Hesitation? Procrastination?

[Metanoia]

I'm sure many of you (who have used and, to some extent, enjoyed Salvia) notice that Salvia is very anti-addictive. I'll feel the urge to take a trip, but will hesitate and procrastinate for long periods of time. Why is that?

I have a great relationship with this plant. I enjoy smoking plain leaf at least three times a week. I have no problem with doing that, why can't I load up a little 10x and plunge into salviaspace? It's a very strange plant, as we all know. But it has me thinking that if it wasn't for this strange anti-addictive effect, would it be a plant that people would use a lot more often? I'm sure some of the people on this forum smoke DMT once a week, or even more often than that. If Salvia was as pleasant as DMT, would it create a huge surge in popularity?

Basically, I was sitting here wondering if the anti-addictive and dysphoric elements were removed from the plant, how powerful would Salvia become?

I have yet to reach a full breakthrough with DMT, so for me, Salvia has provided the most powerful experiences of my life. And I have a feeling that even when I do fully experience DMT, Salvia will still have a place along side those DMT experiences. I crave these psychedelic experiences, so it makes me feel cowardly and sort of sad that I have such a hard time going deep with an extract.

 

[neverwas]

If it weren't it probably wouldn't be salvia. I also might've done it by now instead of procrastinating since I heard about it. That lady scares me even though she's growing downstairs.

 

[Lavos]

Hey, I feel much the same. Not sure what's holding me back. Was talking to someone the other day, how I wanted to, but timid. Afraid I guess. Then...afraid of what? Seeing things? Seeing myself? I mean, I know I'll be back. And better for it.

I'm trying not to worry much about it now. I got about 30mg of dmt loaded between some salvia leaf. I'll wait til I'm fully ready. I don't like having things around that I'm afraid to use, it's senseless or annoying, but oh well. I want to break in with some more mushroom doses. Some aya, some mescaline. Some things that are a little slower. I mean who gets in a porsche and drives 160 when first learning to drive? Salvia is the same, very powerful and hard hitting, imo, one should associate themselves with other active substances.

I'd like to work up the courage to do salvia x again before waiting too long on shrooms and cacti. I tell myself, you only gotta do it once, if you do it again, and decide 'fuck that' then fine, but I gotta go deep, at least once more.

As for the DMT, we'll see how patient I can be, don't want any unnecessary apprehension, just want to gladly breakthrough and try to bring something back from the goldmine. Kinda more timid about entities speaking on my character than reality just coming undone, as with salvia.

 

[gibran2]

One very nice thing about salvia is that the depth/intensity of an experience is very much determined by dose – a particular size dose will always give an experience of a particular intensity. (At least that has been my experience.)

This fact should be reassuring. If you are comfortable with a particular dose, increasing your dose slightly will give effects slightly more intense, so it’s very easy to work up to a higher breakthrough dose.

DMT is not the same. There are so many variables involved in vaporizing a dose of DMT that one can never be sure exactly how far he’ll go. This by itself can lead to some anxiety. Add a few difficult experiences, and you’ll discover that DMT is much more anti-addictive than salvia!

I don’t use salvia very much any more, but it’s not because of fear. There simply isn’t the same interest and curiosity as I had in the past. I still use it occasionally (once a month or so?) and enjoy the experiences, but frequent use just isn’t appealing any more.

I had a very difficult DMT breakthrough about 7 months ago, and haven’t had a breakthrough since. I’ve had sub-breakthrough experiences and have been exploring pharma, but a very deep existential fear has kept me away from a breakthrough. I miss it, and hope I get “the calling” again soon.

 

[burningmouth]

My hesitation during the last few months has gotten so bad that I'm beginning to lose interest in salvia. However, things are going to change in a big way. I still have 30 grams of 10x and 10 grams of 25x, and I plan on doing some serious salvianauting in the next several months.

Smoking plain leaf is like drinking a beer. No big deal. But lately, when I do the extract, I get all tied up in membranes and near death experiences. Near death experiences are a real downer.

The major reason why I plan to up my intake of extract is because I want to see for myself conclusively whether or not there exists other worlds out there. I refuse to believe that salvia experiences can be explained away by frame stacking and memory overlapping.


I know where you're coming from brother Dioxippus. I'll be sending you some PMs to let you know how things are coming along. I plan to be up to speed by April or May. By then I'll be doing 10x and possibly 25x at least every other day. I also plan on some multiple hits (one every 30 minutes) for a few hours.

Maybe the salvia beings are making it so that we really have to want it. Maybe they are putting obstacles in our way just so that we are forced to hurdle them. By hurdling the obstacle course, the true salvia believers are separated from the non serious (youtube?) salvia users.

For me, it's put up or shut up time.

 

[neverwas]

I guess I'm not certain I'm aware of what I'm afraid of. I actually have had maybe 4 very low and forgettable doses. Sort of uncomfortable. Since I've never truly done it it should be easy. DMT was easy until I did it. Then I knew what to be afraid of. But now after doing it many times, its not that bad.

I've had some 10x for over a year that I've only hit once. A slowly growing bag of plain leaf I what I'd like to start with though. Building a relationship with my plant first feels like the right thing to do and when the time comes it'll probably be a quid that I start with. But I'm Not ready.

Most things get easier in time.

 

[Lavos]

That's great burning mouth. I have accepted that when the time comes, (I'll know), if I can't do it, I'll just have to set an appointment and force myself to do it, because I want to that bad. Couple times a day and every other day sound like bold moves man. I hope you find something valuable. I'm packing up a little bit of the xtract for the first time today since August, will see how smooth it is.

How about a big quid stuffed in the cheeks, followed 15 minutes later by another big quid, followed 10 minutes later by 1 big bong hit of 25x, blow out smoke and quid altogether? Once every 3 days for 30 days. That might open some doors. :shock:

 

[Metanoia]

Thanks for all the responses everyone. I know this extreme hesitation isn't limited to myself, it's just nice to hear that other people also have trouble "getting up their nerve".

What you say is right gibran, and it should just be that simple. Increase the dosage slowly. That's what I tell everyone else to do. Maybe I'm not heeding my own advice enough, feeling like I have to take a larger dose because I'm "more experienced". It's been too long, my ego needs a little rattling. I'm going to have a small dose of my 5x tonight, no more procrastination!

burningmouth, you are a brave man. I can only hope to be as brave as you! I've been thinking about it lately, and I would like to get back to where I was about two years ago. My interest in Salvia was at an all-time high, and I frequently rose above this hesitation/procrastination that seems so common. Put up or shut up, indeed. I just need to ease back into it a bit before I'm able to go that deep again...at least that's how it feels.

Lavos, I like your analogy of the porsche. I would say it's like sky diving. You learned how to do it years ago, but now you forget the basics and need a refresher course. Trying to remember the training while in mid-air probably isn't the best approach
And about your quidding + 25x suggestion...that would blow the doors right off the hinges, nevermind open them! I think you'd also have a hard time repairing them

 

[burningmouth]

How about a big quid stuffed in the cheeks, followed 15 minutes later by another big quid, followed 10 minutes later by 1 big bong hit of 25x, blow out smoke and quid altogether? Once every 3 days for 30 days. That might open some doors. :shock:

That would be one heroic hit.
Quidding keeps you under the effects for a long time. Any panic attack could be prolonged with quid. I hate panic attacks. But it's definately something to think about. (gulp)

Put up or shut up, indeed. I just need to ease back into it a bit before I'm able to go that deep again...at least that's how it feels.

I'm already easing back into it. I'm doing one or more hits of plain leaf every day, mostly for meditative exploration. A few months ago I was experiencing chest pains while tripping on salvia. I kid you not. Since then the chest pains have gone away. Then I began to notice my damn stomach while tripping. I was focusing on all the damn food in my gut and it was interfering with my ability to let go. It felt like I had a damn inflated innertube in my abdomen. So now I'm trying to lose some weight and prepare for hard core salvia use. In the last few days, I've gotten a sore throat. My whole damn body is falling apart. How can I trip if my bio-machine body keeps fucking up?

Most of you guys probably have other responsibilities that keep you from really diving in. I have no responsibilities. That's why I'm going for it. I'm even dropping my cable service and internet service the day after the Superbowl. I can still get on the internet at my local library which is a short walk away. So believe you me, with no cable TV and no internet as distractions, I will be able to focus 100 percent on smoking salvia. Vinny would be proud.

 

[Lavos]

Heroic hits aside, we need serious explorers, and it sounds like this fear is standing here just to be overcome.

As soon as I puffed my pipe today, leaf with about 10mg of 15x, I began worrying. Like I tell myself, ok, be cool if you feel yourself going 2d here, but the other part of me that only knows 26 years of waking life, is like hey man, hey, are we gonna be ok? I didn't get much out of it, too anticipatory? Maybe my leaf is too old and dry, and my extract too exposed to heat/pressure in my pocket. Might need to order some online or buy a fresh plant, that or dig deep back in, make sure I get pronounced effects.

Most of you guys probably have other responsibilities that keep you from really diving in. I have no responsibilities. That's why I'm going for it. I'm even dropping my cable service and internet service the day after the Superbowl. I can still get on the internet at my local library which is a short walk away. So believe you me, with no cable TV and no internet as distractions, I will be able to focus 100 percent on smoking salvia. Vinny would be proud. Smile

Ah, this is well. When I am most bored I am eventually most productive. No TV no internet at home means lots of projects + walking to library + books + working out, etc. Family and what not can work as an anchor, or be seen as something else to be broken from.

I want to practice meditation, fasting, and salvia exploration. I too believe there is much to be gained from facing the disorientation and chaos, making order of it, as we humans try to do.

As Nietzsche says, well, ::digging through Gay Science:: can't find the quote, but, roughly, it goes,

"What is heroic? To go out and meet at once, ones greatest suffering, and highest hopes."

 

[Rooftop]

Just thinking of smoking extract makes my heart jump, and I know why:

I just can't handle so much truth

 

[Metanoia]

You hit it on the head burningmouth. Too many responsibilities and worries that keep me grounded. I got rid of my TV a while back, but the internet I can't seem to let go of. It's my main source of socializing (as pathetic as that sounds) because most of the people I know locally just aren't interested in the same things I am. I don't even talk to people about Salvia anymore because of the ignorant, even moronic, responses they spout at me. They see it as some party drug that you pull out after everyone's had a few too many, just to get a laugh and watch someone writhle around on the ground like an earthworm.

Anyhow, I think you should definitely take care of any health problems before going on a regimen of Salvia extract. It could be psychological, but if I was experienced what you described, I would go to the doctor and get a checkup, just in case. Do you smoke anything besides Salvia? Cigarettes? Cannabis?

That's a great quote Lavos.

Just thinking of smoking extract makes my heart jump, and I know why:

I just can't handle so much truth

It's the truth we all seek, isn't it? But I completely understand. Too much at once can be hard to swallow when you're so devoted to lies.
I think this is why some people laugh hysterically when they smoke Salvia. It's a mechanism to deal with the truth they're being shown. Laugh it off as some sort of absurd joke.

 

[burningmouth]

Do you smoke anything besides Salvia? Cigarettes? Cannabis?

Nope, just salvia. I'm hours away from unplugging my cable. I can already see an invisible fire burning in the middle of my apartment. An old shaman is sitting down waiting for me to take my seat. My six month long salvia session is about to begin.

I think this is why some people laugh hysterically when they smoke Salvia. It's a mechanism to deal with the truth they're being shown.

I agree. Their minds can't cope with the profundity of the experience. Their brains shut off the "truth" valve and switch over to the "giggles" valve.

 

[Metanoia]

I'm hours away from unplugging my cable. I can already see an invisible fire burning in the middle of my apartment. An old shaman is sitting down waiting for me to take my seat. My six month long salvia session is about to begin.

I wish you luck brother! I may not be able to keep up with your level of courage, but I'm going to do my best over the next few months to go deep once again. I'll be posting some reports soon.

 

[Lucent]

It's the truth we all seek, isn't it? But I completely understand. Too much at once can be hard to swallow when you're so devoted to lies.
I think this is why some people laugh hysterically when they smoke Salvia. It's a mechanism to deal with the truth they're being shown. Laugh it off as some sort of absurd joke.

I've recently been talking to my buddies about Salvia and I had the privilege of loading up small dose of extract for my buddy last night and he just laughed hysterically for about 5 minutes. Afterward, we got to talking and it turns out that was probably his most enjoyable time on Salvia because of the lower dose and how bearable it was compared to the other times he's tried it. Mind you, I sort of irresponsibly allowed him to try Salvia in the room with all of our friends. We are a pretty close bunch and I made it pretty obvious that I didn't think Salvia was anything to be fooling around with. We didn't force anyone to do anything or coax them into it or anything like that, and he actually enjoyed his experience. A few of my friends mentioned how they didn't like Salvia because all it did was trip them out and make them laugh uncontrollably, which I thought was weird because when I take Salvia I don't really laugh too much. I mean, at times I do, but I mostly feel like a wide-eyed child seeing things for the first time. It could be that they never quite understood how Salvia can be much more pleasant as a substance to meditate on, so a couple (as in 1, maybe 2) of my friends are now going to try laying in bed in a pitch black room and smoking a small, small dose of Salvia and hopefully they'll have an enjoyable time.

I think working up from smaller doses definitely helps with the fear..