Can I have a "microdosed" DMT experience?

[Maddd_Maxxx]

I currently have syrian rue seeds and mimosa hostilis bark powder. I would like to create anahuasca, but I am wondering if there is a way to have a "slight" DMT trip (i.e. visuals are overlayed on my current reality and I am not visiting other worlds completely). I am planning to take 3g of syrian rue via tea, but I am unsure about the dosing of hostilis for the effect I want. I know all dosing can be unpredictable, but if anyone has any ideas or experience, let me know. This would be my first DMT trip.

I am also not on any SSRIs or any medications that would impact effects. My last dose of Lexapro was around four months ago, and now I use CBD as my antidepressant.

 

[Varallo]

Well yes it is very possible to achieve a lighter experience, but it would require some trial and error to get it just right, the way I see it there are two main parameters (dose, timing) that are of influence and are easily changed, next to the content of the seeds and bark they make it possible to tweak the intensity and duration.

Starting with 3 grams of rue is a great place to start and I would then start to add mimosa at the lower end of the scale at 0,5 or one grams (if you know the content is below the average you can double). Timing I would suggest either taking them at the same time or wait for 20 minutes before consuming the mimosa brew. And then stick with that while slowly increasing the mimosa dose, at half or whole gram a time until you reach your desired level of intensity. From there you can play around with the timing, personally I like about half an hour between the two, but I use extracts. Sometimes when time is in short supply I like to dose harmalas and then wait for longer and then take a strong dose of dmt. This while being intense really cuts down on the time spent tripping.

Finally if you’re going for a serious endeavor I would recommend keeping track and document your experience and dose a time spent tripping. When I was in college I had ample time to do this an planned on creating my personal graph with dose on the Y and timing on the X, in the end I was not able to collect sufficient data to get somewhere. But it would be interesting, maybe even add some data on intensity on the Z.

Good luck and keep us updated.

 

[Sabnock1990]

Ime, try around 3 grams of Mimosa with 3 grams of Rue, 3 grams of Mimosa can be strong in it's own right but not overly strong, and is ime/imo a good place to start. 2 to 2.5 grams of Mimosa at least. Take the Rue first, then take the Mimosa 30 minutes later, give things an hour or two to fully kick in and see how it goes.

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

Well yes it is very possible to achieve a lighter experience, but it would require some trial and error to get it just right, the way I see it there are two main parameters (dose, timing) that are of influence and are easily changed, next to the content of the seeds and bark they make it possible to tweak the intensity and duration.

Starting with 3 grams of rue is a great place to start and I would then start to add mimosa at the lower end of the scale at 0,5 or one grams (if you know the content is below the average you can double). Timing I would suggest either taking them at the same time or wait for 20 minutes before consuming the mimosa brew. And then stick with that while slowly increasing the mimosa dose, at half or whole gram a time until you reach your desired level of intensity. From there you can play around with the timing, personally I like about half an hour between the two, but I use extracts. Sometimes when time is in short supply I like to dose harmalas and then wait for longer and then take a strong dose of dmt. This while being intense really cuts down on the time spent tripping.

Finally if you’re going for a serious endeavor I would recommend keeping track and document your experience and dose a time spent tripping. When I was in college I had ample time to do this an planned on creating my personal graph with dose on the Y and timing on the X, in the end I was not able to collect sufficient data to get somewhere. But it would be interesting, maybe even add some data on intensity on the Z.

Good luck and keep us updated.

Thanks for all the great info! I love the idea of the graph, and I will definitely make one of my own. Would a smaller dose like the ones you mentioned create a visual overlay like how shrooms would? More interested in letting the trip come into my world instead of directly going into theirs. And what would a smaller dose do (in your own personal experience)?

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

Ime, try around 3 grams of Mimosa with 3 grams of Rue, 3 grams of Mimosa can be strong in it's own right but not overly strong, and is ime/imo a good place to start. 2 to 2.5 grams of Mimosa at least. Take the Rue first, then take the Mimosa 30 minutes later, give things an hour or two to fully kick in and see how it goes.

Thank you so much! How would you prepare your mimosa? I am aiming for a tea brew, but I think I would only want to let it simmer for at max an hour so I don’t accidentally give myself too high of a dose. It is in my understanding that the longer you brew, the stronger it becomes.

 

[Sabnock1990]

Thank you so much! How would you prepare your mimosa? I am aiming for a tea brew, but I think I would only want to let it simmer for at max an hour so I don’t accidentally give myself too high of a dose. It is in my understanding that the longer you brew, the stronger it becomes.

Usually i reserve tea for bulk brews so i can dose around like 5 to 7 grams, but if i'm going for 3.5 grams or less i usually just encapsulate the root powder, works pretty well. For a brew of a single like 3 gram dose, i don't imagine it would take much brewing as ime DMT is pretty water soluble even in room temp water, but i think simmering for an hour would do fine. Idk about length of brewing factoring into potency, but i think so long as one gets everything from the plant material it should be about the same potency as the root itself. If you're concerned about taking too high of a dose, stick to 2 to 3 grams, it can be strong for 2 to 3 grams but relatively mild compared to the "full shebang". You can also sip the dose of Mimosa tea for 10 minutes to have a gentler/less intense come up, even with a fuller dose it'll be much smoother and more comfortable.

 

[Sabnock1990]

Also i had some noticeable open eyed visuals on 2.5 to 3 grams, 3 grams is a nice solid beginners dose imo, 2 to 2.5 grams can be decent but is a little light.

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

Also i had some noticeable open eyed visuals on 2.5 to 3 grams, 3 grams is a nice solid beginners dose imo, 2 to 2.5 grams can be decent but is a little light.

Thank you again for all the advise! Two final things:

1) Do you know if anything can help slow a DMT trip? For me, CBD seems to help with shrooms if I want to take it a bit slower, as well as communicating that I want to slow down. I will admit, I am still very tepid about DMT. My nerves do make my trips a bit rough, especially at come up, but knowing I have a “backdoor” gives me comfort.

2) Any advise for calming upset stomach on syrian rue? I’ve been reading other folks’ recommendations, but would love to hear yours as well

 

[Transform]

One thing I've found with low dose anahuasca was that it starts to get interesting, then abruptly fades away. Typically this coincides with needing to get up and urinate. I'm tempted to say, the plants are taking the piss.

slow a DMT trip

Oral DMT plus harmalas will simply be slower than vaped DMT, especially at lower doses. @AstralRoots might have something to say about this though! I'll say it again, don't underestimate the power that rue can bring. Even 3g can be quite the visionary journey, and I don't just mean pretty pictures - deep insights and a stern dressing down by the plant teacher commonly count as par for the course.

other folks’ recommendations

I trust you've found this one in your journey:

The Secret-Alchemist Club Anti-Nausea Shot

The Secret-Alchemist Club Anti-Nausea Shot 2oz Fresh Squeezed Ginger Juice from Juicer [or the juicerless juice method mentioned below] 7 Drops Essential Oil of Lemon 3 Drops Essential Oil of Peppermint 3 Drops Essential Oil of Clove 3 Drops Essential Oil of Lavender 1.) Mix it all up and take...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

I get by with a drop or two of lemon oil for simplicity's sake, but I also have a rather high nausea threshold; vomiting is an exceedingly rare thing for me. If a rue brew gives me even a twinge of nausea, it's generally a sign I'll be in for a wilder ride.

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

One thing I've found with low dose anahuasca was that it starts to get interesting, then abruptly fades away. Typically this coincides with needing to get up and urinate. I'm tempted to say, the plants are taking the piss.

Oral DMT plus harmalas will simply be slower than vaped DMT, especially at lower doses. @AstralRoots might have something to say about this though! I'll say it again, don't underestimate the power that rue can bring. Even 3g can be quite the visionary journey, and I don't just mean pretty pictures - deep insights and a stern dressing down by the plant teacher commonly count as par for the course.

I trust you've found this one in your journey:

The Secret-Alchemist Club Anti-Nausea Shot

The Secret-Alchemist Club Anti-Nausea Shot 2oz Fresh Squeezed Ginger Juice from Juicer [or the juicerless juice method mentioned below] 7 Drops Essential Oil of Lemon 3 Drops Essential Oil of Peppermint 3 Drops Essential Oil of Clove 3 Drops Essential Oil of Lavender 1.) Mix it all up and take...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

I get by with a drop or two of lemon oil for simplicity's sake, but I also have a rather high nausea threshold; vomiting is an exceedingly rare thing for me. If a rue brew gives me even a twinge of nausea, it's generally a sign I'll be in for a wilder ride.

Yes! I did see that thread and got a lot out of it. Thanks for your input as well! Additionally, how long does an oral DMT trip last vs. smoked DMT? I guess describe to me the different times for the phases (come up, trip, come down, etc.)

 

[Transform]

The duration really depends on the doses of both the harmalas and the DMT plant. It can be as little as half an hour of DMT effects, but a full-on ayahuasca double-dip was keeping me going for about eight hours on one occasion. It may or may not be bracketed by half to one hour of more subtle harmala effects, depending on how those things are timed with respect to one another - contemporaneous, or harmala first by some margin or other. And the timing of when you take the DMT will often also have a large influence on the intensity and duration of the experience, not to mention things like dietary factors and personal ?cyclical variations in metabolic activity. The experience frequently may come in waves, also.

These are my thoughts as a relative novice and autodidact*, at least.

*with a huge nod to this place, and all the researchers and authors who have made the relevant information available over the years.

 

[AstralRoots]

Greetings Mad Max. Funny that your post coincides with my third go of Rue + Acacia that transpired 24 hours from this comment.

I worked with Rue alone for approximately a dozen sessions before introducing acacia. Rue alone is special to me and I won't forget some of the teachings offered. I started under 100mg, doubled, doubled, etc up until peaking out at 5g per go. I did around 2 bouts of 7 nights in a row which both (the latter most sessions of daily accumulation) yielded my rear being handed to me on a silver platter. Partly I attribute it to reverse tolerance and partly due to the ''demand/call'' of integration in contrast to over-rueing it.

My initial introduction of acacia went as follows: 3g rue + 100mg acacia consumed 1.5 hours after the rue. I too like you am careful, very careful. For me personally having consumed Ayahuasca a handful of times the medicine showed up even at this low of dosage. I had closed eye rainbow visuals of a MUCH lesser intensity as b. caapi + mimosa brews however nonetheless the experience was meaningful and had tinges of the somatic workings of this ancciet plant ritual.

The third time, last night, was far beyond what I was expecting at such a low dose of acacia. I am personally entirely content with raw powder/bark as I feel it fine for my use case. It is convienent and thus far don't really feel the need to go through the process of heating/extracting. My nausea is minimal tbh though I can almost assure myself that as/if I scale up on the acacia side it will be more of a phenomenon to work with.

A brother informed me that he consumed 4g rue + 10g mimosa during his full on immersion sessions which completely ''got him there''. By got him there I mean full on Buddhic/Christed deities, connecting with deceased loved ones, and the rest of those wondrous experiences fortunate humans are graced to experience on this side of the tomb. This experience is desired by me (who doesn't want to taste this nectar) however given all previous experiences I can honestly say I'm not ready for crossing such threshold yet. Which is why I'm comfortable with a continuation of smaller doses.

Personally I cannot at all deduce that 3/4g rue + 1.5g acacia is a light dose as I was hip deep in serious waters demanding every part of myself to give my everything in order to stay afloat. All the best to you and wish you meaningful experiences and proper integrations. Feel free to ask any questions if they might arise.

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

The duration really depends on the doses of both the harmalas and the DMT plant. It can be as little as half an hour of DMT effects, but a full-on ayahuasca double-dip was keeping me going for about eight hours on one occasion. It may or may not be bracketed by half to one hour of more subtle harmala effects, depending on how those things are timed with respect to one another - contemporaneous, or harmala first by some margin or other. And the timing of when you take the DMT will often also have a large influence on the intensity and duration of the experience, not to mention things like dietary factors and personal ?cyclical variations in metabolic activity. The experience frequently may come in waves, also.

These are my thoughts as a relative novice and autodidact*, at least.

*with a huge nod to this place, and all the researchers and authors who have made the relevant information available over the years.

Thank you, yet again! I think I am just in need of personal experimenting as I move forward, but your advise gave me some excellent insights and starting points!

Bless

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

Funny that your post coincides with my third go of Rue + Acacia that transpired 24 hours from this comment.

Love the coincidences of the universe

And thank you for your and your brother’s trip reports! Approaching with caution definitely always seems like the best bet, even though experiences can be unpredictable. But that seems to be the nature of psychedelics

Can you tell me more about your syrian rue experiences? I had a brew made of 0.3g (all I had on hand) and didn’t feel much of anything. It wasn’t much of a surprise, considering the MAOI dose starts around 2-3g. I just got an ounce of seeds, and I plan to up my doses slowly to see how it feels on its own. Wondering how your sessions went so I know what to expect.

 

[Transform]

I just got an ounce of seeds, and I plan to up my doses slowly to see how it feels on its own. Wondering how your sessions went so I know what to expect.

I would highly recommend this. Starting LOW and inching up the dose a little every day, up to the point where it gets a bit much, you know? Then inch it back down again - you'll learn a lot about harmala dosing this way, especially if you can spread it out over a month - you could do with at least another ounce of seeds for that, but, thankfully, you have plenty to be getting started with. And it's quite fun to play with the dosing increments from some kind of numerological perspective if you're so inclined. Try to keep good notes - my harmala doses from that time are written down on the back of a till receipt somewhere - I'll have to see if i can still find it

 

[AstralRoots]

Love the coincidences of the universe

And thank you for your and your brother’s trip reports! Approaching with caution definitely always seems like the best bet, even though experiences can be unpredictable. But that seems to be the nature of psychedelics

Can you tell me more about your syrian rue experiences? I had a brew made of 0.3g (all I had on hand) and didn’t feel much of anything. It wasn’t much of a surprise, considering the MAOI dose starts around 2-3g. I just got an ounce of seeds, and I plan to up my doses slowly to see how it feels on its own. Wondering how your sessions went so I know what to expect.

Synchromystical non-coincidences as being derivations of the One Being

The unpredictability is wild to me. Such as certain people feeling nothing from a legit b. Caapi mimosa brew their first goes whilst a room full of others get the entirety of it. How can one explain this? Similarly for whatever reason for me 1.5g of acacia was immense whereas others would be totally underwhelmed. Further I wouldn't be surprised if the same dose another time might be worlds different.

300mg might be discernable if you get really still. I also wonder if the degree of functionality of ones endocrine system might play a role in sensitivities to these medicines. Diet must also be a factor. But anyway I'm not surprised that amount yielded no short term result.

I am a novice however found that Syrian rue has a very special Spirit that can show up as angelic, loving, gentle, and vastly different than something like acacia, mimosa, or even our sometimes trickster friend pcilocybin. I say trickster as the mushroom to me has been the most strange, alien, and honestly the least desirable. That's an aside.

As a meditation aide at the 3-5g range the experience sometimes yielded incredible open and closed eye dream like states whereby I found myself dreaming whilst awake. It is an oneirogen after all which is a plant which induces dreaming sometimes whilst completely conscious in ones waking life. The intense tracers one gets at the 5g range are common however I don't care for that phenomenon so much as it mostly feels like an impairment.

A poster here in the nexus spoke of the spirit also showing up at times as militant which as it turns out I too experienced. Odd indeed. By militant I mean severe. Intense. Which is quite different to how I initially shared of its qualities as being. Once again we agree on the unpredictability of these springboards!

Also worthy of noting is the similarity of higher dose rue to iboga. I had one session wherein I listened to Bwiti music which engendered extremely unique conscious dreaming of imagery which was to be totally honest rather challenging to comprehend. No doubt it was an intelligence that manifested itself to me seemingly potentiated through the indigenous music.

Food for thinking I hope though ymmv of course.

 

[AstralRoots]

I would highly recommend this. Starting LOW and inching up the dose a little every day, up to the point where it gets a bit much, you know? Then inch it back down again - you'll learn a lot about harmala dosing this way, especially if you can spread it out over a month - you could do with at least another ounce of seeds for that, but, thankfully, you have plenty to be getting started with. And it's quite fun to play with the dosing increments from some kind of numerological perspective if you're so inclined. Try to keep good notes - my harmala doses from that time are written down on the back of a till receipt somewhere - I'll have to see if i can still find it

Seconded.

 

[Maddd_Maxxx]

Synchromystical non-coincidences as being derivations of the One Being

The unpredictability is wild to me. Such as certain people feeling nothing from a legit b. Caapi mimosa brew their first goes whilst a room full of others get the entirety of it. How can one explain this? Similarly for whatever reason for me 1.5g of acacia was immense whereas others would be totally underwhelmed. Further I wouldn't be surprised if the same dose another time might be worlds different.

300mg might be discernable if you get really still. I also wonder if the degree of functionality of ones endocrine system might play a role in sensitivities to these medicines. Diet must also be a factor. But anyway I'm not surprised that amount yielded no short term result.

I am a novice however found that Syrian rue has a very special Spirit that can show up as angelic, loving, gentle, and vastly different than something like acacia, mimosa, or even our sometimes trickster friend pcilocybin. I say trickster as the mushroom to me has been the most strange, alien, and honestly the least desirable. That's an aside.

As a meditation aide at the 3-5g range the experience sometimes yielded incredible open and closed eye dream like states whereby I found myself dreaming whilst awake. It is an oneirogen after all which is a plant which induces dreaming sometimes whilst completely conscious in ones waking life. The intense tracers one gets at the 5g range are common however I don't care for that phenomenon so much as it mostly feels like an impairment.

A poster here in the nexus spoke of the spirit also showing up at times as militant which as it turns out I too experienced. Odd indeed. By militant I mean severe. Intense. Which is quite different to how I initially shared of its qualities as being. Once again we agree on the unpredictability of these springboards!

Also worthy of noting is the similarity of higher dose rue to iboga. I had one session wherein I listened to Bwiti music which engendered extremely unique conscious dreaming of imagery which was to be totally honest rather challenging to comprehend. No doubt it was an intelligence that manifested itself to me seemingly potentiated through the indigenous music.

Food for thinking I hope though ymmv of course.

Like I have heard many times, you are shown not what you want, but what you need. It seems the medicine will give you the experience it wants to give, regardless of how far the door has been opened. 4-ACO-MET was my first trip, and I have had the same dose since then and gotten totally different experiences. The first trip was stellar. I was sitting outside watching colors dance through everything, like everything was alive and moving. A giant mandala was in the sky, and I felt so at peace. It lasted about 5 hours. The second time was my most recent trip, and I did not have as much visuals. But there was plenty of internal communication with the universe. I had trouble figuring out where to plant myself during the trip, and I have realized that I become irritated when I am not where I need to be. I just have to keep moving around until I feel relieved. Apparently it was outside again on the porch, but in 40F weather. It is also where I keep my bongs, so I realized that apparently someone wants me to smoke, too. I was hesitant because I don’t care for mixing substances, but I was rewarded for listening. I brought a blanket and watched tree branches move like fractals as the sun set. I was advised that there is nothing to fear and I will be taken care of. I just have to keep trying and doing the best I can. That trip lasted 7-8 hours, and I felt euphoria for the next three days.

It is so interesting that once we listen to the universe and develop a relationship with it, life becomes smoother and easier. Of course, hardship will always happen, but these medicines allow us to seek advise.

And yes! The spirit of shrooms is very “goblinlike” to me. It means well and just wants to show you everything, but it can be very chaotic. It shoves and pushes you around, but if you pull it aside and communicate that you need a moment, it will listen. It seems to let its excitement get the better of it.

And very interesting experiences with rue! Can you elaborate on the waking dream state you experienced? What are visuals and feelings like? Also would love to hear more about the militant side. Is it intense in a wrathful way (like stories I have heard with datura) or more parental?

And yes, music definitely seems to be a great way for communication with these forces. Have personal experience with entity encounter and music.

Thanks again!

 

[AstralRoots]

Really neat that a novel tryptamine yielded beneficial results for you. I had a bizarre dream a few nights ago after a micro acacia rue go that didn't do much. Though it resulted in intense color to my dreams which was a first in quite some time due to density in mind body diet. The dream briefly entailed ultra bright crystaline forms of ecstasy which I (naturally) partook of. However I went on to note no effect which I later spoke to someone in my dream about. Probably symbolic in some way.

No doubt I agree these medicines have been utilized by humans from time in memorial. Stories of Avatars and or a pre-fallen anthropos human (original-divine human in unblemished rapport with Creation) make me wonder if these rarafied states arent engendering a degree of rapport with the Universe that once needed not anything exogenous. Long term fasting, holotropic breath, dark room retreat, full on sexual fusion can generate full blown cosmic states of consciousness.

Goblinlike, yes. Weird. Lately I've been drawn to more rooted earthly plants as opposed the myscellium type energy. Vastly different in all of the ways. With that said I have had tremendously useful mushroom journeys. One of which felt akin to a precious Ayahuasca ceremony. Many have said that one can interact with spirits of previously contacted plants whilst in rapport with others. Pretty cool. I've heard it said that aya is the grandmother, peyote wachuma San Pedro the grandfather, and the mushroom the child. Further we have many aunts, uncles, cousins, nieces, and nephews. All with their own uniquity.

Yes. I have a bit more to share... Tomorrow.

 

[MAGMA17]

We all have different sensitivities. My first experience was with 3g of syrian rue and 3g of mimosa hostilis. I'll just tell you that I completely lost consciousness of myself in this reality and I didn't remember who I was, so it's not a low dose for everyone