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Increasing LSA Visuals

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lsDxMdmaddicThc

lsDxMdmaddicThc

The future's uncertain and The End is always near.
Okay so a friend of mine has many different forms of LSA.
HBWR seeds, MG seeds, and a crude Acetone extract from 20 HBWR seeds.
He stored the Extract in a light-proof vial, in his fridge. This was done to prevent the LSA from degrading.
To the point!

So, since LSA usually produces mild or no visuals...
I was advising him to combine it with a low dose of DPH (Diphenhydramine), in an attempt to increase visuals.
I have heard suggestions to combine LSA with LOW doses of Datura seeds.
DPH and Datura work in similar ways as anticholinergic deliriants...

The only negative side effects I could think of would be increased sedation.

LSA is a potent vasoconstrictor, even when isolated...
Apparently DPH is a vasoconstrictor as well! (?)

Are there any possibly dangerous interactions between LSA and DPH I should be aware of?

Does anyone have experience with this combination?

As a side question, my friend is also taking Phenibut 2-3 times a week at doses between 500mg-1.5g.
Any interactions between LSA and Phenibut?

Thank you in advance! :)
 
I usually am more interested in other aspect of psychs than visual effects, so I generally don't mind the faint and mercurial nature of many LSA visuals... but when I do want the visuals to kick in, I eat a bunch of really dark chocolate, take a couple pills of 5-HTP, a gram of melatonin, then drop the dose of LSA extract in a strong pot of green tea and drink it down. Then I swim or do some light calisthenics for 20-30 minutes, and drink a bunch of water and a light snack and relax with a doobie and forget about whatever the hell I'm seeing for awhile. The visuals will pop up before you even notice them.

DXM is known to increase visuals, though I don't know about any possible interactions.
 
A light dose of DPH shouldn't cause any problems and would still probably increase the visuals a little as well as helping with nausea. I've also used LSA with relatively large doses of DPH, but these combinations also included DXM and some other stuff so I can't say much about how LSA and DPH specifically interact.

These experiences were very visual though. But not in a typical psychedelic way. I enjoyed the effects, but most people probably wouldn't like any combo including LSA and larger doses of DPH. I'm also not prone to experiencing negative side effects, so I can't say anything besides that the combination seems safe enough to me.

I don't think I'd recommend anything more than a 100mg of DPH in combination with LSA, but maybe not even that much. Plus, there are other things that are safer and more enjoyable when combined with LSA.

I've always found Cannabis to increase the visuals of LSA. For me, it has an effect on the visuals that I refer to as "crystallization". Everything takes on a crystalline appearance as if it was made of geometric fractal jewels. It's a weird effect that combines patterns overlain on the visual field with stronger visual distortions.

Adding cinnamon to a cold water extraction of LSA can also increase the visuals. The hypothetical reasoning for this is that the cinnamaldehyde in cinnamon might form react with the LSA to form an adduct much like the way LSH forms from LSA and acetaldehyde.

Syrian rue potnetiates LSA and increases the visuals. Some people don't find this combo enjoyable though. I like it a lot.

DXM will increase the visuals of LSA a little, but has a much stronger effect on the mental and bodily effects (in a good way IMO). This is a great combo that can be very intense, but if you take too much DXM it will sort of drown out the effects of the LSA. I don't know of any negative interactions here besides the generic stuff about be carefull when combining sedatives. And I must add the warning that combining DXM with syrian rue or other MAO-A inhibitors can be deadly.

And Hiyo Quicksilver's suggestions sound like they would probably work well, largely because of the massive amount of other psychoactive compounds added on top of the LSA. I think I might have to try this some time.

A final disclaimer: any of the suggestions here should be approached carefully, especially those that include other sedative substances. Some of these combinations could be dangerous in the wrong doses. And just because they were fine for me doesn't mean they will be safe for everyone. Do your own research before trying them, then start low and work your dose up slowly.
 
Following the description of the structure and activity of scopolamine by Ladenburg, the search for synthetic analogues of and methods for total synthesis of scopolamine and/or atropine in the 1930s and 1940s resulted in the discovery of diphenhydramine, an early antihistamine and the prototype of its chemical subclass of these drugs, and pethidine, the first fully synthetic opioid analgesic, known as Dolatin and Demerold amongst many other trade names.

Pharmacology for Anesthetists 5, John D. Current, M.D., p. 195


Morning glory seed/datura seed (scopolamine) trip report:

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LongStrangeTrip said:
I have heard of mixing 1-3 seeds with LSA for a more LSD like experience over on the nexus.

Don't remember where I read that though...take it with a grain of salt :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

I may wholeheartedly attest to this.

On numerous occasions I have found that by adding in as little as 3-5 datura inoxia seeds, I was able to achieve very powerful and long-lasting entheogenic effects from consuming only a VERY SMALL SPOONFUL of untreated Heavenly Blue Morning Glory seeds. By a small spoonful, I'm saying less than 2g, about 25-50 seeds. The nausea was very minimal, the vasoconstriction barely noticeable, yet for an entire 10 hours I was very noticeably "tripping" just as hard as I would on a dose of 10g. I did this regiment several times over the past few months, one of my favorite settings being my current Philosophy class in college.

I felt my field of consciousness expanding tremendously; my perceptual and mental awareness was such that I was able to examine each and every statement said from various degrees and pinpoint the intentions and various meanings behind every sentence in our discussions at a very rapid pace. In nearly each instance that I sat in class on this very low entheogenic nootropical dose, quasi-telepathic phenomenon was experienced. When a question was asked by the teacher, an answer would instantaneously and intuitively enter my mind without any prior contemplation upon the said inquiry. Now my class is quiet and the other students normally never participate comprehensively... yet when I would glance at any particular student and fixated upon them for several moments, they would give an answer eerily similar save for a few words as to what was in my mind.

Oftentimes the lecture the teacher gave, what he was saying coincidentally coincided with something which was within my subconscious. From my numerous experiences with this experiment my understanding of the notion that an individual's reality is a direct reflection of their psyche both multiplied and solidified itself. When I was in class it should be noted that I wasn't at the "peak" of the experience, and the effects continued for essentially the entirety of the day.

One of the most crucial aspects and benefits of mixing LSA + low dose Datura is the ease and intensity in which it facilitates the void-like state of complete stillness, emptiness and internal silence within necessary to "do work". That is just in my case however, as I subscribe to the view of utilizing this molecular technology for purposes of divine communion, manifesting my Higher Self, amongst other things one might consider "shamanic" and have had extensive history and experience with Morning Glory to the point I would consider them very reliable allies.

Perhaps it is because of my extensive relationship with them that I might have developed a sort of sensitivity to them which would result in my being able to achieve powerful and profound states of being from the consumption of a mere spoonful of seeds, though there is no doubt in my mind that were those 3 Datura seeds not added such would not have been feasible. Actually, there've been times where I do achieve non-subtle effects from that same dose WITHOUT Datura seeds, but with the Datura I achieve OEV's and the duration is kicked up to a full 10-12 hours. Besides, the psychedelic-potentiating effects of datura are well known and documented.

To recap: micro-dose of LSA + microdose of Datura = guaranteed experience that may rival 10g doses without Datura

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04/24/12
sunset_mission
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/16132569#16132569


 
^This is interesting, but I can't say I agree with it. I have essentially always used a low dose of Datura as a predose before taking LSA in any form. And I have never experienced a 5-fold potentiation of the effects.

I'm not even sure that I could say that it potentiates the effects at all. Thinking back, I've only ever used LSA without an anticholinergic predose twice.

The most recent time was in combination with DXM and Fly Agaric, so I can't use it as comparison for LSA alone without an anticholinergic.

The other time, I threw up a few minutes after drinking the CWE and only experienced threshold effects.

The only reason that I'm pretty sure that Datura doesn't potentiate LSA as much as the previous post claims is that if this were true, then I must have the most ridiculous tolerance ever in all the world.

In my early days of LSA use, I used heavenly blue morning glory seeds. 20g would produce a moderate psychedelic experience, probably a bit on the mild side. It would cause strong euphoria, increases in abstract thinking, a strong sense of wonder, mild CEVs, and mild visual distortions as well as vague geometric patterns overlain on my visual field. That's about it. And this was with Datura.

I will admit that I do have a naturally high tolerance to just about everything, and that potency of natural materials vary. But if Datura potentiates LSA as much as the above post claims, then I would have needed 100g to get these effects without the Datura.

For comparison, the current batch of Hawaiian strain HBWR seeds that I have produces moderate effects, but closer to the strong side, with 20 seeds. It seems almost impossible that a person could have such high tolerance to need 100 Hawaiian strain HBWR seeds to only get moderate effects.

My guess is that the above poster's experience is not common at all. But I'll have to test this out for myself. I guess I have to take a 20 seed dose of HBWR seeds without Datura. If the effects are very weak, then maybe I'll believe it. But I doubt it.
 
Thank you for all the replies.
I am also more interested in the psychological effects of psychedelics.
Visuals are also very important too, there is much to be learned from the visual patterns/objects that our minds subconsciously create.
Hopefully this will bring some more insight into "potentiating" LSA.

I definately agree that cardio/breathing exercises and 5-htp/other proteins can add to psychedelic experiences.
They are very active on their own, for me.
Some are more sensitive to entheogens/endogenous psychedelics.

Also, User18517 I look it at like either :
You are "sending out" the idea to others in the room.
Or you are "receiving" the idea from others in the room.
That sounds like ESP to me, and it happens to me naturally and daily in many different forms.
However, that is a topic for a different forum. ;)

I had a VERY VISUAL experience from LSA that paralleled people's reports on DMT, and artwork inspired by DMT.
I took extracted LSA after a long day of dabbling in amphetamines, caffeine, daily nicotine habit.
I took 750mg of GABA around the time I dosed.
Along with 200mg of 5-htp.
Things got really weird, started to feel uncomfortable physically and mentally.
Decided to goto bed.
Layed down in bed and began deep breathing
Had a profound life changing spiritual experience!!! Very similar to how people describe DMT.
I have tried deep-breathing and other forms of meditation many times with "varying levels of success"
But I have never been able to get as far as I did while on LSA!!!
The LSA definately helped me breakthrough a former mental barrier.
It was a complete un-boundary connected feeling of peace, positivity, healing, love, and forgiveness that in undescribable.
I will never forget what I learned.
I felt a spot on my chest that I can still feel to this day. <-probably makes no sense
It is just below the middle of your ribcage and can be felt when you breathe from the diaphragm.
Wow I am getting quite off topic.
 
Many years ago when I had time and resources to tweak psychedelic experiences, I found that a solid dose of piracetam (after a period of time using it regularly with a choline supplement) along with a standard choline supplement would provide a noticeable increase in the visual effects of naturally sourced psilocybin/psilocin without a similar increase in the more intoxicating/discombobulating effects of said compounds (i.e., more eye candy and clear thinking without an increase in the intoxication and head trip). Might be worth trying something similar with LSA, though I'll never tread that ground again after too many times of eating and drinking tea from morning glory and HBWR in my youth ... your body can quickly develop a very toxic reaction to these raw, natural ergolines.
 
SWIM has got many visuals from LSA after consuming a 50 HBWR seed purified extract. Hardly noticable though when you are busy swimming through dreamscapes. :roll:
 
Kash said:
Hardly noticable though when you are busy swimming through dreamscapes. :roll:
Click to expand...
My thoughts exactly.... And I might add that Kash's Advanced LSA Extraction and administration on an empty stomach are the best combo of "potentiators" I've found! :lol:
 
Hiyo Quicksilver said:
I usually am more interested in other aspect of psychs than visual effects, so I generally don't mind the faint and mercurial nature of many LSA visuals... but when I do want the visuals to kick in, I eat a bunch of really dark chocolate, take a couple pills of 5-HTP, a gram of melatonin, then drop the dose of LSA extract in a strong pot of green tea and drink it down. Then I swim or do some light calisthenics for 20-30 minutes, and drink a bunch of water and a light snack and relax with a doobie and forget about whatever the hell I'm seeing for awhile. The visuals will pop up before you even notice them.

DXM is known to increase visuals, though I don't know about any possible interactions.
Click to expand...

I would agree wiht benzyme and this statement I feel a low dose maybe 100-250 mg of DMX to potentiate the visual aspect would be safer and better than DPH as DPH visuals are deleriant, assuming since you're taking LSA you want soething colorful, DXM would be that better addition because DPH visual tend to be either really dark and disturbing and not even "colorful or fun" but sometimes just downright unnerving, or depending on how much you take the mix of the two could make the DPH deleriant effects amplified, and you could do some dangerous things in a potential black out situation.
 
lso supposedly adding peppermint oil/extract to the solution can theoretically change it into LSH from LSA which is said to have more visuals less body load, I can attest to my own trials with both lsa and this highly debated method of changing it to LSH that FOR ME I felt a signifigant difference as far as not only visually but it was way less harmful feeling to my body. I've never done LSD to compare but I've done LSZ and Al-Lad, and I can say once I tried the LSH idea, it was much more promising in many ways and was way more similar to an LSZ or AL-Lad experience where those are like lite versions of LSD, but keep in mind highly untested research chems.

Acetaldehyde is said to be the main reason this conversion occurs for more info research google differences between lsa and lsh also this link maybe of interest to you.

LSH works

Swim noticed all over the net that there is some debate over turning LSA into LSH Swim decided to try a cold water extraction of aprox. 650 ground MG seeds were extracted in peppermint tea bought from the store for 12 hours. Swim has used MG before with little visuals and high sedation, but...
www.bluelight.org www.bluelight.org

as I said the process of the conversion is highly debated and theoretical at this point last I checked noone proved or disproved its ability to change the effects let alone the molecule but my own tests personally I say it does.
 
I agree with the acetaldehyde effect change; and that there is considerable Datura seed microdose benefit (I use 3 or 4 Datura stramonium).

Another aldehyde someone mentioned comes from Cinnamon. This adduct is much more visual; and stronger by at least 1/3rd IME. It also comes on fast to have you tripping within the hour rather than 2-3 hours.


Something in cactus is said to potentiate LSA very strongly. It's not the mescaline; but something else in there: the MAOIs or something makes the LSA ~7x stronger.


"Psilocybin can also make it more like real LSD by increasing the visuals. The dose of psilocybin should be low or it overpowers the Organic LSD. The dose used should be just enough to cause stimulation. SWIM has experience with this combination. It’s very nice.

Yohimbe is sometimes added. SWIM has experience with this. Keep the yohimbe dose low. About 1/2 tsp is enough. It effectively blocks most of the vasoconstriction effects, and increases the visuals.

Anadenanthera colubrina (Yopo) is also sometimes added. Use no more than 1 seed orally. It will increase the visuals and increase the euphoria. Don’t use more than 1 seed or nausea will kick in."
From the "Recipes for Organic LSD (LSH)" thread: Recipes for Organic LSD (LSH) - LSD, LSA, LSH - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus

Really the best advice is to close your eyes/dark room/ blindforld. The OEV can be OK, but the CEV are truly phenomenal.
 
I finally tried LSA without a Datura predose. I didn't experience any potentiation. In fact, the effects seemed a little bit stronger than the LSA and Datura combination when using the same dose of LSA (HBWR) from the same batch of seeds.

I take this to be due to setting and random chance. I also can't comment on how the visuals were affected since I took the LSA in the morning, so the visuals were inhibited by the lighting.

There was marked nausea in this experience though. I was able to hold down any vomit, but I felt very uncomfortable for the first hour or so. So this suggests that Datura acts as a potent antiemetic for LSA induced nausea in me. It doesn't suggest any potentiation by Datura though.

I've also tried the combination of LSA and cinnamon, in the hopes that it would form an LSA + cinnamaldehyde adduct similar to how LSH is supposed to form. I would generally agree that it makes the effects more visual. I had my most realistic LSA visuals with this combination. Since the first time I tried this, I almost always add cinnamon my cold water extractions, but the visuals are still weak relative to other substances.
 
Maybe passiflora tea could do it?
It shouldn't be strong enough to produce maoi effects (unless you make a brew from a lot of material) but could potentially alter the visuals as it seems to do with dmt.

Are there any pharmacological reasons for not doing this?
What are the potential dangers of mixing passiflora with LSA?

I plan to grow some morning glories this summer and have lots of passionflower.
 
Passiflora would work. I've only heard good things about this combo, but it would have very similar dangers to the LSA + syrian rue combo since it contains harmalas. The harmalas are in much lower concentrations, but with a high enough dose passiflora will inhibit MAOI.

There is no danger specifically associated with MAO inhibition while on LSA, but some people might react badly due to the other properties of harmalas. Mixing another sedative with LSA could potentially lead to respiratory depression and could dull the experience.

In my experience, harmalas at MAO inhibiting doses combined with LSA is an awesome experience. There is major potentiation. It makes LSA at least 2 times as potent for me. The visuals are definitely increased due to the increased overall intensity and possibly increased via synergy. But at high doses of LSA, I did experience some slight respiratory depression.
 
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