

I also long to travel through the use of psychedelics and currently am struggling very hard with the whole "might not get back" perspective. Not that I'm dead, but that I might not make it back to this particular reality.

I

I know what you mean, that's dark. There is this feeling that everything is possible and nothing really matters. That you can choose yourself what kind of experience you are having during this lifetime. So, when it becomes self evident that you create your reality then this fear of your own thoughts appears. What if I think the wrong thoughts and therefore negative events start manifesting in my reality?

I have come to a conclusion that these dark experiences make you value your life in this reality much more.