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2 questions of spiritual experience and DMT

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AlbertKLloyd

AlbertKLloyd

Rising Star
OG Pioneer
If you are not someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why would you have one on DMT?

If you are someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why wouldn't you have one on DMT?
 
If you are not someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why would you have one on DMT?

i dont know...i'm not even sure what i'd define a 'spiritual experience' as, but i know what you mean i think..i guess i'd say that perhaps because dmt is dmt- a chemical ally that can bring unconscious content to the forefront and rip the veil between your humdrum illusory 'idea' of reality and a direct jaw-dropping experiencing of the astonishing miracle of existence and uncanny level of peculiarity and silliness of this whole situation.. IMO it can serve to help permanently alter/remove some stubborn culturally-acquired filters and boundaries...that conditioning that lay between you and a tangible sense of connection with and appreciation for this mysterious and unusually beautiful cosmos we find ourselves in..and that can humble almost anyone to tears

If you are someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why wouldn't you have one on DMT?

maybe they'd need to smoalk moar 😉
 
AlbertKLloyd said:
If you are not someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why would you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

Same reason someone can turn to christ at the age of 30. Realizations often arise with the intense or profound.

AlbertKLloyd said:
If you are someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why wouldn't you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

'Cuz some folk are douche's!
 
It activates the right brain. If you dont have spiritual experiences you dont have a very active right brain. If you already have a very active right brain then you will most likely be having some sort of "spiritual" experiences..and I dont know why DMT would not give you those experiences..unless you analyze everything to death(which is left brain not right brain activity)...If you are mostly left brain dominant you most likely analyze everything and perhaps that voice in your head wont shut up unless you take a really large dose of DMT and smaller doses will just annoy and confuse your ego or left brain consciousness.

It is all abotu hemispheres IMO.
 
AlbertKLloyd said:
If you are not someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why would you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

Because it will probably be an experience unlike anything you've ever had.... .or cause you to remember things which you have forgotten. Fantastic things that are so beautiful you'll wonder how you could possibly forget, and yet you did anyway, and clung to this closed minded view of life anyway, and you'll wonder why you haven't been having spiritual experiences all the time.

If you are someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why wouldn't you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

They probably would. I don't know why they wouldn't.
 
i had the first "spiritual" experience of my life at 28 on 3.5g of P. cubensis fungus. My 2nd, on 3g of the fungus. my 3rd, on 2g. then 10 years went by. my 4th was on 4g, my 5th on 3g, my 6th on 5g, my 7th on 6g, my 8th on 5g, my 9th on 7g and my 10th on 5.5 g of the same fungus. Enter DMT. 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th. then 15 on mescaline, a handful more on fungus, dmt and mescaline. Then a few with more "party" combos, that launched me into territories my consciousness had no choice but to accept as OTHER.

i am no longer SAME.

I had never sought a "spiritual" experience, having been raised a hardcore materialist atheist, but there it is, irrefutable: i was thrust into the burning bush, kicking, screaming and in awe and terror of the ensuing ecstasy - and horror.

If your point is that we find what we seek, then i must vehemently disagree, having made the short and staggering journey from NO to WTF, to the acknowledgment that i am only equipped to ask, but (certainly ironically), not to receive answers i am unprepared to comprehend.

this, in the shell of a nut, is what the "ality" of spirit is.

Ask. expect naught. revel in nothing, and exalt in all.

JBArk
 
soulfood said:
AlbertKLloyd said:
If you are not someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why would you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

Same reason someone can turn to christ at the age of 30. Realizations often arise with the intense or profound.

AlbertKLloyd said:
If you are someone who has spiritual experiences in general, why wouldn't you have one on DMT?
Click to expand...

'Cuz some folk are douche's!
Click to expand...

I second that.
 
Life is a spiritual experience.

There are an infinite number of miracles transpiring in every second. It is a truly miraculous wonder that atoms can even form at all. Scientists can measure and talk about the strong and weak nuclear force... but they have no idea why it should exist.

Rationality, despite being one of the most precious gifts we have, is often the biggest stumbling block in being able to accept that something is spiritual. Miracles can not be rationalized.

Spiritual experiences are glimpses of the infinite and miraculous nature of existence. It is happening all the time. Those who don't see it are blind or purposefully ignoring it. Those who have spiritual "experiences" are blind people with intermittent flashes of inner sight (insight) or truth. Those who experience the spiritual all the time don't see it as being so. Aborigines didn't have a word for sacred or holy when they met the westerners... when explained what it meant, they said isn't everything that?
 
Hyperspace Fool said:
Aborigines didn't have a word for sacred or holy when they met the westerners... when explained what it meant, they said isn't everything that?
Click to expand...

Love this :d
 
Hyperspace Fool said:
Life is a spiritual experience.
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I like this very much.

I have had many spiritual experiences, rarely have they involved psychedelics.
I do not consider psychedelics spiritual or non-spiritual in any special sense
like any tool, they can be used in many ways.

Existence is spiritual in nature.
The material and the spiritual are inseparable.

every thought is a spiritual act,
the content of it is like a spell that we cast
we either open ourselves, without belief or disbelief
or we close ourselves with belief or disbelief

it is very hard to experience what you are not open to
even when it is there, you may not notice it
 
Well...

wasn't basing that on spiritual insight either from experience or observation. I just think that if you are open to the spiritual and can't find something that matches with that in the DMT experience, you must be going in with a fairly stubborn mindset.

Or have naturally meditated yourself to the point where you're in hyperspace already by will... though I always find those kinds of things hard to believe.
 
Interesting opinion.

Mine is of DMT like a mind tool that is incapable of being spiritual in and of itself,

I have had numerous spiritual experiences, including with many psychedelics, but have never had a spiritual experience that coincided with a DMT experience.
Maybe i will one day.

the sole exception to this is aya, but then for me harmine increases spiritual sensitivity and the spiritual experience is still there with aya taken without DMT added to it
 
soilbiologist said:
Spirituality is "our attempts to approach higher consciousness", per my definition...
DMT is Universal Conscousness.
Click to expand...

what about DET?
NN-Diethyltryptamine.

Isn't a lot of the spiritual rhetoric surrounding psychedelics just an argument of justification based on subjective perceptions that have no empirical or objective basis?
 
AlbertKLloyd said:
soilbiologist said:
Spirituality is "our attempts to approach higher consciousness", per my definition...
DMT is Universal Conscousness.
Click to expand...

what about DET?
NN-Diethyltryptamine.

Isn't a lot of the spiritual rhetoric surrounding psychedelics just an argument of justification based on subjective perceptions that have no empirical or objective basis?
Click to expand...


I do see your point, however, DET is not an endogenous neurotransmitter.

There is something to this stuff we call DMT, and that is why we are all here.
 
AlbertKLloyd said:
soilbiologist said:
Spirituality is "our attempts to approach higher consciousness", per my definition...
DMT is Universal Conscousness.
Click to expand...

what about DET?
NN-Diethyltryptamine.

Isn't a lot of the spiritual rhetoric surrounding psychedelics just an argument of justification based on subjective perceptions that have no empirical or objective basis?
Click to expand...


While it's true that DMT is just one drug of many, I do believe the states of mind it opens one up to are beyond the concepts of "subjective", "empirical" and "objective". They are beyond abstraction. I have accessed them without psychedelics too as have countless many and that proves to me there's something more going on than getting fucked up on drugs.

There is an underlying reality of self-knowledge that can be reached many ways, DMT being one.
 
I love DMT and work with it, but I don't believe it is a Neurotransmitter, just that it can act as a funky one when inserted into the right synapses.

Has it been shown that DMT is a neurotransmitter?

I've been reading old papers on it and it is getting frustrating. I have not been able to find evidence that it is a neurotransmitter.
 
embracethevoid said:
There is an underlying reality of self-knowledge that can be reached many ways, DMT being one.
Click to expand...
What do you mean underlying reality?
And self-knowledge, what kind of knowledge is this?
I was not even sure self existed outside of language.
I believe in sorcery, but also that the effects of psychedelics are explainable in physiological terms to the point that we can even engineer artificial molecules designed to have specific effects, DET being a good example

I believe that there is something special to the potential these molecules have, but that they are not in and of themselves spiritual or representative of consciousness. That certainly has not been my experience in over 15 years of using them spiritually. Spiritual intent makes all the difference for me, when I breath air with it, even a breath of air becomes sacred, like a sacrament, I enjoy psychedelic sacraments but have seen a lot of people take these things in many settings over a number of years and do not see an overt theme of spirituality to their use.

I can't say i believe that they bring enlightenment to those who use them. there are a lot of people who treat them as a religion, thinking as many sects do that their use gives them insights that other sects lack, this is common human thinking for any religious group though and it seems that people who take psychedelics are normal humans and come in a variety of spiritual flavors and colors...

i do think that friendly open minded spiritual people are more likely to do psychedelics though
 
^^

As far as I know, whether it is actually a neurotransmitter or simply can function as one is not completely established. It IS endogenous though... and not just to humans, but to basically every living thing we know of. That alone, is more important than whether or not a scientist can prove that normal people under normal circumstances use it in the way we do say serotonin or melatonin.

Obviously the body has some use for DMT or it wouldn't make it. Furthermore, it has no known uses outside of the CNS/ Brain. It is likely that it IS a neurotransmitter, that is reserved for very specific and special circumstances. People have hypothesized near death, spiritual awakening, pineal stimulation etc. Who knows?

I am interested to hear about people's experiences with other DMT like tryptamines and their comparisons to the authentic spice. Things like DET, DPT, MET, MIPT... also the 4-aco versions, the hydroxies, the POs, the 5's etc. (The more detail the better IMO)
 
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