Why turn freebase into fumarate? What is the point?

[behindthelight]

I just watched this 20 minute video where this guy shows the entire process of extracting DMT from MHRB. Well, after getting the DMT freebase, he then adds it to heptane and then adds that to acetone and fumaric acid to get DMT fumarate.

What is the point of this? Is it only if you want to swallow it?

Can't you just put the freebase into some OJ to achieve the same effect?

Also, what is the point of putting it into the heptane? Is that just a required step if you want to turn it into DMT fumarate?

 

[The Day Tripper]

So he did fasa (fumaric acid saturated acetone) with heptane? Thats interesting. Did not know that was possible. Think i might just try that sometime with fasi.

The point of making it fumarate is its much more stable, and degrades/oxidizes much less than the freebase. Its also a dry powder or crystals that are not waxy at all. FB in oj is just fine, for long term storage fumarate conversion is your best bet though.

Its afaik the best salt to have something in to prevent degradation. Salts will last orders of magnitude longer than freebase stored at the same conditions. Fumaric acid being especially resistant to degradation and used widely for other synthetic tryptamines, including the stuff straussman used in his study. And if you have some freebase that has extra crap/gunk/oils/fats/solvent leftovers (hopefully not), you can make it a fumarate and wash it with acetone that should strip away any impurities. Then freebase it again and freeze precipitate out of heptane for nice clean xtyals. I've done this a few times and it works well.

I like it because you can do fasi/fasa and get some really nice crystals of pure dmt-fumarate. Its kinda fun like freeze precipitating large crystals of pure freebase. Which in conjunction with a fasi/a salt conversion using calculated amounts of acid will give you a very pure product.

So if you have an itch to get something as pure as possible its a useful technique. Mabey you have an itch for some crystal porn :lol:. Or if you prefer gelcaps and just want powder. I usually mix the fumarate in an acidic juice or just a shot of water, gelcaps don't agree with my throat. Caapi is delicious and i have no problem drinking a brew. MHRB brews are vile, and worse than cactus imho. Freebase in OJ is just another option you can take. They all work, just have their differences.

The point of the heptane as i see it, is the heptane has the freebase dmt soluble in it. The acetone has fumaric acid soluble in it. You mix the two together, and dmt-fumarate crystals form and drop out of solution as they're completely insoluble in the heptane, and ~1mg per ml in the acetone. Extra fumaric acid should stay in the iso.

However, i've never seen this done with naptha, heptane, or other hydrocarbon solvents before. Its usually done with fumaric acid containing iso/acetone, and fb dmt containing xylene/dlimonene/iso/acetone.

I'm actually planning on doing this tomorrow (fasi/acetone) to really clean up some fumarates i have, and if heptane worked, it would be fun to try that instead. Is this a possibility?

 

[behindthelight]

So he did fasa (fumaric acid saturated acetone) with heptane? Thats interesting. Did not know that was possible. Think i might just try that sometime with fasi.

The point of making it fumarate is its much more stable, and degrades/oxidizes much less than the freebase. Its also a dry powder or crystals that are not waxy at all. FB in oj is just fine, for long term storage fumarate conversion is your best bet though.

Its afaik the best salt to have something in to prevent degradation. Salts will last orders of magnitude longer than freebase stored at the same conditions. Fumaric acid being especially resistant to degradation and used widely for other synthetic tryptamines, including the stuff straussman used in his study. And if you have some freebase that has extra crap/gunk/oils/fats/solvent leftovers (hopefully not), you can make it a fumarate and wash it with acetone that should strip away any impurities. Then freebase it again and freeze precipitate out of heptane for nice clean xtyals. I've done this a few times and it works well.

I like it because you can do fasi/fasa and get some really nice crystals of pure dmt-fumarate. Its kinda fun like freeze precipitating large crystals of pure freebase. Which in conjunction with a fasi/a salt conversion using calculated amounts of acid will give you a very pure product.

So if you have an itch to get something as pure as possible its a useful technique. Mabey you have an itch for some crystal porn :lol:. Or if you prefer gelcaps and just want powder. I usually mix the fumarate in an acidic juice or just a shot of water, gelcaps don't agree with my throat. Caapi is delicious and i have no problem drinking a brew. MHRB brews are vile, and worse than cactus imho. Freebase in OJ is just another option you can take. They all work, just have their differences.

The point of the heptane as i see it, is the heptane has the freebase dmt soluble in it. The acetone has fumaric acid soluble in it. You mix the two together, and dmt-fumarate crystals form and drop out of solution as they're completely insoluble in the heptane, and ~1mg per ml in the acetone. Extra fumaric acid should stay in the iso.

However, i've never seen this done with naptha, heptane, or other hydrocarbon solvents before. Its usually done with fumaric acid containing iso/acetone, and fb dmt containing xylene/dlimonene/iso/acetone.

I'm actually planning on doing this tomorrow (fasi/acetone) to really clean up some fumarates i have, and if heptane worked, it would be fun to try that instead. Is this a possibility?

I only watched the video once, I don't think he ever mixed the heptane with the acetone. But there was a heptane step before he did the acetone/fumaric acid step.

Anyways, thanks for this reply, the long term storage thing makes sense. I was curious because it seems like a lot of extra work if you weren't really getting anything out of it, but the storage thing makes it worth it I guess.

 

[The Day Tripper]

Huh. So he was prob doing fasa into freebase in acetone. That works pretty good too. Acetone can hold a whole ton of freebase. The heptane step was prob the freeze precipitation. Then he converted the freebase into a fumarate in the next step. Dude knows how to get a pure product for sure. Got a link to the vid? sounds interesting