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Which SPIRITUAL TOPICS are 100% the TRUTH?

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kyrolima

kyrolima

Rising Star
I'd wish to discuss, which spiritual topics are truthfull and which not:
If you want to post on any topic, i'll post your allocated conclusions in this first post!
I'll begin to write some topics down and i'm open for discussion!

existence of:
soul, chakras, alternative dimensions, entities, god.


I consider as 100% truth:
existence of:
soul,
chakras


Don't know if this thread is a good idea. I hope it gathers much audience!

Maybe we can discover even truth of health speculations, political topics or religious topics.

I'm open for every discussion!
 
One thread to rule them all :p

I think other dimensions are possible. Whether they exist or not I can't say, but we can certainly apply math to the Nth dimension. We have computer generated objects that "theoretically" could exist in a fourth dimension. Then of course you have the "Flat-land" theory which attempts to explain the dimensions up to the fourth if I recall; it's a pretty decent idea on paper anyway. Haha, get it, on paper?.....Ya......lol

Entities, I assume you mean other life forms in the universe. I would say it's highly probable given the number of galaxies and planets out there, we do exist on this planet after all. I see no evidence to suggest that life doesn't exist elsewhere...

Although, I present a weak argument I suppose. Our inability to understand something doesn't really "prove" that it's possible.
 
Other dimensions may exist but they if they exist they are probably super small and curled up like in string theory. But again highly speculative.

Chakras are definitely not real in the traditional sense.

Soul it depends how you define it. If its an immaterial force responsible for our consciousness then no its probably not real. If its the old definition for the ticking of our brain looked at in the modern sense of brain creates mind then sure. But the term has spiritual baggage attached so I wouldn't use it.

Entities if you mean dmt entities they are probably not real. If you mean aliens then most likely they are out there but I do not think they have ever visited earth.

God is also probably not real if its personified. If its the star that blew up to create us then sure.
 
Wow Mr_DMT you went straight for the basics. I was thinking of finding out what spiritual practices are 100% truth and work our way backwards. For example let's say what is 100% Truth is something that can be replicated by everyone. So if something is possible but only a few talented psychic individuals can do it let the percentage drop. Therefore:

1) Meditation/Enlightenment is ?% Truth
2) Seeing the future/Prophecies is ?% (example: Edgar Cayce, Nostradamus)
3) Fortune Telling is ?%
4) Astral projection/Astral Travel is ?%
5) Aura Viewing is ?%
6) Remote Viewing is ?%
7) Channeling is ?%

I think that a large chunk of the population if not all can achieve enlightenment, astral projection, aura viewing, and remote viewing.

When it comes to seeing the future, fortune telling, and channeling I'm not sure if everybody or even the majority of people can do it, with the proper training, mostly because of my limited knowledge in those fields.

The only thing I can conclude is that I believe in a core that makes me and can never be destroyed. Call it my consciousness or my soul, doesn't really matter. Also I believe in the collective consciousness or the Great Spirit, if you will.
 
Oh burnt your use of the word "probably" sprinkled here and there is heavenly music to my ears. :)
 
MetaXIII said:
Wow Mr_DMT you went straight for the basics. I was thinking of finding out what spiritual practices are 100% truth and work our way backwards. For example let's say what is 100% Truth is something that can be replicated by everyone. So if something is possible but only a few talented psychic individuals can do it let the percentage drop. Therefore:

1) Meditation/Enlightenment is ?% Truth
2) Seeing the future/Prophecies is ?% (example: Edgar Cayce, Nostradamus)
3) Fortune Telling is ?%
4) Astral projection/Astral Travel is ?%
5) Aura Viewing is ?%
6) Remote Viewing is ?%
7) Channeling is ?%

I think that a large chunk of the population if not all can achieve enlightenment, astral projection, aura viewing, and remote viewing.

When it comes to seeing the future, fortune telling, and channeling I'm not sure if everybody or even the majority of people can do it, with the proper training, mostly because of my limited knowledge in those fields.

The only thing I can conclude is that I believe in a core that makes me and can never be destroyed. Call it my consciousness or my soul, doesn't really matter. Also I believe in the collective consciousness or the Great Spirit, if you will.
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My opinion on the following questionable topics:


1) Meditation/Enlightenment is ? 100% Truth I know how a silent mind feels like. Meditation is not placebo :D
2) Seeing the future/Prophecies is ? 100% there are numerous examples (mayan, ancient cultures etc.)
3) Fortune Telling is ? goes under 2)
4) Astral projection/Astral Travel is ? 100% Truth, I did that myself, so i know or very strongly believe that this is reality!
5) Aura Viewing is ? Again, I saw it myself. How can you not believe in it if you see it for yourself...
6) Remote Viewing is ? you mean seeing through other eyes? I'm not sure about that, but jimdeKorne a psychedelic author wrote about it in some of his chapters
7) Channeling is .. maybe the thruth. I never saw a person do it nor do I believe this kryon crap or whatever they try to sell you.
I don't know about this one.


Maybe we could lead the discussion in this way:

If someone totally disagree and want to prove the non-existence of certain things, then please add substinancial evidence or studies, so others can follow their argument.

Otherwise it's just an opinion, just like my statement
 
Nothing can remain 100% truth as we live in a constantly changing universe.

I'm not even sure there is such as thing as 100% truth...as truth itself can be a very subjective term, depending on the perspective of the observer.

I exist. This statment might be the truth right now, 90 years from now this truth won't be valid anymore....and even now, do I exist, how do I prove this beyond any doubt?
 
I knew that this discussion won't find any conclusion.
Because reality is subjective! Every man and woman is determined part of by his being and by his experiences.
Therefore anybody will have a different truth.

Some may be similar, but never exactly the same.

So... if i can conclude that - almost every discussion is pointless!

Either you believe or you know.
If you know and you can not prove it, there is no point in discussion! How can i convince somebody else of a part of my truth when there is no evidence.

Maybe we should close that thread.
The only thing i can hope is, that some people get curious and start to get interested in such topics.

Because if the individual grows, it is not only that one specific one who grows, - everybody will benefit from it.
At least that is my believe!
 
Dont close the thread, I think we could get some good points across here. Maybe we should discuss what is true to us personally.

Meditation is great, i dont do it as often as i should, but when i do, i feel great results afterward. Its also not so cut and dry, it took me awhile to actually understand it, and get results.

The first time you meditate is almost a joke, most people cant relax enough, mentally and physically, and its not easy. It comes down to practice, the more you do it, the better you get at it, and the more results you'll notice from it.
 
1) Meditation/Enlightenment is ? 100% Truth I know how a silent mind feels like. Meditation is not placebo Very happy
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This doesn't prove anything. Meditation induces an altered state of consciousness and you happen to know what the state feels like thats all it means. You can call it enlightenment and its probably the same experience buddha was talking about but that doesn't imply anything supernatural or that your mind is separate from your brain/body.

2) Seeing the future/Prophecies is ? 100% there are numerous examples (mayan, ancient cultures etc.)
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No there aren't. There are vague interpretations made by scholars and vague writings and symbols from ancient cultures. There is no convincing evidence that anyone anywhere has been able to "see" the future. Its always possible someone can predict the future and get it right but that doesn't mean they "see" the future in their minds eye or in a vision whatever.

3) Fortune Telling is ? goes under 2)
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All fortune tellers when put to the test are shown to be frauds. Magicians who specialize in this stuff have even shown how the tricks work and stopped other ones dead in their tracks by knowing their tricks.

4) Astral projection/Astral Travel is ? 100% Truth, I did that myself, so i know or very strongly believe that this is reality!
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It doesn't matter that you experience an OBE. So has SWIM. Just because you experience something doesn't mean you interpret it correctly. There are many examples of how the brain fails to interpret reality correctly from optical illusions, psychosis, brain damage etc the list goes on. There are many explanations for how OBE's can come about without involving anything actually leaving the body.

5) Aura Viewing is ? Again, I saw it myself. How can you not believe in it if you see it for yourself...
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Again it doesn't matter that you saw it yourself. For the same reasons I state above. People who are about to have seizures tend to see aura's too.

6) Remote Viewing is ? you mean seeing through other eyes? I'm not sure about that, but jimdeKorne a psychedelic author wrote about it in some of his chapters
7) Channeling is .. maybe the thruth. I never saw a person do it nor do I believe this kryon crap or whatever they try to sell you.
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Again both just misinterpretations of subjective experiences.


Subjective interpretations of subjective experiences such as altered states of consciousness does not equal conclusive evidence.
 
I knew that this discussion won't find any conclusion.
Because reality is subjective! Every man and woman is determined part of by his being and by his experiences.
Therefore anybody will have a different truth.

Some may be similar, but never exactly the same.

So... if i can conclude that - almost every discussion is pointless!

Either you believe or you know.
If you know and you can not prove it, there is no point in discussion! How can i convince somebody else of a part of my truth when there is no evidence.

Maybe we should close that thread.
The only thing i can hope is, that some people get curious and start to get interested in such topics.

Because if the individual grows, it is not only that one specific one who grows, - everybody will benefit from it.
At least that is my believe!
Click to expand...

No all reality is not just subjective. How can you assume that the human consciousness is the well from which all reality springs forth?

There is plenty of evidence for an objective reality outside our senses. There is no evidence for what you are claiming.
 
Lets not get into the subjective/objective thing again, it's really a deadend nowadays guys, the argument can always be flipped back onto itself and that makes it impossible to have a productive discussion about it.

Back to the idea of 100% spiritual truth.. I've got to say first of all, it's a very vague question where all kinds of questions pop up, what defines a spiritual topic? specifically related to a spirit/body proof, proof that we have a soul/spirit that is separate from our physical world? because I'd have to query the capabilities of the spirit, because of course my mind is an abstract, it is a virtual "spirit" but I suspect you mean a kind of spirit that exists when your body is disintegrated?

Well, as is always said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, so to prove that you'd need really quite conclusive proof and I don't believe any exists.

If you are talking about a broader thing, there are some interesting things I can talk about from another point of view. The spiritual movement often encompasses many different ideas, most of which are vague, indescribable and under-developed... as with all things though, a lot of movements start with a grain of truth and I do believe the non-spiritual world is largely unaware of how far your mind can travel on psychedelic drugs, especially DMT, I used to be a person who believes there was literally no truth in the spiritual experience what so ever, until you know what, then I started to realise that the experience is extremely vivid and it's all done internally, it's all anecdote, I didn't even realise you could do that, and I've had some that are so vivid that in all my logic, I'm still left a little unsure... so I'm not prepared to say there isn't something, some aspect of truth in the spiritual/new-age "scene"...

I mean, it's kinda ridiculous that so much real scientifc experimentation is actually performed by people who are largely anti-science, and the science folks dont understand the significance of that experience either... it's a shame really, what I'd like is for the "spiritual" folk to start doing/understanding science properly, and I'd like the science folks (me) to spend more time appreciating the beauty that they spend most of their time trying to understand.... we kinda need to meet in the middle.
 
Lets not get into the subjective/objective thing again, it's really a deadend nowadays guys, the argument can always be flipped back onto itself and that makes it impossible to have a productive discussion about it.
Click to expand...

I think there is plenty of evidence for an objective reality. People here just don't want to accept that because it means that interpretations of subjective experience can be wrong. Since most people here base their spiritual beliefs on those experiences they don't want to accept that they could be way off. That's the real problem with having discussions about subjective/objective. There is also plenty of people who seem like scientists to back up that argument with vague claims and misunderstandings of modern science.

If you are talking about a broader thing, there are some interesting things I can talk about from another point of view. The spiritual movement often encompasses many different ideas, most of which are vague, indescribable and under-developed... as with all things though, a lot of movements start with a grain of truth and I do believe the non-spiritual world is largely unaware of how far your mind can travel on psychedelic drugs, especially DMT, I used to be a person who believes there was literally no truth in the spiritual experience what so ever, until you know what, then I started to realise that the experience is extremely vivid and it's all done internally, it's all anecdote, I didn't even realise you could do that, and I've had some that are so vivid that in all my logic, I'm still left a little unsure... so I'm not prepared to say there isn't something, some aspect of truth in the spiritual/new-age "scene"...
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There is truth in it but that truth need not involve any supernatural explanations. That's my problem with spirituality in general besides the lack of evidence and the contradiction with modern more accurate and backed up explanations for how things work.

Why call a psychedelic experience a spiritual experience at all? I can have beautiful psychedelic experiences without needing to invoke explanations that involve telepathy, conscious entities, astral projection, or any of the other nonsense that people claim explains their experience.

I mean, it's kinda ridiculous that so much real scientifc experimentation is actually performed by people who are largely anti-science, and the science folks dont understand the significance of that experience either... it's a shame really, what I'd like is for the "spiritual" folk to start doing/understanding science properly, and I'd like the science folks (me) to spend more time appreciating the beauty that they spend most of their time trying to understand.... we kinda need to meet in the middle.
Click to expand...

I am open to anything but spiritually minded people are not open to it even if they say they are. Many spiritual phenomenon such as telepathy, mediums, OBE's, and mystical experiences have been investigated by science. Yet people still refuse to accept the evidence and continue to invoke explanations that contradict science. Many of these ideas have been shown to be false such as mediums and mind readers astrology etc. Explanations about spiritual experiences coming from imaging studies and brain damage and psychedelic drugs reveal that something is happening in our brain that may explain these experiences.

But don't you see that this evidence counters the spiritual belief that "because I experienced it and because I can interpret anyway I want because its all subject then its true"? This is why these arguments go nowhere. Spirituality is really a religion because subjective interpretations is not evidence but faith that you are correct. We can study this stuff but the spiritual side will fight tooth and nail at any piece of evidence that contradicts beliefs of its adherers as it and religion has always done in the past.
 
burnt said:
I think there is plenty of evidence for an objective reality. People here just don't want to accept that because it means that interpretations of subjective experience can be wrong. Since most people here base their spiritual beliefs on those experiences they don't want to accept that they could be way off. That's the real problem with having discussions about subjective/objective. There is also plenty of people who seem like scientists to back up that argument with vague claims and misunderstandings of modern science.
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I agree with you, but you do understand that everytime you say that, it's just so easy for the opposing side to say "well that's your subjective view of it" or some other bs flipback... it's inevitable.. don't waste your time dude.
 
burnt said:
There is truth in it but that truth need not involve any supernatural explanations. That's my problem with spirituality in general besides the lack of evidence and the contradiction with modern more accurate and backed up explanations for how things work.

Why call a psychedelic experience a spiritual experience at all? I can have beautiful psychedelic experiences without needing to invoke explanations that involve telepathy, conscious entities, astral projection, or any of the other nonsense that people claim explains their experience.
Click to expand...


Look, again I agree with you, in fact I agree with almost everything you say and in other posts... but I think this point is key, I agree, the spiritual experience is just part of reality, but that was my point, the scientists don't even know the "spiritual" experience exists, the spiritualists don't seem to realise this is not supernatural and science still plays a part in it's explanation, even if it was. This is what I mean about meeting in the middle, what it really is, well that doesn't make it any less significant. I think the spiritual folk are almost disappointed when they find out the real explanation, and they shouldnt do that.
 
burnt said:
I am open to anything but spiritually minded people are not open to it even if they say they are. Many spiritual phenomenon such as telepathy, mediums, OBE's, and mystical experiences have been investigated by science. Yet people still refuse to accept the evidence and continue to invoke explanations that contradict science. Many of these ideas have been shown to be false such as mediums and mind readers astrology etc. Explanations about spiritual experiences coming from imaging studies and brain damage and psychedelic drugs reveal that something is happening in our brain that may explain these experiences.

But don't you see that this evidence counters the spiritual belief that "because I experienced it and because I can interpret anyway I want because its all subject then its true"? This is why these arguments go nowhere. Spirituality is really a religion because subjective interpretations is not evidence but faith that you are correct. We can study this stuff but the spiritual side will fight tooth and nail at any piece of evidence that contradicts beliefs of its adherers as it and religion has always done in the past.
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Yeah, I've noticed that, there are loads of hippy-free-for-all types that think they're really free and open, but in reality, demonstrate more xenophobia and more ignorance than their non-hippy counterparts... it's an absurdity... there are people on both sides that don't listen to arguments and don't confront them, they pull shit like "let's agree to disagree" which is just a selfish way of saying I don't believe your arguments... but the question of reality and truth is going nowhere... I think you're ultimately coming from the right perspective with this, but I don't think you've realised yet that the whole objective reality question could be wrong, you're almost stating that as fact the same way the spiritual folk are, and I'm sorry burnt, but scientists and philosphers have been tackling that question for thousands of years... you shouldn't be so strident about that conclusion, because it's constantly argued about and it can go around in circles.

The spiritual phenomenon you mentioned, well most of those are just silly, I wouldn't waste a single breath on them, I'm only concerned about the questions that are still asked by both scientists and spiritual folks, if it's been fully explained in science, then it's not really in my interests anymore... I've given up trying to convince people, focus on the people that are on the fence.
 
Actually burnt, I think this forum is a good example of what I'm talking about.... I'm a scientist, I believe we're all scientists, doing science to differing degrees of success... the academic kind is king because it's formalised but for myself, I'm interested in topics that are actually criminal in the academic establishment, frowned upon by society and I'm interested in experiences that hardly any of these people experience or understand at all... so I refer to places like nexus which to be honest, is very unscientific but I approach it with a scientific mindset to find whatever truth I can find... and when it comes to reality, in all situations, the truth is all we should be looking for.
 
I'm sick of this idiotic arguments burnt. Even scientist can't explain reality!

Look at quantum physics, where they already came to the conclusion that light and atoms are the same!
It's not that easy. They even found out, that if you watch a specific atom it actually behaves differently then if you wouldn't watch it.

Some other research regarding DNA! They are super interesting. They placed DNA in an airtight independend room, the same DNA was somewhere else. Now, if one of the DNA was changend. the other changed the same way. There is no connection physically between it. You can call this an information transfer.
I'm not 100% sure about the setup of this experiment so don't cry out if you know it better :)
But the basic idea and also the conclusion of the scientists is, that there is some unknown way of transferring information.

You see there are plenty of examples for science experimenting and can't explain it.
Of course there are experiments who prove the non-existence of something. But maybe if they changed the experiment a bit, they maybe would get another result!

You simply do one thing: You say categorical that all spiritual topics are nonsense and superstition.

Yet there is reality on the one hand and on the other hand is you. If you take away the "you", reality disappears. At least for you. You may logically say, that reality won't disappear, but can you experience that? NO!

Now, can you see where the wind blows?

Science is not the holy grail!

another example:
I'm not sure if you saw the documentation about a woman who had a difficult brain surgery and they put her in an artificial coma.
After the surgery she reported of an OBE. Could describe details of the room where she was operated which she couldn't know at ALL.

If you think that is a hoax, then please prove it.
This story was actually on CNN :)

So please don't discard everything as esoteric blabla.

I'm not seeing this as the ultimate proof for the existence of a soul, but it's a strong hint! And my personal experience supports this view.
 
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