Very horrible experience

[ndmt]

It was my third time taking DMT.
The first two times, i had only on a very low dose of DMT cause of early vomiting.
The third time i used 3,5g of Syrian Rue Powder in Capule and Ayahuasca made out of 10g Purpe Pink Mimosa Hostilis cooked with lemon juice, removed tannins with egg white and usual filtering.
Only difference from usual ayahausca:
I put it in a pan, evaporated the tea and put the sticky residue in Capsules to prevent vomiting.

T=0 Took the Syrian Rue Capsules
T=30m Took the Ayahuasca Capsules
T=1h30m Felt the first effect (took long because i have eaten before took Capsules)c
T=2h30m I saw my whole live from every Perspective possible
T=3h00m Nightmare began, i lost my ego, feel for time and everything.
I felt very alone, i lost connectivity to everything in my life, i thought it will never stop and and i'm in hell forever.
I also thought, even if this nightmare stops, my life would never makes any sense anymore.

Then i was in a loop for the next about 1,5 hours, every few seconds i got those mind crushing realizations from thoughts i can't rembember exactly now (i think my subconsciousness mind is blocking these now from remembering, to prevent becoming insane) everything dissolved and i thought i will stay in this loop forever, never becoming normal again.
It felt like it last for several hours. (But it was only for about 1h30m)
I think if this lasted a bit more longer i seriously would have jumped out of the window.

I tried to hold on objects and walls in my bathroom and tried to vomit (but didn't worked, capsules made a great job...) to make it stop.
Was rolling around on the floor, running around without orientation in my bathroom, trying not to let go of reality and my body, my whole bathroom was a mess afterwards.
I thought, when would just sit there without moving, i would loose connectivity to my body forever.

That looped for about 50 or 100 times, i don't know for sure.
I just wanted it to stop and live my normal life.

T=4h30m Thankfully it started to stop.

Inspecting my bathroom afterwards, i realized i almost knocked of the mirror above my sink, it hang very tilted.
If that would've happened i could have ended up rolling around in a pile of shards.
_____


I ended up with several bulges on my head, blue stains (hematoma) all over me knees and several bruises on my hands and face.

It was the most horrific experience in my life. So horribly that my subconsciousness mind is oppressing most of it afterwards.
I think i really almost died or become insane and i'm so happy now to be normal again and not insane forever.
It was hell.

Only little bit positive thing about that, i appreciative life a bit more now.

Things i know i did wrong:
Too high dose
I was without a experienced trip sitter
Overestimated myself


Everyone else experienced a similar trip?

I wonder what thoughts made me freak out that much, but maybe it's better to forget them.
I only know the thoughts had to something to to with my existence and the whole existence of everything.

Also would you recommend me trying DMT ever again or not?


Thanks for reading and sorry for my bad English.
And i hope you can understand most of it.

 

[jamie]

IMO that is too much mimosa and capping rue is a mistake. I dont understand why anyone would ever want to cap rue personally as it does not make you less sick than with tea. I think tea is 1000x better than gel capping anything. Having that seed material inside of me is very uncomfortable and it digests too slowly and so it tends to linger and linger and linger when sometimes I just want to come down. If you have taken more then enough harmalas to activate DMT than a slower release can sustain the DMT for alot longer and you can go for hours and hours which is not always desired.

 

[ndmt]

I also weight only 65kg/143lbs, when my mimosa hostilis root got 1,5% DMT (i'm not sure, but it's one of the more potent stuff) i would've ended up with about 150mg DMT.
Way too much, but i didn't cared, thought it will be fine.
Fully underestimated.

 

[q21q21]

Can't say mine was close to yours, probably not so intense but still horrific.

I totally know THE LOOPS, I layed for 40-45 minutes in these loops and as I opened my eyes my bed would melt outwards just like when my eyes are close when I smoke DMT and after a second or two there was very little difference between open and closed (in a bright room) and there was a different gesture from the odd partial entities, like I would only see their mouth and one arm gyrating.
All this was accompanied by deafening silence with oscillating buzzing sounds and my heart creaping slowly but pounding like a jackhammer.

I opened my eyes and suddenly I was realizing that it was possible that I did not die and that I was in fact still alive. I quickly put on the movie "ratatouille" to connect me back to life because the loops were still felt very strongly but just not "I AM DEAD AND NEVER COMING BACK" strong.

It faded and I actually had some very intense euphoria a-la smoked DMT afterglow but that shook me to my core and I didn't feel normal for weeks and have never done a strong pharmahuasca/ayahuasca trip since!

Does that sound similar to yours or am I way off?

Edit:
funny you replied that while I was writing this, the pharma I spoke of was 150mg jimjam DMT.

 

[ndmt]

Does that sound similar to yours or am I way off?

Yes, very similar to mine.

 

[meatsim]

I'm sorry you had this experience, my friend had a very similar experience on 25i-NBOMe. A reminder that the effects of these chemicals are not always grounded when going for heroic doses. Life is long, always go easy on the dosing Hope you aren't scared away from further exploration!

 

[Soulshine]

I have taken too high of a dose before as well. I forget the amount now, but i had no business taking that amount. I lost control of my limbs, and went into convolsions. Its a good thing I had two close friends with me or i could have ended up in the camp fire we had going. Things moved much too quickly for me to comprehend what was going on, like a strobe light. I embarrased my self infront of two close friends. Not only that, but my changa sessions were tainted after that. I knew it was time for a break...

That was in the begining of the summer. I am just now feeling grounded and centered enough to once again take on the challenge and responcibility that goes into these sessions. I haven't smoked weed or done any other substances in months (I wanted to get my shit straight and Ive been on a job hunt), and have been doing A LOT of meditating and pondering to get myself back on the centered and grounded path.

No one but YOU can say if you should venture out into inner space or not. Remember that. YOU must feel completely comfortable with your self and your personal state of being.

Good luck friend.

Soulshine

 

[tetra]

IMO that is too much mimosa and capping rue is a mistake.

Each body reacts differently. While you say capping is a mistake, as it is for you, I say people need to find out for themselves. I read horror story after horror story of people capping rue, so I did tea the first time. Felt no ill effects, capped it up every time since. I've take up to 6.5gms powdered rue in capsules and felt not the slightest illness.

Granted, my body craves these things and I have a higher-than-normal tolerance to ALL substances I've tried (except alcohol), including DMT. I'm not proud of my tolerance, I wish I could get "there" with as small a dose as most, but my body just eats it up and asks for seconds.

 

[wolvz]

first like to say hello again to all my fellow nexus friends, haven't been on here in quite sometime.

ndmt,
had a very similar experience on pharma earlier this year The power of pharma! - Welcome discussion - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus. I felt the loops strong, my head was spinning so fast and I couldn't focus on anything. I remember my head jerking around in different directions constantly and I couldn't control it. My head was literally shaking vigorously and I remember picturing a my head as a lightbulb bursting into millions of pieces. I couldn't purge no matter how hard I tried and I felt like I was never coming back. It was a very intense and frightening experience. Great post.

 

[Global]

IMO that is too much mimosa and capping rue is a mistake. I dont understand why anyone would ever want to cap rue personally as it does not make you less sick than with tea. I think tea is 1000x better than gel capping anything. Having that seed material inside of me is very uncomfortable and it digests too slowly and so it tends to linger and linger and linger when sometimes I just want to come down. If you have taken more then enough harmalas to activate DMT than a slower release can sustain the DMT for alot longer and you can go for hours and hours which is not always desired.

I cap it for no other reason than the taste makes me gag. After puking that stuff enough times combined with the fact that I never liked the smell/taste to begin with because it reminds me too much of rotten coffee (and I hate the smell of lots of kinds of coffee).

 

[ndmt]

Some time passed and now i understand what the problem with the trip was.
DMT triggered and/or increased derealization and the resulting panic attack.
I had the same (but not that strong fortunately) derealization and panic attack after that trip, but without dmt (never tried dmt again), one time without any drug and a second time after smoking weed.

So DMT is not to blame alone, it "just" triggered a hidden psychic problem.

But i have to add, i have depression, social phobia and maybe some other problem for over 10 years.
I will go into psychotherapy now and will avoid any kind of drugs (at least until i feel better, maybe never again).

So my advice, if you have any psychic problems, don't do dmt, it can intensify them.
Would only recommend dmt if you feel very stable, healthy and lucky.
I think dmt is not a good method to acutally cure some psychic illness (heard sometimes, that people say they cured their psychic illness with dmt), but that's only my personal experience, everyone is different.

 

[bigmack]

My first ayahuasca experience was pretty much a doomsday plot from day one. I have written a trip report about it on this forum somewhere if your interested.

Basically, I kept failing and failing at ayahuasca - either throwing up or brewing it wrongly.
I eagerly added more and more mimosa and syrian rue trying to get the number's right, when really I should have been educating myself rather than rushing things.
I have it documented at 35 grams mimosa and five grams syrian rue the night of the nightmare [I wrote it down prior to consumption].
I remember arrogantly telling a fellow nexus member how much I had cooked up, of course he told me I was a complete bafooon.
I assured him my body would expel the brew before all of it absorbed, if indeed this turned to be a case of having taken too much.
If you haven't figured by now, I thought my material was bunk - when really I wasnt cooking it right.

SO i took the the rue in towel napkins, followed by the drink 45 mins later... suffered the worst nausea of my life... and suprisingly didn't puke!!
I was excited for a while knowing it was coming on... and then... one hour passed, two hours passed... nothing!?
Feeling rather defeated - i told myself I'm done with ayahuasca... it doesn't work for me.
I went to my kitchen and grabbed a cherry danish
[which is so unlikely of me, because to this day, I have yet to see a danish of any kind in my house and really have no clue how it go there. AND I hate cherries!]
I went to my basement, having just finished the danish, sat in front of my piano and began to play.
Five minutes into fiddling around on the keys - I noticed an unprecedented improvement of flow and skill in my piano playing.
I felt like a young Mozart - and to those who are interested, I strongly feel like this experience alone has kicked up my piano playing several notches since.

And then it hit me - a tensing in the neck, athritis-stricken hands suddenly discontinued dancing atop the keys, my head began to drupe to the side as I stared heavily across the room
[at nothing in particular].
And besides that, there's not much else I remember.
I know that everything began to swirl in a really strange way, like the room seemed to start collapsing in on itself, like a vortex.
I remember jumping off the chair in front of my piano terrified and panicked... sccurying as quickly as possible over to my bed, lifting the sheets over top of me and literally, descending into madness.
I had read very little about the aya journey prior to this - which proved to be interesting [post-trip] though, horrifying [during].

The only thing I remember of the actual trip which is the entire reason I've included my story in your thread was this one period of [seemingly many, many hours]
where I was rocking back and forth on my knees in absolute disarray, praying and pleading,
repeating the same sentence over and over in my head: "I deserve this."
Also, my heart was RIPPING out of my chest during this time.

As the years went on since this journey and I finally regained the strength and eased my way back in to the possibility of ayahuasca, becoming more accustomed and respectful of the plants that are part of this brew.
I realised one thing... and one thing only: I didn't have a bad trip because of MHRB/DMT.
Without a doubt it was terrifying because of the massive dose - although I dont exactly remember much of it.
But the real reason why I felt [quite literally and physically if I may add] like I was dying, rocking back and forth, pleading to emerge untarnished,
heart ripping through my chest... was because...
syrian rue is a nasty fucking thing - and I took way to much of it.
Since then I've discovered rue is active at as little as 1.5-2 grams for me.
I haven't taken more than 2.5 since. And nowadays I wouldn't even consider eating or brewing it - only the extracted alks I would use.

It is almost certain, had it been five grams OR two grams of rue, I would have had an equally unnerving, explosive result.
Afterall, I definetly came out of the trip having regressed to the intelligence of a three year old, unable to speak english - not because of the rue, but because the DMT. Unless, I hit my head or something in which case neither would be held accountable, but I'm pretty sure the DMT was responsible for what was a three-hour aftertrip of inability to form words and absolute bewilderment.
The difference was the over-abundance of a somewhat toxic substance in my system... having twirled me and steered the direction of my trip.

I bring to you this experience as a warning and model of sometimes how and why things go wrong.
My words of wisdom to you - no matter how much DMT you take, believe me, you will recover.
Have the respect for yourself, you so certainly deserve - and give yourself a period of grace, to assimilate and quantify.

I hope you can one day revisit ayahuasca or at least look upon your trip in a positive way.

 

[VisualAnemia]

The loops are as classic as they are horrible, the question is to why this is, personally I've become so afraid of the loops that I may jump out of my skin from as little as a choppy radio transmit or bad television connection They remind me of the loops...loops...loop...looooo... In some sense they are both quite funny interesting, why do we experience them? What is to be learned from them?

I think alot of us can recognize ourselfs in your situation, especially with the ayahuasca trialage

 

[dtrypt]

Caapi > Rue

You need the vine or its extracts for a proper oral experience...

 

[rjb]

I totally feel you brother. But hey, cheer up, there's more of us who went at some point through this. Myself included. For me, they taught me a very important life lesson: that I needed to improve my life, because I was stuck doing the same repetitive things over and over and over again. In my relationship, in my work, in everything I was doing. Things were taking a turn for the worse, for the first time in my life, I was losing "it". So I was struck hard by those loops, as you can imagine. This is why it's said that psychedelics don't show you what you desire, but rather what you need to see. Since then, I took a couple of months break from tripping, and done some real life changing work. In all domains listed above. Now I'm happier and more confident than I ever was.

I tried a low dose of mushrooms a couple of weeks ago and had an amazing experience with a meditation session. I can't wait for the spring to come so I can start exploring outdoors. But anyway, I'm rambling now...

The loops are as classic as they are horrible, the question is to why this is, personally I've become so afraid of the loops that I may jump out of my skin from as little as a choppy radio transmit or bad television connection They remind me of the loops...loops...loop...looooo... In some sense they are both quite funny interesting, why do we experience them? What is to be learned from them?

Hope ^that helps somewhat. Love & peace,

 

[Tona]

I feel exactly same as you guys. I ODd myself too. I thought I was smarter than that. 15 grams of mimosa + 4 g of rue. Lot of people have the impression that safety of DMT-trip is given by safety of setting. But, IME, sanity is very delicate thing. After my bad experience I was never the same. I felt totally drained, alone and sick of life for 6 months.

The scariest thing is that I could have died. I woke up in my own vomit, which means I purged during my trip, without being aware of it. This is extremely dangerous and possibly lethal, because you can easily inhale your own vomit and choke.

I dont mean to scare anyone off, I had BEAUTIFUL trips with aya. This is just the other side of the coin. Be aware of it please, as it may be the last thing you do.

 

[tango]

So my advice, if you have any psychic problems, don't do dmt, it can intensify them.
Would only recommend dmt if you feel very stable, healthy and lucky.
I think dmt is not a good method to acutally cure some psychic illness (heard sometimes, that people say they cured their psychic illness with dmt), but that's only my personal experience, everyone is different.

You're right on that last point: everyone is different. While I don't personally know anyone on this forum, my guess would be that many if not most people who embark in psychedelic explorations don't necessarily feel stable, healthy and lucky.

Also, it's worth mentioning that, while therapy may help or do nothing, it's not likely to completely cure someone's mental issues. As for prescription medication, it's trial and error. One can expect to have some very bad experiences in the process, so one may as well take a chance with psychedelics.

I feel like plain smoked dmt is the safest way to go under the above mentioned circumstances. The experience is so overwhelming and so short that one can't really dwell on inner conflicts that something like an acid trip could bring to the surface and rub in one's face for 10 hours.

 

[nen888]

..i think it is to do with the P. harmala and possible dietary/metabolic toxic reactions..i have described similar reactions involving syrian rue before..
[see: title change: WORST EXPERIENCE OF MY LIFE! NEED INTEGRATION HELP! - DMT Experiences - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus]

..i personally recommend pure DMT on it's own as being less likely to lead to complications than with Harmalas..ß-carbolines necessarily lead to an increased focus on health and 'shamanic'/healing practices...

 

[aliendreamtime]

Be aware OP, that if you take small doses in the future, they will probably cause flashbacks.

I think the dose was just too big. Its the difference between seeing something bad about yourself and being uncomfortable with it and seeing something bad about yourself sending you spiralling into the depths of hell for hours and hours (been there)

Psychedelics can be useful in breaking habits and gaining insight, but they dont just do that. You have to learn to use them as a tool to get those results.

I'm no expert here, as I am planning a MHRB + Rue experience soon. However, after careful consideratin and research, I've decided on 2.5g rue and 5g MHRB. Erowid is full of obvious overdoses with 10+ g of MHRB.

Always take it slow. Dosing is deffinately part of the art of dealing with these substances.

Like others said, only you can decide if you want to visit these places again. If you do, dont bother with DMT. Smoking it will likely scare the shit out of you and send you right back into that experience. (This has happened to me with salvia overdose sending me back into a mushroom overdose).

Try a low dose of mushrooms- they are generally reliable dose-wise.

And finally- treat these plants with respect and they will return it. Thats is the only single constant I've come across in all of my tripping days.