[BRANCHED]Question regarding chacruna/chaliponga extraction

[Disillusionist]

[MOD NOTE: this post gave rise to a tangential discussion, from the highlighted statement.]

The old Wiki is actively being migrated to the new forum's DMT-Nexus Resources subsection. It is a work in progress, though, and as volunteers are few and far between, combined with life happening, progress can be considered slow.


It's far from abandoned. @The Traveler has been putting enormous amounts of work and care into maintaining the new forum. To say that the forum is dying because there aren't as many people as before is to plainly disregard all of that and focus solely on the negative.

There are more smart and educated people nowadays than there has ever been. The new generations contain brilliant young minds that have the capacity to transform the world. It's just that most people choose to focus entirely on the negative energy of the world, which is made infinitely easier by the presence of social media in our lives.

You can choose to focus on the negative and be bitter and resentful about life if that's what keeps you moving. But please don't bring that energy to the Nexus. If you don't like it here, you're absolutely free to log out and stay away. Nobody is forcing you to be here.

I was asking because I was planning on adding in the work. I may still do that if there's no play to extinguish it.

What I see missing in the wiki is:
Information on DMT salts. All info must be redirected to the same page, not individual articles.

Information on growing big DMT crystals.

Information on jungle spice and how to mitigate polymerization.

Information on plants containing DMT and it's adequate uses (chacruna is not adequate for extraction)

Those are all things I could fix in a few days. Should I do it?

 

[Jamie01]

Why isn’t chacruna adequate for extraction? I have had awesome experiences with crystal extracted from chacruna.

Most people are just used to pre separated and powdered inner bark of mimosa. Australia seems way ahead and not only because they have acacias but because they don’t rely on only imported already processed bark. IMO

I think we should encourage people more to look outside of the high yielding fast mimosa paradigm.

 

[Disillusionist]

Why isn’t chacruna adequate for extraction? I have had awesome experiences with crystal extracted from chacruna.

Most people are just used to pre separated and powdered inner bark of mimosa. Australia seems way ahead and not only because they have acacias but because they don’t rely on only imported already processed bark. IMO

I think we should encourage people more to look outside of the high yielding east mimosa paradigm.

Do you have any TEK for it then? I've brought dozens of MR seeds and they will need at least one year for me harvest and as I understand chacruna is smaller and isn't full of spikes. It would be preferable, but all sources I've looked into said it's suboptimal.

 

[Transform]

Do you have any TEK for it then? I've brought dozens of MR seeds and they will need at least one year for me harvest and as I understand chacruna is smaller and isn't full of spikes. It would be preferable, but all sources I've looked into said it's suboptimal.

Presumably you mean Mimosa tenuiflora (syn. hostilis) seeds? You could always try obtaining seeds of one or more of the various acacia species with active phyllodes. It'll still require something of a wait, likely a longer one at that, but your patience will be rewarded.

 

[blig-blug]

all sources I've looked into said it's suboptimal

It's likely that they say that because chacruna has less DMT and is more expensive (if you buy the plant material). But that doesn't mean it's not possible. And if growing chacruna suits you better than Mimosa, then I would say that for your use case Mimosa would be the suboptimal one

 

[Disillusionist]

It's likely that they say that because chacruna has less DMT and is more expensive (if you buy the plant material). But that doesn't mean it's not possible. And if growing chacruna suits you better than Mimosa, then I would say that for your use case Mimosa would be the suboptimal one

Chacruna or Chaliponga would be the ideal plants for me to grow because they are native, smaller size and unarmed.

However I will not invest into finding the seeds or growing them until I have actual guides that especifically target extracting from them. I'm on the safer side.
If there's a TEK, please share.

 

[Jamie01]

I used the typical stuff…lye, naphtha, water, vinegar, sodium carb

Just like any other Acacia or Phalaris or w/e leafy stuff.

 

[Disillusionist]

I used the typical stuff…lye, naphtha, water, vinegar, sodium carb

Just like any other Acacia or Phalaris or w/e leafy stuff.

Did you get a satisfactory wield? Chacruna leaves are meant to contain from 0.1% to 0.6% N,N-DMT but reported wields tend to be even lower than that.
That's were my caution comes from.

 

[Transform]

Chacruna or Chaliponga would be the ideal plants for me to grow because they are native, smaller size and unarmed.

However I will not invest into finding the seeds or growing them until I have actual guides that especifically target extracting from them. I'm on the safer side.
If there's a TEK, please share.

Start growing them already! You'll have plenty of time to explore extraction methods while waiting for enough biomass to develop for it to be worthwhile.

Did you get a satisfactory wield? Chacruna leaves are meant to contain from 0.1% to 0.6% N,N-DMT but reported wields tend to be even lower than that.
That's were my caution comes from.

Why worry about yields before you have any material to extract from? Once you have developed a relationship with the plants, you may be surprised at how this incentivises you to improve your extraction technique, or even to move in an entirely different direction.

Extraction from chacruna will, as @Jamie01 states, follow a standard pattern for A/B extraction from leafy material, i.e. it will require a defat in the acid stage.

Furthermore, you need to discuss this in an appropriate thread. This tangent has gone off-topic. I'll be moving discussion of chacruna extraction into its own thread in the appropriate subforum.

 

[Transform]

Do you have any TEK for it then? I've brought dozens of MR seeds and they will need at least one year for me harvest and as I understand chacruna is smaller and isn't full of spikes. It would be preferable, but all sources I've looked into said it's suboptimal.

There's an outline on hydroponic/aeroponic mimosa cultivation somewhere around here from maybe a year or so ago. I'd have to dig around a bit to find it, though. This technique makes root harvesting much easier, capital outlay notwithstanding.

 

[doubledog]

I've extracted dmt from chaliponga leaves and used the same process as I did with mimosa. No problems, pretty easy extraction, even better than mimosa, no annoying tannic sludge.

 

[modern]

Chacruna can vary a bit in yield but 1% or slightly higher 1.2% is not unheard of here in Brasil. You would be best to grow in the ground or very large pot and after 2-3 years easily harvest. Chaliponga IME isn't anything special and on par with viridis but I guess it grows a little better. My chaliponga only had .26-.3% yield.

Like @Transform mentioned all teks work you just cannot skip the defat step. Besides that I would suggest a few acid water pulls then reduce it down before trying to pull with your NP solvent. You can also skip the defat IF you salt it... I like the benzoic acid tek.

 

[Disillusionist]

There's an outline on hydroponic/aeroponic mimosa cultivation somewhere around here from maybe a year or so ago. I'd have to dig around a bit to find it, though. This technique makes root harvesting much easier, capital outlay notwithstanding.

Wow. You just blew my mind. I have to find it.

 

[Transform]

Wow. You just blew my mind. I have to find it.

If you don't find it, I think I can get the document out of my file system with a bit of poking around.

 

[gorgonzola]

What I'm looking for on the forum is information about this, the use of chacruna. I have a lot of chacruna plant material. Isn't there a technique developed for extracting it? And why isn't it recommended? If I use the same extraction methods I would use with mimosa, will it work?

 

[Disillusionist]

What I'm looking for on the forum is information about this, the use of chacruna. I have a lot of chacruna plant material. Isn't there a technique developed for extracting it? And why isn't it recommended? If I use the same extraction methods I would use with mimosa, will it work?

Your question has been answered earlier in the thread:

Start growing them already! You'll have plenty of time to explore extraction methods while waiting for enough biomass to develop for it to be worthwhile.

Why worry about yields before you have any material to extract from? Once you have developed a relationship with the plants, you may be surprised at how this incentivises you to improve your extraction technique, or even to move in an entirely different direction.

Extraction from chacruna will, as @Jamie01 states, follow a standard pattern for A/B extraction from leafy material, i.e. it will require a defat in the acid stage.

Furthermore, you need to discuss this in an appropriate thread. This tangent has gone off-topic. I'll be moving discussion of chacruna extraction into its own thread in the appropriate subforum.

 

[Disillusionist]

Chacruna can vary a bit in yield but 1% or slightly higher 1.2% is not unheard of here in Brasil. You would be best to grow in the ground or very large pot and after 2-3 years easily harvest. Chaliponga IME isn't anything special and on par with viridis but I guess it grows a little better. My chaliponga only had .26-.3% yield.

Like @Transform mentioned all teks work you just cannot skip the defat step. Besides that I would suggest a few acid water pulls then reduce it down before trying to pull with your NP solvent. You can also skip the defat IF you salt it... I like the benzoic acid tek.

Do you have any sources to buy chacruna seeds, seedlings or rooted leaves in Brazil?

Also if you can get 1.2% yield from chacruna can you clone that plant via rooted leaves and send it to me?

 

[modern]

Do you have any sources to buy chacruna seeds, seedlings or rooted leaves in Brazil?

Also if you can get 1.2% yield from chacruna can you clone that plant via rooted leaves and send it to me?

seeds and leafs as well as cuttings are often easily found online here. The 1.2% yield I personally haven't had but there are large 'farm' that have production scale for churches that have shared these yields. I'd say it has more to due with treatment and time of harvest over actual clone. These places tend to mass sow rather than endless cloning.

Better to get a clone that does well in your area than a strong clone which may never get the same yield in your conditions. well taken care of in the ground 2-3 years es extremely reasonable time frame and with multiple plants growing at once does well.

I think acacia may be more reliable higher yield and you can use leaves and stems as well.

 

[Disillusionist]

seeds and leafs as well as cuttings are often easily found online here. The 1.2% yield I personally haven't had but there are large 'farm' that have production scale for churches that have shared these yields. I'd say it has more to due with treatment and time of harvest over actual clone. These places tend to mass sow rather than endless cloning.

Better to get a clone that does well in your area than a strong clone which may never get the same yield in your conditions. well taken care of in the ground 2-3 years es extremely reasonable time frame and with multiple plants growing at once does well.

I think acacia may be more reliable higher yield and you can use leaves and stems as well.

No luck with seeds so far, none for sell.
Leaves may be overkill because they would send so many, be expensive and may arrive very very dead and not root at all and thus it's a big risk.

Also I have no idea what's the best way to find those things. I'm looking into big general online stores and doing Google searchs but I don't think that's optimal.

 

[modern]

No luck with seeds so far, none for sell.
Leaves may be overkill because they would send so many, be expensive and may arrive very very dead and not root at all and thus it's a big risk.

Also I have no idea what's the best way to find those things. I'm looking into big general online stores and doing Google searchs but I don't think that's optimal.

are you in brasil? I'd buy leaf or clone over seeds... Seeds unless they are in the berries or you know it is fresh a bad choice... they take very long to germinate 2+ months for FRESH seeds in berry still and 6month if dried seed with low germination. Fresh seeds are nice and my favorite but needs to be kept in berries.
I found via google when I started out...