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Few questions on Cybs hybrid ATB salt tek

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lloydy2013

Rising Star
SWIM just wanted to double check a couple things on Cybs hybrid ATB salt tek since SWIM tried his first extraction a couple days ago and failed just wanted to check a few things before trying again.
Link to tek being used:

Cybs' Hybrid ATB 'Salt' Tek - DMT-Nexus Wiki

wiki.dmt-nexus.me wiki.dmt-nexus.me

1) There is no defatting step in this guide would SWIM get any benefits from defatting as an extra step included after the salting and before the basifying ? also if there would be any benefit how much naptha should SWIM use each time to defat ?

2) SWIM just wanted to check a few things about step 6 (adding the non-polar solvent)
here is step 6 copy and pasted:

Measure out 50ml of naphtha (lighter fluid) and pour into the bottle.
Lightly shake and roll the mixture in a 'figure of 8' fashion (or like peddling a bike) for 20-30 seconds.(The idea is for the naphtha to 'touch' every part of the base mix)
Unscrew the cap momentarily to release any pressure build-up then tighten again.
Place back in a heat bath. (Heated pulls draw more product)
Leave for a while until the naphtha separates again. (edit: This has been reported to take an hour or so the first time (occasionally))
REPEAT THIS four times (shake/separate) to thoroughly mix them together. This should take around 45 mins.

SWIM wondered where it says REPEAT THIS FOUR TIMES , does this mean adding an extra 50ml of naptha each time, ending with 200ml of naptha for the pulls ? or does this mean exactly what it says just shake and leave to separate four times? SWIM thought 50ml of naptha was a very small amount to put into the roasting dish 200ml sounded more right to him?

3) SWIM wondered when pulling instead of doing 3 pulls and using 3 roasting dishes, couldn't 3 pulls all be put into the same roasting dish to freeze?
SWIM also wanted to check if mason jars would be fine to use instead of roasting dishes, and if so how would go about scraping the crystals out?

SWIM wanted to say a big thank you in advance for anyone who gets the time to read this and reply and couldn't express enough how grateful would be and how HUGE of a help would be
 
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I don't want to spam lloydy2013's thread, but I have a question again, and i feel this thread is more appropriate to ask at.

Cyb, you advised me in the official extraction help thread some time ago


'95% acetic is strong, you won't need much. (vinegar is only 5%)'
Wink
Click to expand...

The acetic acid i have is 95 %, and this the only acid i can use atm. So you're saying it's too strong ?

Can I use it though for your hybrid tek? If so, what should be the ratios, if, let's say i extract from 50g MHRB/ ? Maybe less acid, or it should be the same as described in the tek (60 ml acid to 200 ml distilled water.) Do i have to dilute the acid somehow? Should the warming be treated in a different manner?
 
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I would strongly suggest you dilute the 95% acetic acid, or use only a very small amount of it... If not, you might need more sodium hydroxide later on to achieve pH 13 in the basic phase...

60 ml of 5% vinegar contains approx. 3 gr of acetic acid...
If you have 95% acetic acid, it would take a little bit more than 3 ml to achieve desired pH in acidic phase (if undiluted)...
If you don't dilute you may have to add extra water in a later stage of the extraction (or your basic mix will be too viscous) so why not dilute it to start with?

So far for my 2 cents...
 
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dooby, does this mean that for the ratios as described in tek - 50g mhrb/ ~30 g NaOH/ overall mixture volume 750 ml, i can use ~ 3 ml of my acetic acid? Just to start the acidification with that little acid in 200-250 ml distilled water? Would that be fine?
 
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slugware said:
i can use ~ 3 ml of my acetic acid? Just to start the acidification with that little acid in 200-250 ml distilled water? Would that be fine?
Click to expand...
Tricky to say without pH meter or litmus but a couple of teaspoons would probably do it.
(Guessing of course)
Or you could just dilute 1 part of 95% with a fair bit of water to get back to 5%.
 
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scottishdnb said:
When I have my 3 dishes in the freezer, does it matter where should I store my bottle containing the mixture?
Also, is the UK brand of K2 Lighter Fluid okay to use?
Click to expand...
Doesn't matter where you store the bottle (not near the kids or pets obviously) ...next day just keep pulling till nothing comes out in the freeze...not sure about K2 (not heard of it) but Ronsonol is everywhere.😉
 
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cyb said:
slugware said:
and if I do that, then i mix 60 ml of that ~ 5% acid to 200 ml water? and add that ~260 ml acidified water to bark?
Click to expand...
pH 2-4 is what you're after :thumb_up:
(paper should turn red, as long as it's acidic...your good to go.)
Click to expand...

If you mix 3 ml of your 95% acetic acid into 57 ml of water that should amount to about the same as having store-bought 5% vinegar, with less impurities probably as well...
Checking pH can't hurt but shouldn't be necessary... So yes, you're on the right track, may your yield be pure and plentiful...
 
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Thanks again Cyb !

A few additional questions. How much is generally lost in a re-x? Is a plastic blender okay to use for the root bark? Will an open window in wintertime affect the extraction?
 
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scottishdnb said:
A few additional questions. How much is generally lost in a re-x? Is a plastic blender okay to use for the root bark? Will an open window in wintertime affect the extraction?
Click to expand...
1. Depends on how much gunk drops out...but keep washing/Re-Xing the gunk over and over till no Xtals precipitate in the freezer.
2. Whole or shredded rootbark will wreck the plastic on your blender (scratch it to death) but if you don't mind that, then go for it (glass blender is better)
3. No, you are using a heat bath so a cool breeze can't hurt and some ventilation is a good thing.
😉
 
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Now i have another thing to ask

Is it okay, if i do an extraction but have longer time intervals between basifying and adding the NPS and pulling

What i have in mind

1st day - Do the acidifying, salting and basifying
2nd day (~ 20 hours after basifying) - add NPS. Do the pulls (Reported pulls on this tek are ~ 1 hour / pull > approx. 4 hours/4 pulls

put collected solvent from all the pulls into the same vessel. Need to saturate the nps, Evap it to about half of its volume with a fan on a room temp - 200 ml > 100 ml.

put the pulled solvent into flat baking dish into the freezer >

3rd day > take out from freezer, drain NPS, dry with a fan, scrape .

So, will those longer pauses affect extraction and how will it would be affected. I am majorly concerned wuth leaving the basified mix for so long?
 
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Hello, travellers :)

I did 3 extractions using Cyb's hybrid salt tek, as i am newbie and just getting into spice extraction. I have relatively good results from these extractions. I try to follow the tek by the letter. Only thing i deviate is the time involved into the process. As i asked in my previous posts in this thread, i leave the basified mix overnight, and that does seem ok to my humble knowledge so far.

My first extraction yielded pretty white and fluffy crystals, about 0.8 g from 50 g mhrb. My second and third extractions though gave me yellowish and gummy material. I already re-xed the second batch once, have smoked 3 times from it, and the last time i had a really frightening expreince. So i suppose there might be some bad impurities left in there and i will re-x it two more times and will re-x my 3rd batch three times.

I got lab grade chemicals now - acetic acid (which i used since my first extraction), NaOH and NaCl. I don't want to use table salt anymore, cause as it seems all the commercially available salt in my country is iodised. I also got acetone for cleaning the spice and will try to make changa with it.


A thing i want to change is the base i use. Although i got this lab clean NaOH, i prefer using some other base, preferably a foodsafe one. I read on the FAQ section Potassium Hydroxide might be used for basifying, when applying A/B tek . I also see that some people use Lime for that purpose, but suppsedly for Dry teks.

So has anyone used any of those bases in that tek. I'm interested to know if someone has used KOH for basifying in this particular tek or Cyb's MaxIon tek(I think i'm going to try it next times)

I read that KOH is pretty well soluble in water, as where Lime is not that soluble. What would you people advise me.

I can still use that NaOH, but prefer to get some food-safe chemical instead.

Blessings All!
 
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cyb said:
scottishdnb said:
The Tek Says to use 3 Glass Roasting Dishes to do 5 Pulls? So how many pulls is there to each dish ?

:)
Click to expand...
One pull per dish (3 in the freezer on the first day)
BUT
You can combine all your pulls into one dish if you like...but you must evap away some of the volume before freezing first to concentrate it...(around half if have all your pulls in together)

It's better to save and reuse all your solvent though, rather than evapping it (save your pennies)
:thumb_up:
Click to expand...

Old thread but would it be an option to do the first pull with 50 ml naphtha and the following pulls with 25 ml to gain a more concentrated solution? (If one wanted to use just one dish for all pulls combined and not doing evap before freezing).
 
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zikzak said:
Old thread but would it be an option to do the first pull with 50 ml naphtha and the following pulls with 25 ml to gain a more concentrated solution? (If one wanted to use just one dish for all pulls combined and not doing evap before freezing).
Click to expand...
30ml of solvent can hold 1g of product (concentrated) (We see this with re-x)
It doesn't make sense to use more than 30ml for pulls (no matter what the size of extraction)

Smaller is OK if you can retrieve small amounts successfully.
Easier to just pull out what you can...combine...evap a bit...then toss it in the freezer and go to bed. :thumb_up:
 
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HumbleTraveler said:
scottishdnb said:
The Tek Says to use 3 Glass Roasting Dishes to do 5 Pulls? So how many pulls is there to each dish ?

:)
Click to expand...

You add 50ml, agitate the mixture by gently rolling 4x, and then after the final agitation, remove the naphtha and transfer it to a dish and place it in the freezer. You dont want 200ml of naphtha in your extraction vessel at one time. Its 50ml each pull.

SWIM usually does the 1st pull in its own dish, then 2-3 and 3-4 in their own dish, but in a slightly larger size dish to help spread out the surface area. You dont want the naphtha to get deep in a confined space. SWIM never had success with mason jars. Pyrex dishes are the truth, much easier to work with.


Also, SWIM has always defatted prior to salting. Just 1 pull with 50ml of naphtha. Once thats done, salt and then basify. The defat seems to help, swim left the defat out once and there was actually a very significant amount more goo. With a defat, swim usually never sees goo. Its 98% crystals with very very little gooing.

Remember to keep everything warm/hot. Super super hot is not necessary as Cyb touched on that somewhere at some point, hot is good, scalding hot is bad.
Click to expand...


Hi there, May i ask why it's reccomended to do hot but not boiling hot heat baths ??

I'm not sure exactly of the science behind this part of the tek, But apparently some people prefer doing cold pulls, Some do luke warm heat baths, Some do very hot heat baths. Would boiling a pot of water and turning it off and placing the main mixing bottle inside be a bad thing ??

And let's just say hypothetically someone did use boiling hot water for the solvent heat bath stage, Why would this be a problem ??

Cheers
 
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