DMT as a smart drug ie congitive enhancer

[polytrip]

I read an article the other day about muscimol as a "brain enhancer", can't seem to
find the article today though=(.
From the one time I tried it My brain felt very clear and speedy.

I noticed this effect as well, but i don't know if muscimol is good for you in the long run.

 

[SnozzleBerry]

From the one time I tried it My brain felt very clear and speedy.

I noticed this effect as well...

Yea, me too. I went for a walk on amanitas and had so much mental energy/clarity/speed. I found myself thinking how easy it would be to work someone up into a frenzied state on amanitas and how much energy they'd have; really made me wonder if the viking use stories were true, definitely seems plausible.

 

[lyserge]

Enjoyed reading all the above. I'm a math nerd myself, and I've noticed that the tryptamine and phenethylamine compounds tend to have their own unique effects on perception/learning/integrating of mathematical concepts. Azrael, it was particularly confirming to hear you also make the connection between "Hyperspace" and the structures studied by pure mathematicians. Most pure mathematicians, like (I believe) most experienced Spice smokers, tend to consider the structures they investigate/perceive/discover to be already existing, quite apart from human investigation, and strictly discovered as a result of investigation. A rather controversial/upsetting minority of mathematicians (and, I believe, Spice smokers) consider the realms they investigate to be invented by human investigators. Personally I'm more convinced of the separate reality of these mathematical structures that arise out of the basic rules of logic, ideas about sets, observations about patterns in the universe, etc. I'm not so convinced about the separate reality of "Hyperspace", but I generally feel very convinced after interactions with "Hyperspace" or its "envoys".

But I digress. I'm personally far more interested in the applications of phenethylamines (including, potentially, LSD and related compounds) in the study of mathematics. Why? Simply, the amphetamines and caffeine are well known by mathematicians to aid the rationalistic/intuitive processes they use in their work. Given the structural and psychoactive similarities between the phenethylamines and the amphetamines, they seem the natural avenue for investigation. I haven't studied mathematics in depth since my first interface with a phenethylamine compound, but after a number of chess games while on a strong dose of 2C-B, as well as trips to the library and art galleries, I can report back with confidence that this compound very much empowers the mental structures that are responsible for chess play - strategy, etc. - and I've never had a more intense chess game. A friend will be investigating several of the other 2c-x compounds this fall, and will report back on their potential uses in mathematical study.

I feel that the tryptamines could be very useful in their activation of right-brain activity. Personally I'm very weak in my spatial reasoning skills, but I feel that both psilocybin mushrooms and DMT help me to visualize space and 3- or higher-dimensional structures quite powerfully. I also feel that cannabis is useful in this regard, though I've grown to dislike the mind-numbing effects of cannabis, or at least the cannabis that is available in these parts (perhaps varieties like those grown in South Africa might not be so mind-numbing, I hear).

I get the opposite effect from smoked Spice. After a Spice session, I am left with a feeling/bodily message of "go forward". Hence it might be very helpful in mathematical or other studies. I've noticed that there are two basic parts to mathematical studies on both the student and research level. First, the researcher must wade through all the previous work that has been done in a given field, in order to learn about the relevant structures in that field, and what is known about the given structures as established through papers and theorems. Once the researcher has a good idea about a given subject area (and in reality mathematicians generally study very specialized areas of a given subject area, say, algebra or number theory), he'll naturally develop new ideas or questions about these structures, and then go to work to find answers to these questions. This is the second basic part of mathematics studies - applying what is known to further the understanding about a given subject.

I think of the first part of the study - investigating what's already known - to be a left-brained activity, whereas the second part - establishing new results - to be a more right-brained activity. The reason is that the latter process relies on one's mathematical intuition - not conscious, step-by-step thinking, but more lateral thinking that's not on the conscious level. Instead, it involves the brain's entire (and incredible) capabilities. Some of the more famous mathematicians, such as the eccentric and prolific Paul Erdos (who used amphetamine heavily for the betterment of mathematical knowledge), are renowned for their incredible ability to "see" proofs or routes to answering a given question.

I think this lateral thinking aspect of mathematical learning/research is where the psychedelics have the greatest potential. I agree with polytrip that the level of benefit would probably be more at the subconscious level, rather than at mind-blowing, +++ states - hence small doses. Like ya'll I'll be investigating this, hope to hear more reports soon.

 

[polytrip]

So there are mainly two different ways in wich psychedelic's could maybe be used as a cognitive enhancer.

1-Studying a subject while in a psychedelic state, wich would make the whole learning experience make a deeper mark. The downside of this method is that while being in the psychedelic state, you certainly are less able to function. Your mind will be slower or much slower, depending on how deep the state is, and you will be more easily distracted.
The upside is that this method has probably a lasting effect.

I do think though, that in order for this method to work, you would have to do something about the stuff you where learning, when sober as well. I think it will definately be more helpfull to repeat the stuff you have learned, once you're sober or to prepare the mind to soak up the information, prior to using this method.

2-The other method is to take a psychedelic in amounts too small to have noticeable psychedelic effects.

If you're solving a complex problem, a sudden moment of insight will often get you the answer.
This is because the subcounscious mind, wich is capable of processing much more comlex information than the counscious mind can hold, has been working on the problem. Once it has cracked it, the insight often comes popping-up.

A psychedelic in amounts too small for you to realy feel it's effects will still be noticed by the subcounscious mind, and it will be stimulated by the psychedelic. At the same time it will narrow the gap between the subcounscous mind and the counsious mind a little, so the transfer of information will maybe go smoother.

 

[ms_manic_minxx]

This is an integral part of why I commune regularly.

My musical abilities become astounding (sometimes lasting into the next day), and my flexibility is through the roof. There are SO MANY COGNITIVE BENEFITS. Not to mention, I am more grounded, lack negative emotional reactions (anger, fear, etc.)...

Even with <5g of Caapi only, I experience similar and very significant effects. I love a little shot before I sit down to write, because my command of language expands into another world, my writing becomes so sharp and rich with multiple layers of metaphors (other people also comment on my writing, and I just smile, because they love it most when it's beta-carboline induced).

I only wonder if it's like Flowers for Algernon, and I'll fade away if I stop.

I hit a state so deeply on the solstice, that when I came down, I literally watched the light DRAIN FROM THE ROOM. I observed my senses DULL as I dropped to baseline.

We're lacking something that allows us to operate at our ultimate potential, I wholly believe. This is medicine...

 

[Adivino]

ms_manic_minxx, you say that with caapi you are able to write with an expanded language. Can you decide what to write and do it very well, or you just write very well but of *something*, which is not necessarily what you wanted to write. Also, do your writings make complete sense if you read them when completely sober? Do you feel as if they were actually written by you?

 

[ms_manic_minxx]

My writing takes on an incredible depth of expanded metaphor on multiple levels. It shifts from one-dimensional description to metaphors that tie together many different angles and elements of the piece--definitely a product of making more connections. I tend toward more alliteration and other literary devices, too. And it just spews out of me. It makes MORE sense than I could ever consciously intend.

I do loads of creative writing, I've written things here or there for websites, and the only times people really rant and rave over what I've written, is when my rational mind is smashed apart by beta carbolines. So it kind of makes me laugh, when people are like, "Oh!! I love your writing!! You have such a command of language!!" The only writings I SERIOUSLY get comments on are my Ayahuasca writings.

My writing feels comparatively flat, sober. Not that it's bad or that I can't write, but the vine definitely helps disable blocks between myself and pure creativity.

I experience SO MANY positive cognitive effects from these medicines. I was also able to pick up the guitar, something that I quit years ago because it was too difficult. I felt like I was having a hard time learning new things... not anymore. I cherish spice and Aya equally for this.

 

[azrael]

Well lysergify the left/right brain association sounds dead on, also happy to hear there's another Nexian on math

Maybe you can help make sense of it.

Is this right: hyperspace can act as a lens to view part of the separate reality that mathematical concepts exist in? If so, are we only allowed to see what has been identified? The spicer in me wonders: if some of the unknown objects there are already concepts that the rest of our brain can't identify, what tools or understanding would someone need to identify an alien concept and relate it back out of abstraction? ah, it would be such a big deal to figure that out.

I'd be ecstatic to read about the combo of math and phens (mesc, 2c-x) for a number of reasons. Clarity, focus, ability to abstract, visualize, etc. without being as rough on the psyche. If I come across any anecdotes, I'll be sure to contribute.

ms_manic_minxx, glad you have such success writing with the medicines. How do you focus?

 

[ms_manic_minxx]

With microdosing (<5g), there is only a greater clarity of mind and focus. With maxidosing, there is complete inebriation.

I always joke that with enough DMT, I may *even* be able to learn math one day. :idea: All you'd have to do is phone the highschool physics/trigonometry teachers who either failed or socially promoted me for absolute proof of nootropic value (where I lack in numbers, I compensate in words/language/music ).

 

[lyserge]

Well lysergify the left/right brain association sounds dead on, also happy to hear there's another Nexian on math

Agreed, good to see you here as well; today at the cafe I nearly choked in glee when I heard the fellows in line discussing "random walks" and "recursion formulas". Math people are special. Hope this ain't too far off topic, but did you know that over 20% of mathematicians have some form of belief in a "Higher Power"? Out of all the natural scientists it's by far the highest - compare to about 5% for biologists and 3% for physicists. I think studying the properties of mathematical structures - or Hyperspace - puts us in contact with something transcendental. Something that clearly "was not made by the hands of men" (as Robert Hunter/Grateful Dead put it). Physicists, biologists, etc., can more easily ascribe the structures they see to the natural laws of the evolution of the universe, but mathematicians find it more difficult to do so. Hence the skewed numbers. That's my take anyways...

Is this right: hyperspace can act as a lens to view part of the separate reality that mathematical concepts exist in? If so, are we only allowed to see what has been identified?

Well I don't think they're in any sense "separate realities", in that the universe/multiverses all intersect in the here/now. They're connected manifolds, in the language of the topologist. Also, I certainly haven't found anything during Hyperspatial excursions that compare to anything I've studied in mathematics. Has anyone else?

The spicer in me wonders: if some of the unknown objects there are already
concepts that the rest of our brain can't identify, what tools or understanding would someone need to identify an alien concept and relate it back out of abstraction? ah, it would be such a big deal to figure that out.

I'm not sure what you're asking here. Are you asking how to symbolically describe, in a phenomenologically accurate way, what's seen/experienced during a DMT trip?

I'd be ecstatic to read about the combo of math and phens (mesc, 2c-x) for a number of reasons. Clarity, focus, ability to abstract, visualize, etc. without being as rough on the psyche. If I come across any anecdotes, I'll be sure to contribute.

Agreed, and I'll do the same with small doses of DMT. DMT seems to aid all of the capabilities you mentioned without being too rough on the psyche, and has always, for me, had a "go forward" element to it. Very motivating.

Hope this isn't going too far off topic; it's not always clear to me where the line is drawn and a new thread should be started. Cheers.

 

[azrael]

Are you asking how to symbolically describe, in a phenomenologically accurate way, what's seen/experienced during a DMT trip?

Yeah, visuals described symbolically so that they can be understood by humans and computers, allowing for manipulation/variation and probably used in animation. Better way of saying it: what branches would that be?

I'd say we're off the topic of dmt as a smart drug. Still hoping vovin and others report back with any findings.

 

[vovin]

latest experiement has lead me to conclude that DMT acts as a speed drug in the brain. The neuron can only handle X amount of use as it's resources are diminished. Naturally it puts out enough function to equal the amount of resources that it can be replenished. Thus over a reasonable period of time it is in equilibrium taking in the resources and outputting the functions it is designed for in a linear ratio. With DMT what appears to occur is that you are essentially having the neuron put out all it's function as fast as possible thus the (higher state) that we experience. However after putting out all of this there is a issue. The neuron has run out of resources and therefore it has to refuel which may explain why after a trip I yawn repeatedly as my brain has expended it's reserves of oxygen and therefore requires more oxygen to replenish itself.

Just a guess based upon logic I have observed. But much of the observed evidence seems to be pointing in that direction. The question then arises if we super fuel the neuron and allow it to receive fuel at a much faster rate than normal can we maintain this increased cognitive function safely for longer periods of time.

Anology:
We have a car with 1 gallon of gas in the tank. Feeding into the tank is a tube that provides 1 gallon of gas per hour to the tank. The car runs at X speed at a efficency of 60 miles per gallon. Therefore as long as we maintain this speed the tube will fill the tank at the same rate that we use the gas and we will not run out of gas. If we accelerate to a faster speed then the reserve gallon in the tank will be consumed and the tank will run dry thus causing the car to stop.

Now the only effective way of maintaining this accelerated speed would be to increase the replenishment at a faster pace. Thus the theory is that providing the brain with more resources should allow one to maintain a higher cognitive function for a longer period of time.

I have often theorized that since all brains are essentially the same higher cognitive functions on some people as opposed to others is fundamentally a effect of efficency. In short using the anology before some peoples brains get a higher mileage per gallon than others.

Didn't huxley say that on psychedelic's the brain is at a higher level of understanding, but engages only in those things that realy matter?

In your analogy, according to huxley then, there doesn't need to be an imbalance between resources and performance. All the activity can be focussed on those things that realy matter, therefore saving 'fuel' by inhibiting all involvement in things of less significance.
Like a 1 milliwatt laser emits more intense light than a 40 watt lightbulb.

Just about everything huxley wrote is right. The man just knew how to explain things far better than I but he is sooo right on in his explanations. If you havent read his works then you need to.

With microdosing (<5g), there is only a greater clarity of mind and focus. With maxidosing, there is complete inebriation.

Well put, I have found that low lvls of spice with a maoi to prolong it's use is very useful but many of the great insights I have usually are just short realizations that are no more than a sentence or paragraph in length. Which is why I am taking so long to compile all my writings into a book it's not easy organizing single sentences into a coherent book.

Essentially I theorize that spice supresses the ego and allows one to see things unbiased.

"When the doors of perception are cleansed we see things as they truly are" -Huxley

I simply couldn't say it better myself. The use of cognitive enhancers assists in the thought process. Provigil gives me much more of a intellectual mentality. Math, science, technical things are augmented. Piracetam gives me more of a poetic mentality wherein I see the beauty and syncronicity of the world. I have also found that those b12 drinks drastically improve my experience. You can buy them at just about any gas station usually called 5 hour energy drinks.

 

[WSaged]

I hit a state so deeply on the solstice, that when I came down, I literally watched the light DRAIN FROM THE ROOM. I observed my senses DULL as I dropped to baseline.

We're lacking something that allows us to operate at our ultimate potential, I wholly believe. This is medicine...

That's really quite beautiful!


WS

 

[۩]

I hit a state so deeply on the solstice, that when I came down, I literally watched the light DRAIN FROM THE ROOM. I observed my senses DULL as I dropped to baseline.

We're lacking something that allows us to operate at our ultimate potential, I wholly believe. This is medicine...

That's really quite beautiful!


WS

This dullness occurs when you turn the gain, or sensitivity if you will, down on your sensors. (For example: Coming down from exogenous neurotransmitter supplementation)
Yes, n,n-dmt, as well as a myriad of other chemicals, do change sensitivity frequencies on the human central nervous system's sensors.

Permanent alterations to this frequency can be achieved to the point where exogenous molecules are no longer needed and one can live in a state of permanent heightened awareness.

 

[Dimitrius]

Permanent alterations to this frequency can be achieved to the point where exogenous molecules are no longer needed and one can live in a state of permanent heightened awareness.

Yes. Yes! I like this.

 

[Virola78]

"If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things through narrow chinks of his cavern." -William Blake

Reminds me of Plato who used the allegory of the cave:

(wiki)
'Plato imagines a group of people who have lived chained in a cave all of their lives, facing a blank wall. The people watch shadows projected on the wall by things passing in front of a fire behind them, and begin to ascribe forms to these shadows. According to Plato, the shadows are as close as the prisoners get to seeing reality. He then explains how the philosopher is like a prisoner who is freed from the cave and comes to understand that the shadows on the wall are not constitutive of reality at all, as he can perceive the true form of reality rather than the mere shadows seen by the prisoners.'

back on topic:
One day last summer on 200mg mescaline i could 'feel' an electric fence from some meters distance, with my legs!
It was a big bad fence for sure. Very disturbing vibes. Seriously.

If you happen to find yourself on mescaline, go to a big electric fence and check it out yourself.
Very strange.

I will try it again some other occasion.
silly me..

 

[Dimitrius]

"If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things through narrow chinks of his cavern." -William Blake

If you happen to find yourself on mescaline, go to a big electric fence and check it out yourself.

Yeah, electricity, errrrr. Bzzz :shock: Ahhh!