DMT and Faith/Belief System

[psychonaught28]

I hope this is posted in the correct area.

For years after a wild breakthrough on NN-DMT I have been plagued by the challenging of my own faith that I grew up under.

During this specific breakthrough 8 years ago in 2016, I was able to see the full color spectrum for the first time in my life. Prior to this event, I was only able to see red and green. I covered a lot of information on this breakthrough in another thread posted by my friend in 2016 that can be seen in comment #36 at this link:

Breakthrough caused someone to go nuts - to the point of being dangerous

"Don't jump into it like a idiot thinking it's another "shroom" or "acid" trip. ^i dont know if id go that far with it...... i lived thru owsley blotter in the early 70's. but ya , never trust a noob. you really dont know what they are gonna do, and even the ones that have tripped , think a...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

But it wasn't necessarily that event that made me challenge my faith, it was the experience itself. I would say that the whole ability to see colors truly is amazing and miraculous, but that was like a 1/10th of the amazement I experienced with this breakthrough. The experience itself was even more amazing than being healed of color-blindness.

All that to say this: I was raised as a Christian, believing in God, His son Jesus Christ walking this Earth and dying on the cross to save us from our sins. I've always believed in the Holy trinity - the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. Breaking through didn't make me quit believing in God, if anything it confirmed my belief in an all-powerful Creator/Source. But the way I perceive "God" now, is vastly different from what and how I believed before. It's hard for me to believe that this story of Jesus is real, maybe I'm wrong. Is this just a story made by man to keep us from doing wrong and stay on "the right path" in life? I just feel like my faith in that regard has severely been challenged and my perception of it all has changed. I've never been big on "religion" itself as a whole, but I am greatly spiritual and in connection with my spirit. I don't necessarily believe anymore that there is a Heaven and Hell, but I do believe there is eternal life and that we are all part of it and/or part of this universal consiousness....I firmly believe we are all one. I experienced infinite creation, repetitive deaths and rebirths in my breakthrough, healing, I encountered entities that were not alien but were well beyond humans, more angel-like creatures, with intense power that I could feel in my own spirit during the experience itself.

I'm searching for anyone else who can corroborate this experience or chime in on it. Please tell me there are other people out there who are not only like me, but have had serious challenges with their belief systems they grew up with after experiencing DMT in whatever form, that took them beyond this human life. Can anybody relate to this experience and give me your thoughts? Does prayer even matter? Does the Bible matter? Is it really just a book made up by man/scholars? This might make some people mad, but I almost feel like going to church these days is just a waste of my time. I feel that my experience(s) with DMT have shown me more of this "God/Creator/Conscious" than I've seen in church. If I want to be closer to God, can't I just use this molecule to come face to face with Him/It again? Isn't our perception, our reality? Maybe I've lost my mind, I don't know, but my spirit tells me I know more now than I ever thought I would or could've imagined. My heart and spirit feel like my pattern of thinking is correct in regards to there being a universal consciousness with no beginning or end, that has infinite creation power, etc. I'm just full of endless questions these days.

Thank you for your time and interest in my post.

-Psychonaught

 

[bodymechanics]

I hope this is posted in the correct area.

For years after a wild breakthrough on NN-DMT I have been plagued by the challenging of my own faith that I grew up under.

During this specific breakthrough 8 years ago in 2016, I was able to see the full color spectrum for the first time in my life. Prior to this event, I was only able to see red and green. I covered a lot of information on this breakthrough in another thread posted by my friend in 2016 that can be seen in comment #36 at this link:

Breakthrough caused someone to go nuts - to the point of being dangerous

"Don't jump into it like a idiot thinking it's another "shroom" or "acid" trip. ^i dont know if id go that far with it...... i lived thru owsley blotter in the early 70's. but ya , never trust a noob. you really dont know what they are gonna do, and even the ones that have tripped , think a...

forum.dmt-nexus.me

But it wasn't necessarily that event that made me challenge my faith, it was the experience itself. I would say that the whole ability to see colors truly is amazing and miraculous, but that was like a 1/10th of the amazement I experienced with this breakthrough. The experience itself was even more amazing than being healed of color-blindness.

All that to say this: I was raised as a Christian, believing in God, His son Jesus Christ walking this Earth and dying on the cross to save us from our sins. I've always believed in the Holy trinity - the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit. Breaking through didn't make me quit believing in God, if anything it confirmed my belief in an all-powerful Creator/Source. But the way I perceive "God" now, is vastly different from what and how I believed before. It's hard for me to believe that this story of Jesus is real, maybe I'm wrong. Is this just a story made by man to keep us from doing wrong and stay on "the right path" in life? I just feel like my faith in that regard has severely been challenged and my perception of it all has changed. I've never been big on "religion" itself as a whole, but I am greatly spiritual and in connection with my spirit. I don't necessarily believe anymore that there is a Heaven and Hell, but I do believe there is eternal life and that we are all part of it and/or part of this universal consiousness....I firmly believe we are all one. I experienced infinite creation, repetitive deaths and rebirths in my breakthrough, healing, I encountered entities that were not alien but were well beyond humans, more angel-like creatures, with intense power that I could feel in my own spirit during the experience itself.

I'm searching for anyone else who can corroborate this experience or chime in on it. Please tell me there are other people out there who are not only like me, but have had serious challenges with their belief systems they grew up with after experiencing DMT in whatever form, that took them beyond this human life. Can anybody relate to this experience and give me your thoughts? Does prayer even matter? Does the Bible matter? Is it really just a book made up by man/scholars? This might make some people mad, but I almost feel like going to church these days is just a waste of my time. I feel that my experience(s) with DMT have shown me more of this "God/Creator/Conscious" than I've seen in church. If I want to be closer to God, can't I just use this molecule to come face to face with Him/It again? Isn't our perception, our reality? Maybe I've lost my mind, I don't know, but my spirit tells me I know more now than I ever thought I would or could've imagined. My heart and spirit feel like my pattern of thinking is correct in regards to there being a universal consciousness with no beginning or end, that has infinite creation power, etc. I'm just full of endless questions these days.

Thank you for your time and interest in my post.

-Psychonaught

I would say this is probably a very common experience for most who take psychedelics.
No matter what your beliefs were going in, they change coming out.

Mine change with age as well.

I recommend trusting your intuition and carving your own new path based on your experiences. Now you get to decide what you want to hang on to, and what to let go.
Build something quintessentially you.
It’s YOUR faith now

 

[Voidmatrix]

Something to mull over: one doesn't have to have beliefs. Have fun.

One love

 

[psychonaught28]

I would say this is probably a very common experience for most who take psychedelics.
No matter what your beliefs were going in, they change coming out.

Mine change with age as well.

I recommend trusting your intuition and carving your own new path based on your experiences. Now you get to decide what you want to hang on to, and what to let go.
Build something quintessentially you.
It’s YOUR faith now

@bodymechanics - I believe this comment was exactly what I needed, it's very true, especially the part about beliefs changing once psychedelics are introduced to one's life.
I really like the part about carving out a path based off of my experiences. My faith, is my faith. I guess it doesn't have to fall under any type of category. I just know there is more out there and I have faith in the fact that there is more.
It's MY faith now. I love that. Thank you.

@Voidmatrix - I agree with this as well. Nobody has to have "beliefs" of anything or of any sort. Makes sense to me.

 

[Voidmatrix]

Also the further back we go in history the less concrete information we have. Jesus may have never existed. Same for the Buddha, or any other prophet. Their teachings could possibly be questioned as whether it was from a single person, a single source, much like how we wonder with the Greek writer Homer.

In developing beliefs that we draw from, one should ask themselves, "why do I believe this, what convinces me, and why does such convince me."

We often want to believe things because we need something to believe. And in believing something, we feel that it is true, and proceed from there. This need to believe we inherit, we're indoctrinated into, and since it happens so early we rarely get to a point where we question it.

We often feel we have to believe something because others have beliefs.

But no matter what we believe, whatever is will be as it is.

You don't have to believe anything, especially anything outside your phenomenological experience.

One love

 

[bodymechanics]

@bodymechanics - I believe this comment was exactly what I needed, it's very true, especially the part about beliefs changing once psychedelics are introduced to one's life.
I really like the part about carving out a path based off of my experiences. My faith, is my faith. I guess it doesn't have to fall under any type of category. I just know there is more out there and I have faith in the fact that there is more.
It's MY faith now. I love that. Thank you.

@Voidmatrix - I agree with this as well. Nobody has to have "beliefs" of anything or of any sort. Makes sense to me.

My ideas about it all, what DMT might be doing sort of align with a book I read decades ago called Seat of the Soul.
DMT seems to reveal to me that I am actually this other being “a soul” so to speak. My soul is capable is seeing beyond the human I’m plugged into right now. My soul can communicate with with things beyond my human abilities.
My ability to have a breakthrough is dependent on my reverence for the event, my humility and willingness.

What’s odd to me is how DMT has sort of focused my “beliefs” where they used to be much more flakey.

 

[Voidmatrix]

My ability to have a breakthrough is dependent on my reverence for the event, my humility and willingness.

Hard to disagree with this since I try to have the utmost of respect and reverence and as a result, hyperspace has moved closer to me. 10mg takes me plenty far often times now. And I don't need to "breakthrough" to have at least some elements of that magnitude of experience.

One love

 

[Koduckushi]

I'm not a religious person so take this with a grain of salt, but psychedelics instilled something of a faith in there being something bigger. I'm of the mind that how you interact with your faith, whatever that may be, is the most important part of any devotion.

I have several friends who are deeply religious, and they have had their faith deepened by their dmt experiences. I dont think your crisis of faith is a bad thing, it's just you trying to understand how you want to proceed after experiencing something beyond the typical human experience.

Others may look at you differently should you tell them that your faith has changed (maybe the wrong word to use, but something has changed about how you feel toward it). Take solace in the fact that the love you have for all thing is exactly what it's all about.

I don't know you, and I don't want to ramble too hard about what you should or shouldn't do. It's YOUR life and YOUR faith in creation/God/the universe/ultimate consciousness or however you want to put it. Only you have the perspective you have, and you know how you feel about it. Don't let someone else's opinion of how YOU interact with your faith make you feel bad. It's all love.

 

[bodymechanics]

Hard to disagree with this since I try to have the utmost of respect and reverence and as a result, hyperspace has moved closer to me. 10mg takes me plenty far often times now. And I don't need to "breakthrough" to have at least some elements of that magnitude of experience.

One love

Super validating as I it’s not calling to me heavy like that right now.
I know what that means. I have a lot of personal progress to make.
Nevertheless when I think of doing it my thoughts are of 10mg as opposed to 30+
As if it’s suggesting that.
Basically I feel like I’ve seen as far as I’m going too, unless I make specific changes in my life. They both have to elevate in sync it seems.

 

[Voidmatrix]

You may get to a point like me, which is scary, but it's almost always calling...

And growth never stops, such a realization is actually an odd finality in itself.

Make those changes, so I can hear about the journeys

One love

 

[Bas Sarkin]

I think a lot of major religions originate from the shamanic dmt-experience of some kind.
Shamans, off course. But also 'soma' that the ancient Indians used, and thru which they wrote the veda's, especially advaita vedanta (non dualism) is very much in tune with a 5meoDMT experience. Kykeon was used by ancient Greeks, and influenced their religion and the growth of humanity/society a lot. Buddha is told to achieve samadhi (one-ness with the universe) via meditation. Jesus had his 40 days in the dark cave, which induces melatonin, similar to dmt, to trip balls/fight his demons/become enlightened. His whole preaching of 'I am one with god, the father' is in line with that.

They all seem to be talking about the same thing.

 

[psychonaught28]

@Voidmatrix - Your response and explanation that humans normally require some strange need for belief in something makes sense entirely. The way you explained it is kind of how I perceived it, yet I could never put it into words. I am thoroughly put at ease and have some great sense of relief reading these thoughts from you and others. I almost felt wrong for moving further away from my original belief system that I was raised with as a child. I am very glad that I posted about this struggle so I could get some sort of solace even though I don't believe what I used to. It's nice to now be in a community where I have found others who think beyond what I consider the human capability because we've experienced something that most others have not. This community is exactly the type of people I needed in this life. I don't feel that I relate much to any "normal" person these days, lol.

@bodymechanics - I will look into this book you speak of called "Seat of the Soul." I'm very interested to read it, as it sounds like a good book and possible a good point of reference. I can also relate to you in the sense of your soul being able to communicate in ways that your human form cannot. I believe we can only go so far with our human form but our spirit/soul can go much further and experience what's truly important in this life.

@Koduckushi - You definitely weren't rambling, I appreciate your input and you happen to be right on target with what I've been speaking on. To put it plain and simple, yes it was the right words to use: my faith has changed. What I have faith in has changed. But like you said, my love for all things is what matters and I do have a deep connection with the things and lifeforms of this world such as plants and animals, etc. I do believe we are all one and are all connected. I do know that this life is not the end, but what happens after death in this life form is not what I've been taught my whole life. I do believe in infinity and have faith in and of creation. There's so much more than just this human life that it's still hard to wrap my head around that. It's just not at all what I was expecting because I was always taught something different but I'm learning for myself now. I guess that is what truly matters. We are all on a journey of some sort.

Thank you all for your input, i have a lot of respect for all of you and this community as a whole. I look forward to reading and chatting more with everyone.

Much love to you all

-Psychonaught

 

[Voidmatrix]

I almost felt wrong for moving further away from my original belief system that I was raised with as a child.

Change is constant, including everything in us, especially our concepts.

Welcome to the Nexus my friend.

One love

 

[Varallo]

This is an interesting topic, especially since I very much can relate with it but from a different perspective. The conflict between beliefs and the new found reality in hyperspace is fascinating and I can imagine that it will chisel into the foundations of one’s understanding of the world and the beliefs that we have.

I’m from a very explicit atheist family and share this sentiment deeply, but by using dmt, and at times experiencing gods I see why one would think that religious beliefs might have merit after all. For me these experiences let me see what the experience of religion could be and made me understand how important that could be for some. Coming from that explicit atheist family I had learned to look down at religion and especially the doctrine and dogma that is commonly associated with it. In a way science was my religion and there was no room for religion or spiritual beliefs.
Looking back at my own experiences with gods and goddesses I think it describes my desire for religion or at least that there is more to life than just the continuation of our species.
Why and what does it al mean and how is my life going to mean anything other then the biological process that is human life.

So far I’m still an atheist but I’m more forgiving of faith (without the dogma and strange beliefs) and have more empathy for those that choose to believe in something that I just experienced and believe is my hunger for meaning beyond what science has to offer.

If I would have any tip on how to proceed with your awakening is to accept at times that some things need time to reveal itself and that others are just imagination.

 

[Orion]

In my opinion the story is the same even if you tell it backwards. An atheist could find God or a man of God could become an atheist if they have just one experience that challenges their beliefs. But in the end we are faced with just existence itself which just an extension of God in the first place. Of course that's just my opinion, as a former atheist. Perhaps it would be easier not to wrestle with previous beliefs but to adjust / expand upon them.

 

[modern]

Church or other forms of organized religions are more a part of community. I’ve also been raised Christian but even before I got into psychedelics the “cup of faith” was already hard to fill and I began learning and researching other religions and psychology.

Organized religion helps build a framework for core beliefs which most religions and faiths all have the same fundamental understandings. Not everyone, particularly those that don’t have much spare time, will be able to explore their own minds/beliefs due to having to work or simply occupied with day to day life.

Psychedelics help us very quickly reach states where we face our demons and learn about our true selfs. Some experiences like entities make use question some things while others affirm them.

Early on I used psychedelics recreationally and had many mixed results. As time passed I’ve incorporated my usage into a religious use and as a form of prayer/connection with the divine.

I continue to consider myself a Christian simply due to it being a part of my upbringing. Having not gone to church for many years even when a “practicing” Christian I’ve always favored personal practice over going to church.

You can reached altered states thru fasting, extensive prayer, meditation, even reading texts. I wouldn’t say religion is bullshit it simply is no longer for you. I personally will always opt for private practice however at times I do wish to go to a santo daime or udv church here for the sense of community that comes with the organized practice.

Reading and researching on your own, be it psychedelics or religious texts, is fine but having a community, church, where you can share experiences and ask questions is also helpful.

I think church and organized religions are more for community and those that wish to go deeper into the practice will spend time on their own and sometimes also see church as a waste of time since they can have a closer relationship with God in private. Not everyone wants a deep psychological experience and just surface understanding and basic practices is enough without the life changing experience.

Also if these teachers were real or not they could also just allude to more complex ideas we all have a basic understanding of like the hero’s quest fighting our demons and our wanting to know about the afterlife.

 

[psychonaught28]

They all seem to be talking about the same thing.

I've thought about that for years and I completely agree. The main foundations of every "religion" is pretty much the same. In a way, I feel like everyone praying to "their own God," is everyone praying to the same God without recognizing it.

Change is constant, including everything in us, especially our concepts.

Welcome to the Nexus my friend.

One love

Thank you for the warm welcome I'm blessed and very greatful to be amongst others like myself in hyperspace. I'm also glad to know I will not be shunned away for my beliefs....or should I say; lack there of? lol.

This is an interesting topic, especially since I very much can relate with it but from a different perspective. The conflict between beliefs and the new found reality in hyperspace is fascinating and I can imagine that it will chisel into the foundations of one’s understanding of the world and the beliefs that we have.

I appreciate your input and perspective. I can definitely see how something like dmt could change anyone's perspective or beliefs. I find interesting the thought that it has the potential to change a believer into a non-believer and an atheist into a believer. That in itself is pretty fascinating.
As far as the science portion, I feel like science is just a way to give meaning to the world, or a way to provide logical answers to us humans. I can understand someone following science through their life rather than standing behind radical beliefs of some sort.

@modern - I agree with everything you have said really. It resonates and makes sense. I feel that some people may not want to hear it in those exact words because of the fear that what they believe in may not be true, which could shatter their life because it's the very core of their belief system. I'm pretty open-minded, so walking away from the belief system I had isn't such a big deal to me, even though it's all I knew for the majority of my life in regards to faith. I never knew I'd even question my beliefs, or that I would be so accepting of not believing the same thing anymore after so many years. In this regard, I actually surprised myself.


To everyone: I appreciate all of the thorough feedback. Thank you for your acceptance and words of wisdom. I appreciate each and everyone of you more than I can express. Nexus is such a special place.

-Psychonaught

 

[psychonaught28]

In my opinion the story is the same even if you tell it backwards. An atheist could find God or a man of God could become an atheist if they have just one experience that challenges their beliefs. But in the end we are faced with just existence itself which just an extension of God in the first place. Of course that's just my opinion, as a former atheist. Perhaps it would be easier not to wrestle with previous beliefs but to adjust / expand upon them.

Agreed. I actually just posted this very same thing in reply to someone else's comment. Great minds think alike, as they say.

 

[Varallo]

In my opinion the story is the same even if you tell it backwards. An atheist could find God or a man of God could become an atheist if they have just one experience that challenges their beliefs. But in the end we are faced with just existence itself which just an extension of God in the first place. Of course that's just my opinion, as a former atheist. Perhaps it would be easier not to wrestle with previous beliefs but to adjust / expand upon them.

I appreciate your input and perspective. I can definitely see how something like dmt could change anyone's perspective or beliefs. I find interesting the thought that it has the potential to change a believer into a non-believer and an atheist into a believer. That in itself is pretty fascinating.
As far as the science portion, I feel like science is just a way to give meaning to the world, or a way to provide logical answers to us humans. I can understand someone following science through their life rather than standing behind radical beliefs of some sort.

I agree that this is the case sometimes but I feel that it’s not the case for me. In me it revealed a desire I didn’t know I had and made me understand that this feeling was was something that leads to faith in others. Before I could not understand that beyond the cultural childhood indoctrination anyone with a little bit of critical thinking would come to the conclusion that the concept of god was real. Now I think that depending upon the situation of the person this feeling could grow and become a reality.

Tripping showed me another perspective on religion and gave me a reference point for understanding of religious people. I’m still an atheist and and don’t think that is something that is going to change.

 

[psychonaught28]

I agree that this is the case sometimes but I feel that it’s not the case for me.

Tripping showed me another perspective on religion and gave me a reference point for understanding of religious people. I’m still an atheist and and don’t think that is something that is going to change.

I feel the same happened for me, but kind of backwards to your situation. It's similar, but different, because both of our perspectives and viewpoints originated from different spots.

As I said before, I was raised a Christian. After multiple breakthroughs with NN-DMT, I do not follow the same beliefs anymore. I can understand why people believe and feel the need to have something to believe in. So in this regard, I understand having a reference point as you mentioned. But, I really find "religion" as a whole to be a waste of my time and very empty, not aligning with my current beliefs at this point in my life.

This is something I never thought I would say, but that is the simple, cold hard truth after what I've seen and experienced beyond humanity in this place we call "hyperspace" and/or "the cosmos."

-Psychonaught