What are we breaking through?

[the Cake]

I mean, "hyperspace" is a word, and words are great, cause they give us power by giving us a context with which to describe what we are experiencing. But what is this "hyper-space" that we are trying to break into? If none of us spoke English, how (in English) might we describe IT?

If i wanted to describe the inside of my eyes when i fall asleep, i could refer to that as "dreaming." When i enter REM sleep i "break into" the dreaming. But i'm not really "breaking into" anywhere i haven't already been, i'm simply being put in direct contact with my own psychology.

But i've also had dreams where i've talked to other psychologies. Psychologies that were, in all likelihood, not entirely my own.

So, when i took DMT and the message i recieved said "Welcome, we're so glad you finally met us" and "See?! i Knew he'd like it!" are those DMT-specific voices? Has anyone contacted those characters without using Ayahuasca? Most trips i've been on, like LSD or mushrooms, have a "show, not tell" kind of vibe. Even dreams rarely get that explicit. On chenga i was communicating directly with the universe.

And some of that universe can be thought of as archetypal beings, gods, ancestors, passed down from prehistory to now via Jung's esoteric psychobabble, and bubbling up into my chemically-altered psyche to bring me a message of pure love. Love and happiness and acceptance and reconciliation and recognition and dignity and love. Like, oh em gee, so much fucking love. Grandeur, and life everywhere, and universal love connections. good stuff :d

 

[۩]

Well, I believe physicists regard hyperspace as the dimensions superseding space-time.
Which I think is really cool considering the context in which we use the word.
If you were to ask me, the definition is spot-on.

 

[Ayawasqero]

A fourth dimension? Dunno man, just askin´...

 

[evil804]

im in the last chapters of Dr. strassman's spirit molecule, and like one of his theories. He speculates that DMT alters the brains chemistry so as to allow us to perceive dark matter. Dark matter is an energy source found throughout space that is only detectable through its gravitational effects. Its like our current physiology can only tune into a few frequencies, and DMT allows us to upgrade our antenna, and tap into otherwise undetectable channels.

personally, i believe we are tapping into the consciousness of the plants when ingesting DMT. I do worry about their intentions sometimes, as they seem to want me to distance myself from other humans and spend more time with them. Its like they give you a lightshow and bodyload in exchange for your soul. Im not sure how they benefit from us crossing over into our realm, but they do seem to want us there.

 

[Xt]

One thought was that in the DMT "space" everything appears to be made of light. Well we all know about the physics of light and how it interacts with the medium of time. This could explain why some experiences feel "outside" of linear time, or some maceration of it.

I like House's sentiments about the word Hyperspace also.

 

[justine]

Well, I believe physicists regard hyperspace as the dimensions superseding space-time.
Which I think is really cool considering the context in which we use the word.
If you were to ask me, the definition is spot-on.

Actually space-time continuum is already an hyperspace just like any space of dimension greater than 3.
The word "hyperspace" is also used to describe a space with non-euclidean geometry.

 

[۩]

Thanks for the clarification, fascinating stuff.

 

[the Cake]

The word "hyperspace" is also used to describe a space with non-euclidean geometry.

Do you think the internet is a non-Euclidean space?

like 3 right angles make a triangle on 4chan, but the Nexus is saddle-shaped.

 

[Ljosalfar]

personally, i believe we are tapping into the consciousness of the plants when ingesting DMT. I do worry about their intentions sometimes, as they seem to want me to distance myself from other humans and spend more time with them. Its like they give you a lightshow and bodyload in exchange for your soul. Im not sure how they benefit from us crossing over into our realm, but they do seem to want us there.

Fascinating... This is certainly a traditional view of vegetalistas and shamans... SWIM has only a few trips under her belt and is interested in "listening to the plants" on future journeys. Any ideas/experiences connecting to plant spirits specifically?
She recognizes this may be slightly naive - attempting to precisely influence or extract an experience from spice may form expectations and make things limited/uncomfortable. And yet, applying skill with the plants is possible. Ah, the balance! - developing skill and influence while remaining open with love and gratitude, to borrow a phrase from a Nexian vastly more experienced....
Regarding what plants want - check out The Botany of Desire - Pollan's perspective that plants have evolved in part through human desire is quite compelling.
Thanks,
L

 

[shishigami]

I haven't broken through but I have gotten very close (seen entities) and I believe that DMT (and other molecules) allow our suppressed subconsciousness to be analyzed. This is why many profound and deep personal revelations occur in these drug altered states.

 

[gibran2]

It’s never as simple as we think it is. Or maybe it is. I guess it depends on what we think.

Sometimes, the realms I visit are clearly the product of my mind (on pharma, my journeys have so far been exclusively of this type). I know that what I am seeing and experiencing is revealing something about the workings of my brain/mind. I can communicate and interact with various aspects of my personality. I can marvel at the complexity of the brain.

Other times, there seems to be a strange “hybrid” of the internal and external. It’s as if my mind creates the stage, but the actors are visitors from elsewhere.

There are other experiences (virtually all of my deeper breakthroughs) that are undeniably not of my mind, at least not in any way that I understand “mind”. A door is opened to a very alien realm. It is utterly, totally alien. No archetypes, no elves, nothing relatable, nothing remotely human or earthly. Yet there is order and coherent structure – a logical, plausible reality unlike anything I could possibly imagine. Not another planet in a distant galaxy in a far corner of our universe, but another universe altogether.

 

[taureanirishman]

just watched a NOVA special on consciousness btw...
While I love the idea that this mole helps us tap into an underlying hyperspace/reality, and can even see why we'd think that. Given the sheer numbers of people relating similar experience and imagery it's completely understandable. But what if it's biology....

These compounds of dmt/jimjam seem to resonate a specific type of experience, what if it's been hardwired into humanity? What if the shamanistic experience is directly tied into what it means to be human and has become a fundamental biological expression in how our brains develop. We've spent millions of years evolving beyond the trees and spirituality was something far more pervasive that it is today. It could have even been a survival trait...
I think it's possible we're breaking INTO instead of THROUGH. Just like iron makes hemoglobin work, perhaps it takes these compounds to make consciousness work, at any level. The Universe is a far stranger place than our species is capable of understanding scientifically, and we're constantly being surprised by how much we have to learn.

Thoughts?

 

[xebiche]

Rule of Thumb: EVERYTHING makes sense. There is nothing in this Universe that cannot be understood. We are allowed to do more than dwell - we can deduce. I can promise all of you this: Put Garrett Lisi, Brian Cox or Michio Kaku in a room with bucket of Changa for a week one of them would walk out of there with not just an answer for "what is hyperspace"... If they got started, those guys wont stop till they hit pay dirt. Their Holy Grail - Black Holes. I await that day.

Look , hyperspace is a dimension unto itself. IMO I am not going to create an additional dimension and just label it "hyperspace" when we are already hip to a dimension that seems to comply. Dark matter/energy has properties like anything else. Dark matter/energy is currently undetectable (for the most part). Dark matter/energy is not effected by gravity or for that sake matter itself. IE. it passes through stuff while maintaining its integrity. Gravity and density both effect Time as well. The characteristics are too similar (in comparison) to simply ignore.

Dark matter/energy is the rest of what is out there according to our scientific undetstanding. Hyperspace seems to fill in a similar blank. Hyperspace seems to either be - or reside within dark matter/energy. When we travel though any space we are unknowingly traveling through a soup of dark matter/energy. Hyperspace offers additional cosmic properties such as vortices. Vortices look and perform like wormholes.



We consider ourselves to be solid. This is not so. We - like all matter - are comprised entirely of space. We are atoms. There is such VAST space between atoms. Hyperspace/dark matter DOES NOT begin at the exterior of our skin and extend outward and beyond from there. Dark matter flows through matter, through us. It occupies the space between matter. In a very real way We are comprised almost entirely of dark matter. All living things have the "space" to host Atman.

 

[Ljosalfar]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
While it is stimulating and fun to conflate bleeding-edge physics and our own drug experiences, it is essential to acknowledge that WE DON'T KNOW. For me, this is a radical and liberating realization which opens the door wide to curiosity, humility, wonder, and yes, more knowledge!
L

 

[open'nheart]

Well, I believe physicists regard hyperspace as the dimensions superseding space-time.
Which I think is really cool considering the context in which we use the word.
If you were to ask me, the definition is spot-on.

Actually space-time continuum is already an hyperspace just like any space of dimension greater than 3.
The word "hyperspace" is also used to describe a space with non-euclidean geometry.

Perhaps its unnessesary to go off topic in this way, but i find it helpful to remember...
it is an inaccurate to apply euclidean geometry in the measurement of any form in the 3rd dimension. the nature of our world is far from linear, as is the thinking of euclidean geometry.
euclidean geometry has a way of rounding off the roughness of the surfaces it is measuring and is therefore only an approximation...it is not real. not in our our dimension anyway.
i'm of the opinion that the euclidean way of thinking has killed the mystique and magic of nature, and it has been rather effective at numbing the scope of human awareness.

regarding coastlines: (or any edge. look closely, it twists and turns...the closer you look, the more surface you observe. all boundaries are fractaled and seem to blend into one another)

"All measurment methods ultimately lead to the conclusion that the typical coastline's length is very large and so ill determined that it is best considered infinite. Hence...length is an inadequate concept." Benoit Mandelbrot.

I observe the boundary between hyperspace and ordinary reality to have a similar quality...an elusiveness that slips through the fingers of he who tries to graps it.

 

[Seraph]

I was never welcomed into hyperspace, I nearly got crushed by a hyperspace boat in my first journey into hyperspace.

 

[the Cake]

I was never welcomed into hyperspace, I nearly got crushed by a hyperspace boat in my first journey into hyperspace.

Damn, that sounds thoroughly un-fun! Who brings a boat to a swimming pool?? Hope all is well

 

[DoctorMantus]

personally, i believe we are tapping into the consciousness of the plants when ingesting DMT. I do worry about their intentions sometimes, as they seem to want me to distance myself from other humans and spend more time with them. Its like they give you a lightshow and bodyload in exchange for your soul. Im not sure how they benefit from us crossing over into our realm, but they do seem to want us there.

Too Me its sounds like it obviously wants to have a symbiotic relationship i think thats one thing that us humans must learn because having symbiotic relationships with nature only connecting you more and giving you a higher understanding on human nature.

 

[FastFourierT]

regarding coastlines: (or any edge. look closely, it twists and turns...the closer you look, the more surface you observe. all boundaries are fractaled and seem to blend into one another)

"All measurment methods ultimately lead to the conclusion that the typical coastline's length is very large and so ill determined that it is best considered infinite. Hence...length is an inadequate concept." Benoit Mandelbrot.

It is true however the simplicity of it all must also be appreciated. The axioms that define it fit well to what "an eye can see" and what "makes sense". such as two hypothetically perfect lines will not intersect. I dont think one is likely to find much grace in abstract and not-too-intuitive concepts of non-euclidean world(some do tho).

I also like how quick/presice/easy approximations can be made (mathematically defined as "good" approximations). ie helped people make/build shit without the nano-accurate measuring devices of today, using fairly simple methods. This further translates into your point about the coast-lines with its infinite boundries(come to think of it as you hypothetically zoom in further on anything material, area keeps increasing and increasing, going from cells to molecules to bosons? can we say whats really the smallest building block at this point?) as there are very graceful "SIMPLE OBJECTS"(that can be imagined) with infinite surface area and finite volume, and with finite surface area but infinute volume, that can be fairly easily approximated. SWIM realizes much of it can't be "measured" in a classical sense since currently we view the smaller buildings blocks as more of an energy than a particle, however he generalizations like that help him make sense of the world.

Pardon for the tangent, and this is not in any way to invalidate/disagree with your point, however SWIM could not keep his appreciation for euclidean world to himself.

 

[open'nheart]

regarding coastlines: (or any edge. look closely, it twists and turns...the closer you look, the more surface you observe. all boundaries are fractaled and seem to blend into one another)

"All measurment methods ultimately lead to the conclusion that the typical coastline's length is very large and so ill determined that it is best considered infinite. Hence...length is an inadequate concept." Benoit Mandelbrot.

It is true however the simplicity of it all must also be appreciated. The axioms that define it fit well to what "an eye can see" and what "makes sense". such as two hypothetically perfect lines will not intersect. I dont think one is likely to find much grace in abstract and not-too-intuitive concepts of non-euclidean world(some do tho).

I also like how quick/presice/easy approximations can be made (mathematically defined as "good" approximations). ie helped people make/build shit without the nano-accurate measuring devices of today, using fairly simple methods. This further translates into your point about the coast-lines with its infinite boundries(come to think of it as you hypothetically zoom in further on anything material, area keeps increasing and increasing, going from cells to molecules to bosons? can we say whats really the smallest building block at this point?) as there are very graceful "SIMPLE OBJECTS"(that can be imagined) with infinite surface area and finite volume, and with finite surface area but infinute volume, that can be fairly easily approximated. SWIM realizes much of it can't be "measured" in a classical sense since currently we view the smaller buildings blocks as more of an energy than a particle, however he generalizations like that help him make sense of the world.

Pardon for the tangent, and this is not in any way to invalidate/disagree with your point, however SWIM could not keep his appreciation for euclidean world to himself.

carpentry is a practice that I can appreciate. I'll give Elucid credit for his contributions in practicallity.