What is a breakthrough anyway? (i just smoked 3 times)

[Voidmatrix]

what the hell is this drug? How can such an alien experience be a part of us?

Don't trust anyone who tells you they know the answer to that question. The only thing I know for certain about DMT is what you just expressed.

Hahahahaaa Yeeessss! Hence why I entertain all possiblilities and commit to none!

And why I scoff and giggle inside when someone tries to delineate their convictions about DMT, especially with a prose that's attempting to elicit agreement.

One love

 

[Kitisha]

My experience with your question from item 2 is these things are so vivid and real, that my normal waking state feels shadowy and translucent/watered down in comparison. I don’t know if everyone gets that, but even low doses (10mg) are extremely clear with high levels of complexity and dense color saturation.

Regardint faintness of visuals - good BT dose you wont even be able make sense of surroundings at the start, reality will become much different and they will twist it into another reality, you cann't even realize eyes are open or not at the moment, what is eyes anyways? It won't be just visuals, full immersion better than any VR headset 1000x times.
Some doses just teleported me there skipping all the foreplay.

Alright, i definitely didnt experience anything like that. I hope i will at some point.

I guess I’m one of the “lucky” sensitive ones. But that makes it harder for me to take the dive, because after twenty plus years of exposure to this molecule, a tiny dose is still pretty overwhelming for me, every time.

Regarding achieving BT, if you keep using and integrating, your tolerance will drop. Not much meeded for BT, for me anything after 25mg was danger zone

Oh, i had no idea it works like that with dmt. I did experience the same thing with weed, back when i was abusing it. I started smoking it very young and used it daily for a couple of years. I loved the effects and used it as an emotional crutch. Eventually i would get straight-up panic attacks after smoking even a little bit. It was as if the weed became way too potent for me to handle. I managed to quit years ago, but now, even if i just take a puff from a joint, i have to lay on the couch and wish for it to be over.
I hope i dont get to that point with dmt.

If you’re not on any medication or what have you, that might interfere with how you metabolize the molecule, or don’t have a natural metabolism that processes the molecule before it gets to your brain, then I imagine you’ll get there at some point. It takes a lot of people a while to get dialed in.

I quit using SNRI antidepressants about 6 months ago, so they realistically should not be influencing me anymore. I do use kratom almost daily, but i could not find anything that suggests it interfiers with dmt. I should probably avoid MAOIs tho.

null24 wrote:
Quote:
what the hell is this drug? How can such an alien experience be a part of us?


Don't trust anyone who tells you they know the answer to that question. The only thing I know for certain about DMT is what you just expressed. Big grin


Hahahahaaa Yeeessss! Hence why I entertain all possiblilities and commit to none!

And why I scoff and giggle inside when someone tries to delineate their convictions about DMT, especially with a prose that's attempting to elicit agreement. Big grin

One love

I agree with you guys!

 

[highwire]

Just read through your experiences, good stuff. I like the way you describe these things. Really straightforward and relatable. I really enjoyed reading about the flowing, happy dancing room and the creatures you witnessed.

For me a breakthrough is an OBE/fully dissociated state. I can no longer feel my body and probably don't remember that I have one until the peak experience wears off.

From there, I guess I mostly label the intensity based on how long it felt like I was in that dissociated state/the level of immersion I experienced. I think its worth sharing that I don't always find breakthroughs to be more challenging compared to sub-breakthroughs. For me, it's more about the content and the emotional quality that shows up.

-

Also, heads up if you're using kratom and psychedelics at the same time. It's an antagonist for 5-HT2A receptors, the primary target for most psychs. The implications of that aren't really known. I did find two stories on Erowid where people who took kratom in combination with psychedelics had seizures. One of them was definitely in combo with mushrooms, the other one I can't remember.

It's possible this might not cause dangerous effects. But, 5-HT2A antagonists have been shown to reduce the effects of LSD, so it could contribute to your tolerance.

I just save the kratom until after the peak effects, and keep the dose low.

-

"it is suggested that mitragynine would also have the ability to reduce negative symptoms (alogia, avolition) through antagonism at serotonin 5-HT2A and 5-HT2C receptors."

Focus: Plant-based Medicine and Pharmacology: The Potential for Kratom as an Antidepressant and Antipsychotic

Mitragyna speciosa, otherwise known as kratom, is a plant in the coffee family (Rubiaceae) native to Southeast Asia and Thailand whose leaves have been shown to cause opioid-like and stimulant responses upon ingestion. The major pharmacologically active ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"With reference to the hallucinogenic effects of LSD it appears that its binding affinity for the 5-HT2A receptor is responsible. 5-HT2A antagonists effectively block any hallucinogenic action."

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/neuroscience/5-ht2a-antagonists

 

[○]

Kitisha a great report/read. I vibe with much of what you said and some of your descriptions.

Sometimes the sentences people use in describing [at least at face value] this experience, at least at this level, for me it brings much of it back.

Thanks for writing

 

[Kitisha]

Highwire, damn i didnt know that about kratom. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I researched if they are safe together, but i somehow completely missed this. I have no history of seizures and have taken psychedelics+kratom multiple times, so im not really worried there. At least with mushrooms, i didnt notice any lessened effects compared to taking mushrooms only. I stay a mile away from lsd. Had some bad experiences + the duration is too long for me.

I will give a shot to abstaining from kratom before my next dmt. It almost makes me want to create a thread on kratom+dmt combo, to see how others react to it.

And yeah man, the happy dancing room was something

 

[Kitisha]

tatt, thanks man! I too like to read others experiences

 

[Yneffable]

Kitisha, are you using sumatriptan (the injection used for cluster headache)?
The sumatriptan molecule is a frankeistein-dmt.
Or have you ever used this medicine for your illness and have had any unusual reactions such as ineffectiveness? (I'm thinking that an unusual reaction to sumatriptan might explain an unusual reaction to dmt, such as different sensitivity, but that's a guess)

 

[M0K0]

So hello these experiences sound wonderful and i wanna share my personal thoughts to them.

What this substance is... i cant tell you but most of us are aware of these creatures wich so few people have seen.

In the subbreakthrough area there is a portal.
Everybody sees it different and interprets it differently but it seems to open a new world in whom there are these dimensions wich are often presentned in kind of rooms wich seem to emerge out of the mandala.

If you are near enough but not completly broken through you can see into these dimension and also the living within.

And i totally agree with the dance.
To me it seems like in this realm there is not purpose to solve so you are able to dance... like this kind of way, wich does not meen there is no "energetic" work done.

Also i totally agree that the line is not clear and you can see 3 dimensional enteties in lower realms beyond the so "called" break through area and there are doses far beyond this area where no patterns and entities appear.

For me personally the breakthrough point is dosed at around 30+,- 5mg of nearly perfectly vabed pure NN-DMT (you can taste, see and smell if you burn it).

At this point you can hear a ringing wich will integrate into your experience, there is clear transition from this dimension into another, i can see myself entering this demsion and leave my normal territory of awareness.

It does not just feels like a transition of your visuals or mind state but in transition between "locations" or frequencies.

have fun, be safe

 

[○]

Here's a few older threads that discuss this. Not detracting from this thread, just figured these links would offer some additional information:

definition of breakthrough
Breakthrough definition?
What is a true breakthrough?
what is a breakthrough?
Please Define DMT Breakthrough.
Was this a breakthrough?

 

[Voidmatrix]

Here's a few older threads that discuss this. Not detracting from this thread, just figured these links would offer some additional information:

definition of breakthrough
Breakthrough definition?
What is a true breakthrough?
what is a breakthrough?
Please Define DMT Breakthrough.
Was this a breakthrough?

Good share!

I sometimes wonder if it's a bit overrated and if we put too much stake in defining a "breakthrough." Granted, many of us are conditioned by a western paradigm of thought, wherein there is the appearances of exactitude and clear cut defining, so there's no surprise that we tend to gravitate those directions.

One love

 

[PolarisZ]

I've had my own breakthrough uncertainty, with mixes of visual clarity, immersion, and what exactly I was seeing.

While trying to write up a history of my previous DMT trips, it stirred up some trip memories I had forgotten, and seemed to have forgotten immediately after the trips. These usually happened at the start, but I would find myself in some sort of candyland colored room, I'd have very poor awareness of my surroundings aside from the colors, and my visual focus would shift towards, things, for lack of a better word. All those combined are probably why I ended up having such poor memory of it, in addition to not having much of a sense of what I was looking at. At the time I was writing off those trips as failed breakthroughs in a colorful waiting room, but now I'm not so sure.

In addition, I had body awareness trips where I saw nebula, albeit with very poor focus, and generally had a half in, half out feel to it. I've even had that happen on 15mg.

The most potent trips however, always seemed to have me inside colored rooms, with no entities. Similar candyland theme to what I described above, but much, much clearer surroundings.

 

[compulsimple]

I want to pop in here really just to share. I thoroughly appreciate everything in this thread. I feel like a pebble in a lake

I'm inexperienced with DMT and Ayahuasca. I have had an experience with Acacia Confusa goo full of those goopy plant oils and such. I didn't really have a way of vaporizing it and I actually held a regular lighter to a metal bowl with a makeshift mouthpiece to prevent my lips from burning but I did get a very decent amount of vapor and I had held that in for as long as I could with determination.

I didn't actually truly realize; truly realize, what would ensue. I mean, after this I just understood what a breakthrough was. I think there's more to come later in life as I come back to experimenting with DMT and Ayahuasca. It's so cool, that discovery and foray

I think that my awareness of being in-body was relevant for a really short period during that explode. I remember being in a lot of awe as my consciousness lost its own self in a natural disaster of the senses like a rocketship or a hurricane; a manifestation so profoundly experienced with lucidity that it borders between the thin line of physical, real, and psychological. There was a tone of the basic emotion of surprise experienced in sharp brilliant shock and catharsis

I got to experience unfathomable synesthesia and the crossing of taste and smell with my sense of being in-body. I think there was a very lucid and potent hallucination during that first and intense peak where I had blown or exploded into gooey textures and sticky liquids. The out-of-body experience was really remarkable because beyond lucid dreaming and one experience with sleep paralysis I had never actually experienced that much of the out-of-body experience; and this was particularly intense and exceeded any expectation I had preconceived of in my imagination prior to experimentation.

I remember traveling through planes and constructs of fractal horizon, through gooey, wet, sticky, colorful oozing worlds. During a period sometime after peaking and that "really intense ripping off of the bandaid that would be your in-body experience" when I was settled into the experience, I traveled with two entities representing my conception of Indigenous ancestors; a medicine man and women (both partners) and was complimented with companionship like that of a mentor trying to pass on support through guidance and I was given love by both and particularly the message to accept love. [I believe that to just be my own preconceived paradigms - I come from the perspective that DMT is a unique drug, but none the less a drug induced hallucination - that's an understatement]

I am not always so able to open my heart. It's harder than you think if something equally profound like depression or family dysfunction or addiction clamps your heart, and I will say that I really appreciate being able to have that experience where I'd let go of my loss of control and could submit to being a passive observer.

I think during the plateau I experienced existential quandary. Had I died? Who am I? Will this drug wear off? I had the anxiety toward the tail end that I had actually passed away. Soon after the effects of DMT had taken course I felt satisfied with my experiment and experience. It proved life changing and thought provoking. It was really cool to experience something like that at 19 years of age while the world is your oyster (still young, latter twenties)

I had a stint with Ayahausca too; I didn't have much in terms of visions. I had a lot of physical touch-oriented manifestations. Buzzing frequencies through my body and ecstasy, ecstasy, and ecstasy. I used meditative body movements combined with intentional breathing; like dancing is to prayer. I also wept, sobbed, cried after the initial peak of ecstasy where I had been laughing and grinning previously. I experienced mood swings like never before lol :shock:

Both experiences were fantastic. I prefer Ayahausca.
I also have had many experiences with Psilocybin. Psilocybin has helped me with treating depression. My first time that I had used psilocybin I experienced intense empathy for people with mental illness, for friends and family members in the group setting, and for the hundreds of thousands of homelessness in the U.S. (tied to my empathy for people with mental illness).

I also had a wonderful chance experience with psilocybin near to the time when Lawrence Ferlinghetti passed away. This is a really interesting coincidence; I briefly mentioned it in my introduction essay compulsimple: an introduction essay - Introduction Essay - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus This was a much more recent experience with Psilocybin. I mean, FUDGE in his death he impacted the living eternity out of me as a mentor and it was randomly when I had decided to take a plunge into psilocybin once more.

Go watch the interview on Ferlinghetti while taking mushrooms or LSD or your preferred choice of psychedelic and pair that with some of his literature. The pocket poets series is really great reading for during, before, and after tripping. Poetry can be very psychedelic, sexual, and itself a form of integration

again, love you all and happy to share with everyone

 

[tripbox]

I dont think it really matters whether you broke through or not, but id say you probably havent but you're close.

i think when people question it, they probably havent, although sub breakthrough trips can be pretty heavy or spectacular especially if your vision is completely taken over by visuals and sometimes you can trip all sorts of things.

for me, even the Psychedelic element can be vastly different on similar doses.

you can reach the 'control room' fairly easy, but i find the intensity and vibration that its presented in apon arrival is generally a clue to whether ill be punching through it.

i need to take that last hit, just as i arrive and before i lose awareness of my body. most times i dont remember blowing back out.

sometimes i think ive been shut out, one time recently just where normally i might have had a breakthrough, time just stopped, it was a little uncomfortable feeling, theres a drip in my kitchen sink, i heard like a slow motion drip sound and when it hit the water, it was like an echo chamber and time went shhhheeewwwwplopppppp, it was like i was looking through my eyes at myself frozen in a reality, as reality was split, then this voice said 'watch this, watch this', there was a heavy fractral entity playing with some control panel, and it started moving time forwards and backwards with a dial, 'pretty good huh' it said, i think i pulled myself back and kind of snapped out the trance a little.

lol, it then communicated not to worry it was going to perform some repairs to my body, huh?, i felt as if my whole body was shaking violently almost as if i was having a seizure and every cell in my body was vibrating. my vision cleared a little and i could make out my body, it looked fairly still and the feeling slowly subsided, all was good..

i didnt class that as a breakthrough... the reason i say this is due to the way it tapers off rather than a sudden return, but i did catch myself snigger later in the day a few times recalling parts..

s.

 

[Voidmatrix]

I dont think it really matters whether you broke through or not, but id say you probably havent but you're close.

i think when people question it, they probably havent, although sub breakthrough trips can be pretty heavy or spectacular especially if your vision is completely taken over by visuals and sometimes you can trip all sorts of things.

for me, even the Psychedelic element can be vastly different on similar doses.

you can reach the 'control room' fairly easy, but i find the intensity and vibration that its presented in apon arrival is generally a clue to whether ill be punching through it.

I think generally this can be the case, but I feel some people are unable to discern if they have or not due to having expectations that don't line up with the experience so it becomes hard to categorize, or being due to not know how to make such a judgment in the first place.

Also, it doesn't seem that everyone will reach certain kinds of apparently "common" spaces, like the "control room."

Good share.

One love

 

[tripbox]

I dont think it really matters whether you broke through or not, but id say you probably havent but you're close.

i think when people question it, they probably havent, although sub breakthrough trips can be pretty heavy or spectacular especially if your vision is completely taken over by visuals and sometimes you can trip all sorts of things.

for me, even the Psychedelic element can be vastly different on similar doses.

you can reach the 'control room' fairly easy, but i find the intensity and vibration that its presented in apon arrival is generally a clue to whether ill be punching through it.

I think generally this can be the case, but I feel some people are unable to discern if they have or not due to having expectations that don't line up with the experience so it becomes hard to categorize, or being due to not know how to make such a judgment in the first place.

Also, it doesn't seem that everyone will reach certain kinds of apparently "common" spaces, like the "control room."

Good share.

One love

the onset for me is quite predictable and although i sort of remember the 'control room' when straight, its only when i arrive i remember it fully again.

a tip i would give people is right before you trip, always practice some deep breathing and expanding your lungs to full capacity, even stretch your chest a little, alot of people shallow breathe, sit at desks all day, and everything is tight.. and it also helps you to relax.

s.