basic equipment required for DMT / mescaline extraction

[mrdub]

Hello, am sure this must have been discussed but my searches have failed me to find the information in a single thread. So my apologies in advance, but as this is the welcome area, I figured us newbies are given some slack


So as title, what would be the basic equipment required for DMT / Mescaline extraction. I mean things like separation funnels / containers / beakers / flasks.

Not to a pro chemist level, but for a beginner who doesn't mind spending some money on things that will make his life easier. The wife won't be too happy if I start using her bowls and utensils so will be looking to purchase it all

I know the teks have a list, but a lot of the time they just seem to say "this or that will do".

Am not looking for something "that'll do", but something that will do the job well (for a beginner). If something will make my life easier to spend a few $$ rather than "making do", that's kind of what am looking for

Also any discussion on materials as seems like plastic / glass are often options with a big difference in price. Is glass always better? Why?

Cheers (and again sorry if is already covered, I'm sure I will find the threads covering it as soon as I post this - tis always the way

 

[bismillah]

The reason they say "this or that will do" is because this or that really will do. Lab quality glass and equipment is not at all needed for extractions—except maybe gloves, a stir rod, and goggles (don't tell anyone but I skip the last two). Even plastic is safe, although I personally opted for a big ol' pickle jar and some mason jars for precip.

If you look up "lab glass" on Amazon you'll find a bajillion different kinds of flasks and beakers. As your main vessel you will probably want an Erlenmeyer type flask that's just about the exact volume you need for your tek. The narrow neck makes it easy to pull the naphtha.

 

[BongQuixote]

For basic organic chemistry of this type I would recommend getting

Hotplate with a magnetic stirrer and temp probe
Magnetic stir bars
Assortment of Erlenmeyer flasks with stoppers
Assortment of Beakers
Buchner funnel with vacuum filtration
Vacuum pump, the manual "bicycle pump" ones work well
Filter paper for the funnel
Coffee filters
Pipettes of various sizes
Separation funnel with lab stand (somewhat optional)
PH meter (optional but very helpful)
Assortment of jars with lids of various sizes
Dedicated stove pots for extractions
Pressure cooker
Gloves
Mask
Apron

This is what I started out with, and then you can always supplement as more needs arise depending on what you want to do. Lab equipment on Amazon is cheap, so no point is using regular household items if you have the $$ for a dedicated setup. My SO freaked out when I was boiling Acacia bark in the pasta pot. I would also recommend finding a spot where you can leave the stuff set up that is far away from food. I use the counter in the laundry room, since you have easy access to water and drains. Having the kitchen smell like naphta is pretty gross.

 

[shroombee]

This is the equipment I have for doing basic, relatively safe and easy extractions of mescaline and DMT with non-toxic chemicals:

- Beakers: 50, 100, 250, 500, 1000 ml ($22);
- Separatory funnel 500ml ($35);
- Stand and rings for separatory funnel ($37);
- Glass funnel 100ml (2 for $12);
- French press ($25);
- Magnetic stirrer with stir bars and retriever ($43);
- Metal fine mesh coffee filter, fits nicely in the 1000 ml beaker ($12);
- Paper coffee filters that fit inside the above metal filter (200 for $6);
- Box of nitrile gloves from Costco;
- pH meter with detachable probe ($97);
- Glass test tubes 55 ml, for storing extractions before evaporating (18 for $15);
- Plastic test tube rack, holds 24 (3 for $14);
- COSORI dehydrator ($160);
- Mason jars;
- Leak-proof silicone sealing lids for mason jars, used for storing solvents or intermediates ($16);
- Pot for boiling plant material;
- Small saucepan for boiling down small quantities;
- Square glass serving plates for evaporating extractions (2 for $20);
- Dish rack for allowing your glassware to dry;

All of the above is easily found on Amazon. Total cost for most of the items is $516. $160 of that is the food dehydrator which can be used for its normal purpose too. And $98 is the pH meter.

Also any discussion on materials as seems like plastic / glass are often options with a big difference in price. Is glass always better? Why?

I don't think there is a big difference in price between glass and plastic in the grand scheme of things. And for some solvents, you cannot use just any random plastic, as the solvent will dissolve the plastic. So be aware of the compatibility of your solvents with various plastics. And in general, if you're using acidic or caustic chemicals, check the compatibility with your containers.

Having the appropriate equipment will definitely make your life easier. Hope this helps.

 

[shroombee]

Lab equipment on Amazon is cheap, so no point is using regular household items if you have the $$ for a dedicated setup. My SO freaked out when I was boiling Acacia bark in the pasta pot.

:lol: That's hilarious. I'm the opposite. My SO doesn't mind me using the kitchen or the cookware. But I'm annoyed when she wants to use my lab equipment for regular household reasons.

 

[BongQuixote]

Lab equipment on Amazon is cheap, so no point is using regular household items if you have the $$ for a dedicated setup. My SO freaked out when I was boiling Acacia bark in the pasta pot.

:lol: That's hilarious. I'm the opposite. My SO doesn't mind me using the kitchen or the cookware. But I'm annoyed when she wants to use my lab equipment for regular household reasons.

That's funny! A lot of the techniques you learn in organic chemistry will make you a better chef. Just being able to stir something for 30 mins at a certain temperature without having to stand by the stove. Want to make some salad dressing? Put the vinegar and oil in a Erlenmeyer flask and turn on the magnetic stirrer, no need for a blender. Want to separate the fat from your stock? Separatory funnel gets the job done.

 

[mrdub]

Thanks to all replies, I have some research and reading to be getting on with this week

Unfortunately don't have access to Amazon here (ecuador), am always jealous of what you guys have access to at next day delivery and those prices!!!

 

[bismillah]

Bahaha, how silly of us to just assume everyone in the world has access to Amazon! That's how ubiquitous it has become in our world.

You may have luck with Ebay, although really I would encourage you to scrap for your materials. Personally I find it really satisfying to give old "junk" a new purpose. I mean, really—we're just gonna toss all this perfectly good glass in the garbage?

 

[mrdub]

Bahaha, how silly of us to just assume everyone in the world has access to Amazon! That's how ubiquitous it has become in our world.

You may have luck with Ebay, although really I would encourage you to scrap for your materials. Personally I find it really satisfying to give old "junk" a new purpose.

No ebay either. We have mercadolibre, which is like a local amazon, which is getting better each year. But for payment you have to go to the bank, make the transfer manually then come back with receipt number to the seller and hope it wasn't a scam listing. But I checked and they did have most of what I could translate, although prices are :shock:

although really I would encourage you to scrap for your materials. Personally I find it really satisfying to give old "junk" a new purpose.

That's the one thing about here, nothing is wasted, although it is born out of poverty that people scavenge through the waste to find anything remotely reusable / sellable to eek out an existence of survival. But it does mean you're not going to find anything useful that has been thrown out as someone would have got there already. If people are going through bins to get plastic bottles / cardboard, you're not going to find a discarded separation funnel

 

[shroombee]

Thanks to all replies, I have some research and reading to be getting on with this week

Unfortunately don't have access to Amazon here (ecuador), am always jealous of what you guys have access to at next day delivery and those prices!!!

Do you not have access due to legal reasons? Or is it that Amazon hasn't expanded to Ecuador yet?

 

[mrdub]

The country has heavy import taxes on nearly everything and many things are just not allowed. The idea is to protect local industry. The idea is the country doesn't get flooded with cheap imports that kill off local industries / businesses. It works well in some cases, but for others it doesn't make sense i.e. products not produced here or not even available.

That and the postal system closed down early in the pandemic, there is now no international post in or out the country apart from DHL.

There are also restrictions on the size / weight of packages that can come in. Even when there was a postal system, there were so many problems Amazon just said "we don't ship to Ecuador".

We have had a left leaning government for the last 15 years so things are about due for a swing to the right so things may change (election next month and polls leaning that way). Although it would be great to have access to Amazon as a well off foreigner, am not sure it would be great for the country as lots of family run businesses serve the market as prices are high enough to allow them to run a business in markets covered by Amazon. If the market is opened to Amazon, they would all go under and with no saftey provided by a bankrupt government hardship would increase significantly. So it's all complicated. But we are verging into politics so I'll leave it there

 

[shroombee]

So the reason why your quality of life suffers is due to politics. :| Say no more. (And I acknowledge there are well-meaning folks that believe there is a legitimate reason why your quality of life should suffer, as your suffering appears to protect other people's quality of life).

 

[downwardsfromzero]

It was pretty shocking to hear in your introductory essay that you don't even have access to sodium bicarbonate. I would suggest looking into possible sources of limestone or chalk which you can burn (preferably in an oxy-propane furnace :?) to produce quicklime (calcium oxide) and then - cautiously - add water to produce "pickling" lime. Snail shells (and sea shells) would also work.

Then there are plant ashes, some of which are more optimal than others as a source of potassium or sodium carbonates. Combining lime and potash produces crude lye - caustic potash and/or soda. (Which then, incidentally, sets me thinking about how you might go about glassmaking.) It looks like you might need to get quite DIY about this if you really want to see things through with plant extractions.

You might also need to think about what your sources of acids would be.

 

[mrdub]

So the reason why your quality of life suffers is due to politics. :| Say no more. (And I acknowledge there are well-meaning folks that believe there is a legitimate reason why your quality of life should suffer, as your suffering appears to protect other people's quality of life).

I think the "term" suffers is a bit on the excessive. Sure is easy to sit at home and order Christmas presents from Amazon, but having to run around the city looking for gifts, isn't exactly "suffering" But is a hassle. But the benefit of still having small run family run stores is better than having even more unemployed.

It was pretty shocking to hear in your introductory essay that you don't even have access to sodium bicarbonate.

It's on the list* (due to be used to make crack) but it's available fairly easily.

I would suggest looking into possible sources of limestone or chalk which you can burn (preferably in an oxy-propane furnace Confused) to produce quicklime (calcium oxide) and then - cautiously - add water to produce "pickling" lime. Snail shells (and sea shells) would also work.

Actually, have found a source of Calcium Hydroxide(Hidroxido De Calcio) - which I believe is pickling lime - only problem is, minimum size is 25kg / 50lbs!

Then there are plant ashes, some of which are more optimal than others as a source of potassium or sodium carbonates. Combining lime and potash produces crude lye - caustic potash and/or soda.

I have found a drain cleaner that contains lye, says is 98%, no idea what the other 2% is. But if can avoid such nasty chemicals, that would be preferable

(Which then, incidentally, sets me thinking about how you might go about glassmaking.) It looks like you might need to get quite DIY about this if you really want to see things through with plant extractions.

Glassware shouldn't be a problem. Just need to spend a day going round the city to find a suppler, that would be the hardest part, then once found they will sell everything I could possibly want. Won't be Amazon cheap, probably around 2x the cost which is typical

You might also need to think about what your sources of acids would be.

Vinegar I see oft mentioned.



* Restricted chemicals: Spanish but fairly obvious the English equivs

 

[downwardsfromzero]

Actually, have found a source of Calcium Hydroxide(Hidroxido De Calcio) - which I believe is pickling lime - only problem is, minimum size is 25kg / 50lbs!

You could always use the remainder for plastering and mortar, or maybe preserving eggs.

I have found a drain cleaner that contains lye, says is 98%, no idea what the other 2% is. But if can avoid such nasty chemicals, that would be preferable

That will be as good as it gets. The other 2% is largely sodium carbonate that unavoidably forms from reaction with carbon dioxide in the air.


The thing with watched chemicals lists is that some things are only watched above a certain amount. Domestic uses like cleaning drains, soap making or plastering do still need to be allowed to take place. Vinegar probably hasn't been banned yet, even if acetic acid is on the list!

They're pretty fanatical about this - they even seem to have 'banned' calcium chloride :lol:

 

[mrdub]

Restricted is probably a better word, somethings you can get with a permission from what I understand. Unfortunately, my Spanish is only so:so so trying to question people about the finer points of the restrictions and why I need certain things and not the available equivalent that they tell is just as good becomes difficult. To be honest, probably is possible to get most things on the restricted list, it is Ecuador after all, just need to find the place that will charge me a $10 "fee" for not having the paper work.

I have found a drain cleaner that contains lye, says is 98%, no idea what the other 2% is. But if can avoid such nasty chemicals, that would be preferable

That will be as good as it gets. The other 2% is largely sodium carbonate that unavoidably forms from reaction with carbon dioxide in the air.

I bought some today, composition states:

sodium hydroxide 98%
1,3,5 triazina-2,4,6 (1h,3h,5h) - triono 1,3,5-tricloro ,90%, sodium chloride

That last one seems to translate to:
1,3,5-Triazine-2,4,6(1H,3H,5H)-trione, 1,3,5-trichloro-, sodium salt

According to:

1,3,5-Triazine-2,4,6(1H,3H,5H)-trione, 1,3,5-trichloro-, sodium salt

1,3,5-Triazine-2,4,6(1H,3H,5H)-trione, 1,3,5-trichloro-, sodium salt | C3Cl3N3NaO3+ | CID 169072 - structure, chemical names, physical and chemical properties, classification, patents, literature, biological activities, safety/hazards/toxicity information, supplier lists, and more.

pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Also called: sodium trichloroisocyanurate which google wants to show us the acid page for

Trichloroisocyanuric acid - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Seems is a

The compound is a disinfectant, algicide and bactericide mainly for swimming pools and dyestuffs, and is also used as a bleaching agent in the textile industry. It is widely used in civil sanitation for pools and spas, preventing and curing diseases in animal husbandry and fisheries, fruit and vegetable preservation, wastewater treatment, as an algicide for recycled water in industry and air conditioning, in anti shrink treatment for woolens, for treating seeds and in organic chemical synthesis. It is used in chemical synthesis as an easy to store and transport chlorine gas source, it is not subject to hazardous gas shipping restrictions, and its reaction with hydrochloric acid produces relatively pure chlorine.[5]

Trichloroisocyanuric acid as used in swimming pools is easier to handle than chlorine gas. It dissolves slowly in water, but as it reacts, cyanuric acid concentration in the pool will build-up.

Which is now getting all beyond me

 

[downwardsfromzero]

Ah, yes - no, you do not want to use that stuff with the pool cleaner in it!!

It seems that 98% NaOH was merely one of the ingredients - how misleading!

(While you could in principle dissolve out the trichloroisocyanuric acid with a suitable solvent, I wouldn't advise that anyone try this. It would require a fairly detailed understanding of chemistry. Compatibility between the solvent and the compounds in question would be tricky to get right and getting it wrong would have the potential to be catastrophic.)

 

[mrdub]

Ah, yes - no, you do not want to use that stuff with the pool cleaner in it!!

It seems that 98% NaOH was merely one of the ingredients - how misleading!

(While you could in principle dissolve out the trichloroisocyanuric acid with a suitable solvent, I wouldn't advise that anyone try this. It would require a fairly detailed understanding of chemistry. Compatibility between the solvent and the compounds in question would be tricky to get right and getting it wrong would have the potential to be catastrophic.)

calcium hydroxide it is then

 

[downwardsfromzero]

Ah, yes - no, you do not want to use that stuff with the pool cleaner in it!!
[...]

calcium hydroxide it is then

The good news is - if you really want to you can make crude caustic soda by mixing washing soda, lime and arithmetic

 

[mrdub]

Ah, yes - no, you do not want to use that stuff with the pool cleaner in it!!
[...]

calcium hydroxide it is then

The good news is - if you really want to you can make crude caustic soda by mixing washing soda, lime and arithmetic

One step at a time for me I think.