..i might also mention that it is possible to vaporise harmala extracts, and then orally ingest dmt to achieve a kind of pharmahuasca, if you weren't aware of this...
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Harmine In Passioflora Caerulea - Higher than P. Incarnata
- Thread starter Ambivalent
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nen888 said:
Wow I did not know this, thanks!
You know, I live in an area that is abundant with passiflora vines. What kind of extraction do you think would be best? I would love to test incarnata, caerulea, and do some research on some other ones to see if they would be wise choices..
nen888 said:
I dont think so. Ive tried it-doesnt work. Vaping harmalas has not been shown as far as I know to inhibit MAO-A in the gut..which is why it must be consumed orally in order to activate oral DMT. If you dont have complete inhibition in the gut itself the DMT will still be deactivated by the mao enzymes in the gut requardless of how much inhibiton there is in the brain.
fractal enhancement wrote
experiments by myself, friends, & D.M. Turner (in the 90s) showed that smoking of MAOIs can produce gut effects, the duration being approx. 40 minutes..as i understand it, the MAO system is interconnected between brain, gut and liver..once a sufficent level of inhibition activity has occurred, it affects the entire system, as the MAO-inhibiting compound (by whatever ROA) is now distributed in the blood stream...
...
..i tried a couple of times and it worked, though not as effectively as in the gut..bear in mind smoked dosage was large (rue), and over period of 40 minutes, and whole plant material (large amount golden wattle) was consumed..tryptamines, while not MAO inhibiting via this route, would nonetheless 'occupy' available MAO, leading themselves to partial inhibition..perhaps also anti-oxidants in plants also aids MAOI activity (as suggested by D. McKenna 1984)
experiments by myself, friends, & D.M. Turner (in the 90s) showed that smoking of MAOIs can produce gut effects, the duration being approx. 40 minutes..as i understand it, the MAO system is interconnected between brain, gut and liver..once a sufficent level of inhibition activity has occurred, it affects the entire system, as the MAO-inhibiting compound (by whatever ROA) is now distributed in the blood stream...
...
..P. cearulea has a history of use as a sedative and antispasmodic in the Mediterranean and Argentina [Duke & Vasquez 1994; Pammel 1911; Voogelbreinder 2009]..much of the sedative and probable MAOI activity is probably due to the flavonoids chrysin and kaempferol (both MAOIs), as well as harmine, harmaline and harmol (the amounts of harmalas present not adequately established)
similarly P. incarnata contains flavonoids (1.5% from stem/leaves) such as apigenin and kaempferol, also MAOIs, as well as 0.1-0.2% harmalas (possibly higher depending on season/variety) , leaves when smoked have been said to have cannabis-like effects [Sigel 1976; Voogelbreinder 2009]
..i noticed one mistake in the excellent Passiflora section of Snu Voogelbreinder's Garden Of Eden (2009), which was that effects ascribed to the known psychoactive P. alba by 'E' were infact from P. subpeltata..i think i'll start a passionflowers thread..
in the meanwhile here's the thread topic plant, Passiflora caerulea (which for all we know, may have higher amounts of harmalas than incarnata..if 2 x 5minute dilue acetic acid washings gets 0.01%, more extensive extraction sounds promising)
also the fruit is edible...
similarly P. incarnata contains flavonoids (1.5% from stem/leaves) such as apigenin and kaempferol, also MAOIs, as well as 0.1-0.2% harmalas (possibly higher depending on season/variety) , leaves when smoked have been said to have cannabis-like effects [Sigel 1976; Voogelbreinder 2009]
..i noticed one mistake in the excellent Passiflora section of Snu Voogelbreinder's Garden Of Eden (2009), which was that effects ascribed to the known psychoactive P. alba by 'E' were infact from P. subpeltata..i think i'll start a passionflowers thread..
in the meanwhile here's the thread topic plant, Passiflora caerulea (which for all we know, may have higher amounts of harmalas than incarnata..if 2 x 5minute dilue acetic acid washings gets 0.01%, more extensive extraction sounds promising)
also the fruit is edible...
Attachments
..passionflower flavonoids were found to have MAO-A inhibition activity, and to a lesser extent, MAO-B [Hatano et al. 1991; Sloley et al. 2001; Voogelbreinder 2009]
regarding extraction, ۩, while the harmala alkaloids are best A/B or alcohol/base extracted into a wide spectrum non-polar solvent, flavonoids will remain usually in the water-soluble fraction of such a separation..hence, more 'full-content' whole extraction may be required for full effects..boil in water & reduce the easiest method..
(see passionflower extraction question )
regarding extraction, ۩, while the harmala alkaloids are best A/B or alcohol/base extracted into a wide spectrum non-polar solvent, flavonoids will remain usually in the water-soluble fraction of such a separation..hence, more 'full-content' whole extraction may be required for full effects..boil in water & reduce the easiest method..
(see passionflower extraction question )
..i've been researching MAOI activity of various flavonoids in preparation for a possible passifloras thread,
on the way i noticed this interesting article on ß-carbolines in raisins, which indicates harman and norharman (common in passifloras) are effective MAO-A & B inhibitors respectively...
Identification and Occurrence of β-Carboline Alkaloids in Raisins and Inhibition of Monoamine Oxidase (MAO)
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on the way i noticed this interesting article on ß-carbolines in raisins, which indicates harman and norharman (common in passifloras) are effective MAO-A & B inhibitors respectively...
Identification and Occurrence of β-Carboline Alkaloids in Raisins and Inhibition of Monoamine Oxidase (MAO)
.
Electric Kool-Aid
Explorer, Creative and Curious
BUMP!
Just interested in any new info on this passionflower beauty!
My local plant store has passion flower Caerulea and another Passiflora 'Amethyst' lady amethyst.
I was excited, but after a search it looks like maybe they are a bunk strain eh?
Any info would be a pleasure!
Just interested in any new info on this passionflower beauty!
My local plant store has passion flower Caerulea and another Passiflora 'Amethyst' lady amethyst.
I was excited, but after a search it looks like maybe they are a bunk strain eh?
Any info would be a pleasure!
why would cearulea be a bunk strain? I have a lot of caerulea growing indoors and outdoors and make tea out of it and use it as a base for changa usually now instead of caapi and it works for me. This is an awesome plant because anyone can grow it anywhere..the stuff will take over even a shaded window indoors..just hang a net in the window and it will literally become just a tangle of vine so fast. Anyone can grow enough of it to be totally self sufficient for at least changa harmalas.
Electric Kool-Aid
Explorer, Creative and Curious
Thanks for the quick reply Jamie!
So it is good to grow for maoi medicine? Man that is awesome! I am going to pick one up soon!
Sweet!
Edit: this is the best news I have heard in a while. Maoi here I come! Nice relaxing tea.. Some tharaputical smoalk.
Please love love love!
So it is good to grow for maoi medicine? Man that is awesome! I am going to pick one up soon!
Sweet!
Edit: this is the best news I have heard in a while. Maoi here I come! Nice relaxing tea.. Some tharaputical smoalk.
Please love love love!
Electric Kool-Aid
Explorer, Creative and Curious
Well, I got the Passion flower plant(s). Grew them over the late summer. Man those things grow like mad!! Unstoppable!
The winter is here and I harvested my Passion Flower plants. They are moved inside and under soft grow lights now. The harvested flowers an leaves are ready for future testing!
Just wondering dose amount. Any idea Jamie? Or anyone? Looking to make a tea, changa or as a maoi pre-dose before DMT.
Any ideas?
Thanks eh!
The winter is here and I harvested my Passion Flower plants. They are moved inside and under soft grow lights now. The harvested flowers an leaves are ready for future testing!
Just wondering dose amount. Any idea Jamie? Or anyone? Looking to make a tea, changa or as a maoi pre-dose before DMT.
Any ideas?
Thanks eh!
Attachments
plantatron
Rising Star
jamie,
next to all the confusing info on the net about P. caerulea containing cyanogenic glycosides and being not safe, which are found right next to reports of it being safe and having historical use, it is great to hear you seem to able to safely use it.
Could you please share your methods of preparing it to remove possible toxins? I read one could crush and dry the plant matter because HCN is highly volatile, but I'd like a few more details on it, like can I just dry the foilage or should I chop the wet plant? Should the wet plant matter be put into an air-tight jar to ferment it or not ? etc.
I also guess that smoking the foilage will burn some possible toxins, but do you happen to know whether dried P. caerulea leaves and/or flowers are safe when vaporizing in a GVG ?
Also, did you notice relevant differences between the leaves and the flowers ?
I've read other comments and nen's huge passiflora thread, but still, such basic info seems still missing.
Next to some P. caerulea, SWIM also has some P. actinea, P. mollissima, and P. sexflora grown from seed, so having a method to deal with the cyanogenic stuff would be greatly helpful to research the effects of those.
Thanks and peace!
next to all the confusing info on the net about P. caerulea containing cyanogenic glycosides and being not safe, which are found right next to reports of it being safe and having historical use, it is great to hear you seem to able to safely use it.
Could you please share your methods of preparing it to remove possible toxins? I read one could crush and dry the plant matter because HCN is highly volatile, but I'd like a few more details on it, like can I just dry the foilage or should I chop the wet plant? Should the wet plant matter be put into an air-tight jar to ferment it or not ? etc.
I also guess that smoking the foilage will burn some possible toxins, but do you happen to know whether dried P. caerulea leaves and/or flowers are safe when vaporizing in a GVG ?
Also, did you notice relevant differences between the leaves and the flowers ?
I've read other comments and nen's huge passiflora thread, but still, such basic info seems still missing.
Next to some P. caerulea, SWIM also has some P. actinea, P. mollissima, and P. sexflora grown from seed, so having a method to deal with the cyanogenic stuff would be greatly helpful to research the effects of those.
Thanks and peace!
DreaMTripper
Rising Star
Just drying it out will get rid of the HCN.
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