Can I extract Caapi leaf the same as Caapi vine?

[MoonMoonLeftShark]

I'm looking at a process like this: Pictorial Guide to Caapi Vine Alkaloid Extraction.

Can I use leaf instead of vine for this kind of extraction? Will I get similar results? Or is there a better TEK to use for leaf?

This is my first experience with Caapi or any harmalas, which is why I started with just some simple leaf. I plan on trying to just smoke the leaf as-is to get a feel for it, but I'm also interested in progressing to changa, but not sure if leaf is the place to start extracting.

Thanks all!
MoonMoon

 

[modern]

I am currently preforming this 'tek' with caapi leaf myself. I am only at the first basing step but the alkaloids have precipitated without any issues as far as I can tell. I'm not gonna shorten the time required and am allowing the alks to settle rather just collect water.

I was wondering if any additional steps would be needed but doesn't seem like that's the case time will tell.

 

[modern]

This technique seems to work just fine with caapi leafs here is a photo after the second re-basing.

I might make a new thread for this question
Has anyone gotten a orange-reddish cloud from preforming this? Not from caapi leaf or vine but from other part. I'm gonna finish this extraction and see if it shines under black light. Will also try to do a TLC comparing to leaf to see if anything similar is inside.

 

[Jees]

I had different colors from different sources of rue, all rue in the end.

Thanks for trying the tek on leaves. Someone somewhere mentioned it would not go as well on leaves so I'm exited to see your result of checking it out :thumb_up:

 

[pitubo]

Nice work! Please do some more testing and analysis as you say you are planning to, so that this thread can be moved to the Harmalas subforum (and you be promoted to be able to post to it) :thumb_up:

 

[Sabnock1990]

How many grams of Caapi leaves did you use? What kind of Caapi leaves were they? (red, yellow, cielo)

 

[modern]

How many grams of Caapi leaves did you use? What kind of Caapi leaves were they? (red, yellow, cielo)

I used ~25 grams dry leaf, ~25 grams wet leaf, and ~3 grams of some twigs. These were from my cielo cutting growing in a pot. This was collected and stored improperly and started to show some sign of mildew growing so before it got too bad I decided to preform this extraction. I just roughly shredded the leaves by hand and tossed it into a pot with water covering and some white vinegar. After 3 30 min boils I reduced to 400-500 ml and proceeded as instructed in the guide using lye in similar amounts.

I am currently doing my final rinse on the precipitate; it seems much whiter than the tan results shown in the guide. I couldn't find my black flashlight so just ordered another.

Side note: I thought TLC could be preformed with any filter paper but after reading more into it NEEDS to be TLC plates (little pricey) and specific solution(ethyl alcohol and a little ammonia?). I'll be attempting a very botched paper chromatography using everclear and paper towel. Might end up a complete bust but even if I just get streaks of different lines I'll call it a success since it should be usable with black light. May bite the bullet and get a small amount of TLC to play with. Looks so easy after listening to endlessness??? explain it in this video.

 

[MoonMoonLeftShark]

Wow modern, that looks great! Somebody mentioned in chat that it wouldn't work on leaf and I decided not to try. But this is giving me hope!

Please let us know how it turns out. I will try to process my leaves this weekend and will take pictures to post. Thanks modern!

MoonMoon

 

[modern]

So after 2 days air-drying without a fan the alkaloids have dried. The total weight was .127 grams, that's close to .5% which is on par with previous papers on erowid (.25-1.9%). I'm assuming the 25g wet would be close to 5 dry and am negating the 3g stems. The content seems season dependent based on a vendors feedback of cooler weather leading to higher content and hot temps harvest are low content. (source: sacredforest on ecrater) The dry leaves were harvested around summer time so may have played a role.

MoonMoonLeftShark I assume that people mentioning it doesn't work on leaf may have used red leaf or just had very weak leaf. Many have had zero precipitate from red vine. Another possible reason is they didn't raise the pH high enough. I made mine around 12+ when basing. THH pKb is 10.33 which means a higher pH is required to freebase from my understanding. Tetrahydroharmine (THH) pKa 15.6?... Update pKb is 10.33 helpful? - Welcome discussion - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus

The cloudy red precipitate I've shown was the result of around 10g of seeds and 3g from the wings of the seeds. I'm not gonna dry it due to it likely being a waxy/oily goo. I'll use a blacklight to see if there is any glow. 1 test showed .9% content. Erowid Online Books : "Ayahuasca: alkaloids, plants, and analogs" by Keeper of the Trout

EDIT: Under blacklight is a alcohol/caapi extract left over on evap dish. The red cloud didn't shine IMO. I some to alcohol and also acidified to see if any chance. There seemed to be a very slight 'shine' in acidic solution but think it was just the light hitting it. Not noticeable like caapi leaf extract.

 

[BringsUsTogether]

Dat harmala glow tho :thumb_up:
Nice extraction.

 

[MoonMoonLeftShark]

Unfortunately, after basifying my boils, nothing precipitated out. I'll get some vine and try again.

 

[MoonMoonLeftShark]

Unfortunately, after basifying my boils, nothing precipitated out. I'll get some vine and try again.

Well, things have changed. I left the beaker sitting on a shelf for several weeks and it separated out a sludge on the bottom. After cleaning a few times, I acidified it and let the gunk precipitate out. It new was a nice yellow fluid, that upon adding the base, looked exactly the pictures in the originally linked TEK and moderns extraction.

I was pleasantly surprised when it came out looking exactly the same as the pictures! I am now waiting for it to setting out some more for a few more clean water rinses, but it looks like this it a totally viable approach, even if you have to wait a little longer for it to precipitate out.

MoonMoon

 

[Jees]

Weird for the base precipitation to take time, but this might be the missing link why some say it won't work on leaves. Of course, only end result testing can confirm that what you get are the harmalas indeed. Keep up checking out :thumb_up:

 

[loadet]

It does indeed take a long time... i waited many hours between each wash. Not sure what it is i got though...

 

[NamRa]

I have been boiling caapi leaves.
But when I added the Noah liquid absolutely nothing happened.
No snowglobe effect, nothing visibly precipitating.

A froze the pulverized leaves before and did not use vinegar.
I have plenty of experience extracting peganum and also caapi vine.

I smoked the leaves before and for sure its effects where felt.
The tea I still have. The PH is 12.
I decanted it to see if something is on the bottom.
What I see look more like small foil particles.

What is going on ?

 

[Jagube]

I did a simple A/B extraction on caupuri leaves. The result looked similar to the last pic, dark colored little grainy bits.
It was active, but very impure, maybe 20 - 25% purity.