contaminated spore syringe?

[acolon_5]

aye i dunked over night after the first flush
took em out dried em off back in the chamber had pins within 24 hours
they are now growing fast as shit and FAT-er then last flush

the strain is golden teacher...

thank you all for your helpful input
i wouldnt of been able to do it without yall

GTs are a great strain to work with! Good pick!


Amazons are the only other cube that I think surpasses them in yield and (usually) potency... I know a cube is a cube is a cube, but for whatever reason, Amazons seem to have a little something that most cubes don't. IMHO of course.

 

[dread]

Yield and potency have nothing to do with strain...

 

[acolon_5]

Yield and potency have nothing to do with strain...

Really?

I've noted some distinct differences between strains...granted it has A LOT more to do with growing conditions and nutes provided, but there ARE differences. yeah a cube is a cube is a cube, but all cubes are not the same.

If you've ever worked with isolating substrains you will KNOW that yes, yield can be increased by isolating strong substrains. Potency really has more to do with conditions, but I have noticed that smaller mushrooms are stronger than large ones. Amazons produce many small mushrooms. B+'s generally produce large mushrooms....saying that strain has nothing at all to do with yield or potency is simply wrong, it's just not the major factor.

May I ask how long you have been growing and where you are getting your info dread?

 

[dread]

>> If you've ever worked with isolating substrains you will KNOW that yes, yield can be increased by isolating strong substrains.

Indeed, but then we are not working with multispore "strains". Isolation and cloning are in fact the ONLY ways to get consistently potent mushrooms.

Lots of new growers grow a few grows of this strain, a few grows of that strain, and then they think the results they get are due to the different strains, when in fact it's all a toss of the genetic dice. The new growers fail to take in consideration the multispore random factor...

Each spore syringe contains millions of spores, and each two spores that mate and form a dikaryon bring a different set of genetics to the substrate. When the multispore-grown mycelium is fully colonized it usually contains dozens of different substrains, each with individual genetics, and every time you do another multispore inoculation, you get another random set of genetics.

Granted, there may be some very slight differences in average potency among different strains, but this has to do more with certain strains being so long in the spore market that they have begun to undergo genetic degeneration.

The penis envy strains are an exception, of course. They seem to show a considerably higher average potency than other strains.

>> May I ask how long you have been growing and where you are getting your info dread?

I personally have grown mushrooms only for a year, but during that time I have got to know many experienced and knowledgeable growers, which have been kind enough to share their wisdom.


Give me a print of any strain that you consider less potent, and give me a couple of months time to do some cloning and isolation, and I will present to you an isolate which is at least as potent as any mushrooms of the strains that you consider more potent...

 

[acolon_5]

>> If you've ever worked with isolating substrains you will KNOW that yes, yield can be increased by isolating strong substrains.

Indeed, but then we are not working with multispore "strains". Isolation and cloning are in fact the ONLY ways to get consistently potent mushrooms.

Lots of new growers grow a few grows of this strain, a few grows of that strain, and then they think the results they get are due to the different strains, when in fact it's all a toss of the genetic dice. The new growers fail to take in consideration the multispore random factor...

This is true, however over the past few years I have noticed a trend with some different strains (we can leave substrains out of this debate, it's really a whole nother topic and it was not a good point on my end). This is over the course of a couple of years. Many grows, some from 1 master LC others from multispore. Many strains ARE very similar, and as I stated, most of the variance in potency and yield comes from the conditions in which the mushrooms is grown, how old the spores are, etc... However, to say that all cubes are 100% identical given the exact same nutrients and conditions I believe is just incorrect. Cubes are all over the world, and are growing in different conditions and with different nutrient compositions. I believe that over the thousands of years natural selection has changed them...they are not all the same. Some contaminate easier than others, have you never noted this?

I mean you can visually see differences in many of the strains of cubes out there. Personally I find that more often than not the Amazon strain that I have worked with for the past 2 years gives a more speedy (energetic) and visual experience than any GT, B+, or BPK I've worked with. There is alot more than just 4-ho/po-dmt in a Cubenis mushroom that is active (or synergizes with psilocybin/psilocin).

Each spore syringe contains millions of spores, and each two spores that mate and form a dikaryon bring a different set of genetics to the substrate. When the multispore-grown mycelium is fully colonized it usually contains dozens of different substrains, each with individual genetics, and every time you do another multispore inoculation, you get another random set of genetics.

I cannot argue with that, it's simply fact. However, I generally use a master LC, which, as I understand it, has only the top few substrains present. Maybe I got lucky on this LC I made years ago (granted its been transfered twice).

Granted, there may be some very slight differences in average potency among different strains, but this has to do more with certain strains being so long in the spore market that they have begun to undergo genetic degeneration.

Genetic degeneration usually happens when doing grain to grain transfers (or cloning) over and over. A multispore innoculation doesn't have this issue...however, I am NO genetisist (or speller for that matter) so I can't say for certian if your stament is true or not.

The penis envy strains are an exception, of course. They seem to show a considerably higher average potency than other strains.

I've never had the priveldge of growing these, so I cannot comment.

>> May I ask how long you have been growing and where you are getting your info dread?

I personally have grown mushrooms only for a year, but during that time I have got to know many experienced and knowledgeable growers, which have been kind enough to share their wisdom.

Cool! I always enjoy a debate with a fellow amature mycologist! I'm no pro, and I hope I'm not coming across as some sort of super mycologist, I'm not... I've just been growing a while (all for personal use, small grows) and noticed some differences in SOME strains...not all, but some - as you noted with the Penis Envy.

Give me a print of any strain that you consider less potent, and give me a couple of months time to do some cloning and isolation, and I will present to you an isolate which is at least as potent as any mushrooms of the strains that you consider more potent...

Not debating that fact either. Isolation and cloning can always produce a superior substrain, if you have the time and patience for trial and error.

My real point in the above post was that I enjoy the GT's for the appearance, their strong flushes (usually) and their relaxing experience (again usually).

Still, I think that strain has SOMETHING to do with your end product.

 

[dread]

I think a lot (not all of it) of the "different effects on strains" is due to the expectations of people on the strains. They acquire a new strain, then they read on the interwebs that "this strain is more visual, and this has more mindfuck, and this has less bodyload" and so on and so it becomes like a self-fulfilling prophecy...

There could however be subtle differences to the different strains. I have noticed some of this myself. But how do we analyze these differences? Each trip is different than each other, and every trip is subjective. Set & setting plays a huge part. How can we tell how much of the effects are due to differences in the mushrooms, and how much is just expectations, self-suggestion and set & setting?

Genetic degeneration usually happens when doing grain to grain transfers (or cloning) over and over. A multispore innoculation doesn't have this issue...however, I am NO genetisist (or speller for that matter) so I can't say for certian if your stament is true or not.

That's not genetic degeneration, that's senescense. It's a different concept.

Genetic degeneration of a strain happens when the gene pool is limited for a long time. The strain becomes in-bred. When the strain goes for years without getting new genetic material into it's gene pool, it slowly starts to degenerate.

To combat this, one could take such strains and start crossing them with other strains. This is somewhat tricky to do, but can be accomplished without laboratory equipment. Microscope will be needed for reliable results though.

I cannot argue with that, it's simply fact. However, I generally use a master LC, which, as I understand it, has only the top few substrains present. Maybe I got lucky on this LC I made years ago (granted its been transfered twice).

If you used spores to inoculate your LC, it will have as many substrains as any other multispore. Although, most of them have probably joined together by anastomosis, and one of the strains is a dominant strain, the genetics of all those strains are still intact in your LC.

However, to say that all cubes are 100% identical given the exact same nutrients and conditions I believe is just incorrect.

Who said that? I actually said quite the opposite. Each multispore inoculation is 0% identical, even with the exact same nutrients and conditions. It's always a toss of dice. However, the average potency of all the grows from all the strains is approximately the same.

 

[Ixxy]

Without causing a stir, I would simply like to add that in my 3 years of growing various strains of cubes, I have noticed some differences between various strains for instance GT, Amazon, B+. I usually reply on who I call my "Guinea pigs" for various reports when they sample a particular strain. I will say that in my experience, conditions under which they are grown seem to affect potency a little, same as flush, yield. But as far as potency, I would say it varies and I could be wrong entirely but I think that every batch is different. I digress. Most reports I recieve with each strain I get back are reasonably consistent IE "Amazon seemed to be very physically powerful, later switching to more of a psychological ride of thoughts, ideas and introspectiveness etc etc. whereas that last batch of B+ was more aural, kind of a shake to the body, but extremely graphic, especially when you would close your eyes."

I too have done research on myself at times and noticed something along those same lines. I usually just go by what 10 people say though instead of just me when it comes to the reports.

Also, I found it's better to dunk in cold water, refridgerator. IMHO. everyone has their own way of doing it that works for them, if you have something that works and are comfortable with go with that until you feel a change is needed.

The cold water I think acts as a way to slow contams down if there are any, I have gotten more flushes from duning in cold water rather then room temperature. The only drawback to using cold water and keeping it refridgerated is after re-casing or if you are using cakes, it sometimes takes a little longer for the casing-cake to flush. Not much longer, but instead of 24 hours you see pins, you might wait 48.
Have a great day.

 

[Ixxy]

I just want to say That I have really really enjoyed this thread. One of a better in a series of threads on the Nexus.

I remember back when I was asking those same questions. You're going to do just fine. collect a lot of prints and never be afraid to experiment! Good luck!

 

[psychosisdoses]

I just want to say That I have really really enjoyed this thread. One of a better in a series of threads on the Nexus.

I remember back when I was asking those same questions. You're going to do just fine. collect a lot of prints and never be afraid to experiment! Good luck!

why thank you!
i am glad you enjoyed reading it as much as iv enjoyed doing it!