jellomescaya

[The Traveler]

you would think a mod would care to keep some sort of standard but i guess its true, this really is just shroomery for spice heads.

I'm not sure why you state this but I do think it should be clear to you that this forum is not a place for bragging about dangerous dosages.

It is also clear to me that if you need this kind of dosage for several people then something in the technique is lacking. We tried to tell you this but you seem to be unwilling to accept our advice and tips and instead try to mock this community with false assumptions.


The Traveler

 

[endlessness]

"im not the only person thats dosed this high and frequently"

Sounds to me like you are proving that it IS INDEED your technique if you have passed it on to others who are "frequently" smoking doses that high with similar results. If you were a hard-head it would be one thing, but saying that several others you know who dosed at the same time are experiencing similar effects seems statistically suspect. I have to side with Art - your technique is either lacking or you're rippin a yarn.

Incidentally, this is not like some of those other forums you listed BECAUSE we don't tolerate pissing contests, which seem to be the standard thread elsewhere.

And if it is true, and you've done your homework, you would know how truly astounding AND anomalous your experience was, and wouldn't be so casual and cavalier in your relating of it. Or at least you would understand the responses you are getting.

I really hope its your technique. If it is though, be careful, cause you're in for a helluva whopper when you improve it!

JBArk

yes!

It's not really worth getting your tits all tied up about is it?

It actually is, I think - because this kind of bullshit is potentially very, very dangerous. For those who don't know that its utter nonsense and adhere to this guy's dosing guidelines, they're going to get the shock of a lifetime - absolute best case scenario.

As I see it, we all of us have a shared responsibility to call this kind of stuff out. A little education can go a long way towards keeping people out of the ER.

and yes!


taterboard, just think about it. You come to a community that unfolds itself with a certain attitude and health and safety guideliness (I suggest you REALLY read them!), and you come here specifically going in an opposite direction. Not only that, but in a very non-humble way, you say for people to 'do their homework' and similar ironic 'passive-agressive' attacks. How do you think others are going to relate to you?

I think you have to seriously reconsider your attitude if you want to be a part of this community in a pacific beneficial way.

 

[soulfood]

It's not really worth getting your tits all tied up about is it?

It actually is, I think - because this kind of bullshit is potentially very, very dangerous. For those who don't know that its utter nonsense and adhere to this guy's dosing guidelines, they're going to get the shock of a lifetime - absolute best case scenario.

Well yeah and x1,000,000 I guess. An infinitley valid point. But there's a better way to get that across.

 

[taterboard]

its pretty clear this community has one way of doing things and that its been determined in some sort of arbitrary manner. i did nothing dangerous to my health and yah i know many people personally enjoy larger doses of tryptamines. it has nothing to do about bragging but no i will not be humble about this for the simple fact i have no reason to be. 30 mgs of spice is not sufficient to trip for 14 hours. THAT is a lie. as was mentioned earlier, .6 mg/kg is what was smoked during each individual sessions (ten hours in!) and it was an enjoyable time. very intense but not frightening. strassman himself utilized these doses in his initial tests but they were found to be too strong for most people. but not all people. what sort of doses do you people do with cubensis or pans? i would imagine that too is small. all im saying is, i think youre afraid for no reason. and just because a lot of you say it doesnt mean its truth, just the opinion of yet another forum... have an open mind and try it. otherwise, how am i going to take that sort of non-sense seriously. dose higher and then tell me what happened. i think youll find it was amazing and beautiful not frightening.

EXAMPLES
Calequendi (mod @ eboka) - 300 mgs freebase
AndyLandy420 (topia expert) - 500 mgs freebase
eap - 800 mg, 5 g rue, 8 g cubes



here is an example from DMT world (remember that?)

30mg - something is going on....for most people this is not nearly enough to be of any significance, unless one is taking a very large MAOI dose....or a lot of Ayahuasca vine. This may be a good introduction.

60mg - possibly light visuals, probably not very much. A good gentle self observational, light physical opening. Walking around and interacting should be easy. Most should have no problems dealing with this dose.

100mg - clear visuals, opening, brightening of all senses, a good effect. This is a good dose, to start with. Walking around and sitting upright are very possible. Maybe there can be a beginning for inter dimensional communications and the like. Good for singing and bodywork, sorting out the personal inventory etc. This is a good starting dose in my opinion.

150mg - strong for many people, where it gets more visionary and immersed for others, where the trans personal really beings to kick in. Many won't find they are really getting to where they want to go with this dose.

200mg - usually a solid immersive visionary experience, where one is still able to navigate the physical reality if need be.

250mg - many are pretty much pinned to the floor, this dose can be very workable for many people.

300mg - a very strong visionary dose, as much as 90% of people would ever really want to do. This is where inter dimensional communication, O.B.E. like experiences, and very unusual and experientially real phenomena really come to the fore. Although, 200mg may do the same thing for other people.

400mg - some people need this much (of large body weight and tolerance to substances in general!), but usually 300mg is about the upper limit, beyond that it can become difficult to work with for most.

500mg - too 'full on' to really work with for most...just too much information....the elements that arise may become too distorted and 'excited' for their to really be grounding and/or assimilation.

700-1000mg - no recall to little recall whatsoever, can be very stressful to the system, where the quality of overdosing in the smoked DMT state comes into play. i.e. convulsing, frothing at the mouth, eyes rolling backwards.

and my dosage/recipe was not only approved by one of the former moderators of the aforementioned site but he excitedly waited for results, in the true spirit of psychonautical research.

theres no need to be confrontational people. once again, dig a little deeper. theres more there than you think. its not dangerous its just off-putting to a small-dose mindset.

 

[taterboard]

oops lol

 

[soulfood]

theres no need to be confrontational people. once again, dig a little deeper. theres more there than you think. its not dangerous its just off-putting to a small-dose mindset.

I'm sure it's awesome, but for many folk here have have experimented quite widely with different combinations 100mg is a very large dose. I can have comfortable travelling at 50mg for a thinking exercise, but doses of 100-150mg for me and what has been told by most others is like a fullon breakthrough that can last easily for an hour or two that can SEEM to last for days. Complete out of body with life like touch felt from entities and unreal objects. That's a complete foreign reality integration

I would never in my wildest dreams take more than 250mg's. Not because I'm scared... well yeah a little and it's a nice evolutionary mechanism, but it's just not necassarry for myself and most others

 

[taterboard]

theres no need to be confrontational people. once again, dig a little deeper. theres more there than you think. its not dangerous its just off-putting to a small-dose mindset.

I'm sure it's awesome, but for many folk here have have experimented quite widely with different combinations 100mg is a very large dose. I can have comfortable travelling at 50mg for a thinking exercise, but doses of 100-150mg for me and what has been told by most others is like a fullon breakthrough that can last easily for an hour or two that can SEEM to last for days. Complete out of body with life like touch felt from entities and unreal objects. That's a complete foreign reality integration

I would never in my wildest dreams take more than 250mg's. Not because I'm scared... well yeah a little and it's a nice evolutionary mechanism, but it's just not necassarry for myself and most others

maybe its not necessary but its not dangerous and yes ive experimented with small doses starting at 30 and moving up. i even cited an old recommendation from DMT world! and i KNOW they didnt fail to properly administer their dmt. this started as a post to relate a new recipe for a brew that i hadnt found any equal too. its a unique mix and was a unique trip. this isnt simply dmt as mescaline, atropines, harmalas, jwh, and caffeine were all involved. all in safe amounts.

maybe you should try it before youre so critical.

 

[soulfood]

It actually sounds like a waste to me

I respect your right to experiment on yourself and all, but I'm fairly sure if that was consumed by 100 participants, many of them would have bad reactions.

 

[taterboard]

It actually sounds like a waste to me

I respect your right to experiment on yourself and all, but I'm fairly sure if that was consumed by 100 participants, many of them would have bad reactions.

well, im glad we can agree on that lol to each their own im simply defending the fact im not a liar and im not inexperienced with dosing. yes, many would have bad trips, but i wasnt tripping with anyone inexperienced. they all have extensive history with large doses of psychedelics in private groups and smaller doses (2-4 grams) in a social setting. there was no fear of bad trips, as none of us believe in those. we believe in hard trips.

 

[jbark]

Taterboard effused:
"what sort of doses do you people do with cubensis or pans? i would imagine that too is small. all im saying is, i think youre afraid for no reason. and just because a lot of you say it doesnt mean its truth, just the opinion of yet another forum... have an open mind and try it. otherwise, how am i going to take that sort of non-sense seriously. dose higher and then tell me what happened. i think youll find it was amazing and beautiful not frightening."

Wow are you preumptuous. and arrogant.

Taterboard effused again:
"theres no need to be confrontational people. once again, dig a little deeper. theres more there than you think. its not dangerous its just off-putting to a small-dose mindset."

Wow are you presumptuous. and arrogant.

Wow. Clearly this site is not for you. If you had done YOUR homework, you'd know a little bit more about who you were addressing, and you'd understand that your brand of condescension is neither encouraged, tolerated nor welcome here.

We got off on the wrong foot here. Are you willing to say anything to start over? I hope so. I hate to make anyone feel unwelcome here.

JBArk

 

[soulfood]

Well... hard trips are expected in this territory but... for example for myself yohimbe and mescaline is a nasty combo. I would feel quite hot and look very pale... on top of DMT. Definately a can of worms for my constitution.

The original recipe between 4 people seems quite reasonable for those willing to go in deep. It's all the extras I'm concerned about.

 

[taterboard]

Taterboard effused:
"what sort of doses do you people do with cubensis or pans? i would imagine that too is small. all im saying is, i think youre afraid for no reason. and just because a lot of you say it doesnt mean its truth, just the opinion of yet another forum... have an open mind and try it. otherwise, how am i going to take that sort of non-sense seriously. dose higher and then tell me what happened. i think youll find it was amazing and beautiful not frightening."

Wow are you preumptuous. and arrogant.

Taterboard effused again:
"theres no need to be confrontational people. once again, dig a little deeper. theres more there than you think. its not dangerous its just off-putting to a small-dose mindset."

Wow are you presumptuous. and arrogant.

Wow. Clearly this site is not for you. If you had done YOUR homework, you'd know a little bit more about who you were addressing, and you'd understand that your brand of condescension is neither encouraged, tolerated nor welcome here.

We got off on the wrong foot here. Are you willing to say anything to start over? I hope so. I hate to make anyone feel unwelcome here.

JBArk

but yet im being called a liar and ignorant? no im simply defending myself. there IS more than you think, you just dont believe in dosing that way as it would be "imprudent."

i know exactly who im addressing, im simply challenging an incorrect idea that anything over 100 is too much. others before you did it. maybe some of you have done it. its nothing special, just a personal decision.

i would love to be a normal member of this site but whether it be the proper ID on a plant (which i have been confirmed to be correct btw) or dosage on drugs thats im familiar and experienced with, or even general extraction knowledge... this site is a condescending place. i wont post any more threads so as not to bother you all but i will maintain the ones i have. because they are not faulty.

which of these doses or even combinations is dangerous? none! at least not in the amounts that they were consumed. and it was hardly a waste.

 

[dreamer042]

combining MAOIs with other psychoactive drugs can lead to dangerous medical problems including serotonin syndrome, hypertensive crisis, and other related serious issues.

whether mescaline (also showing some MAOI activity itself) is safe in combination with any significant level of tyramine has not really been established

it is reasonable to be concerned about combining cactus and MAOIs

Ask Erowid : ID 3089 : Are MAOIs dangerous in combination with some Trichocereus cacti?

Ask Erowid Question and Answer: Are MAOIs dangerous in combination with some Trichocereus cacti?

www.erowid.org

Smoked DMT Dosages

Threshold 2 - 5 mg
Light 10 - 20 mg
Common 20 - 40 mg
Strong 40 - 60 mg

Erowid DMT Vault : Dosage

Information on DMT dosage.

www.erowid.org

I'm gonna trust the experts at erowid over what anybody on any forum (even this one) says

 

[taterboard]

thats wise dreamer. heres some supplemental information: http://forums.mycotopia.net/botanic...ychedelics/67899-jellomescaya.html#post886258

Originally Posted by lysergic View Post
I would stay away from any cacti + MAOI combo.

As was stated earlier,
cactus contains tyramine.

Tyramine & MAOI's don't mix.

What are the MAOI's present in this brew? I know the achuma contains three natural MAOI's in Kaempferol, Quercetin and Isoquinoline. These mild MAOI's are reversible, and should pose no danger when combined with tyramine.
Please see: http://forums.mycotopia.net/botanica...questions.html (Bridgesii questions?)

The brew will include four grams of syrian rue , the MAOI's in this case being Harmine and Harmaline. These MAOI's are reversible and considered safe to consume with low-levels of tyramine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trout
Tyramine is not believed to be dangerous with harmine or harmaline since it readily displaces either one. The harmala alkaloids are highly selective and highly reversible MAOIs. They are quite different than some of the prescription drugs such as Phenelzine (Nardil) or Tranycypromine (Parnate) which actually bind irreversibly to the MAO enzymes. With irreversible MAOIs, restoration of normal MAO metabolic function requires that more of the enzymes be produced by the body.

These combinations raise a lot of flags in the plant community, and rightfully so. Safety is a priority and anyone experimenting with MAOI's should follow the proper dietary restrictions: http://forums.mycotopia.net/ayahuasc...trictions.html (MAOI FAQ - DIETARY & DRUG INTERACTIONS / RESTRICTIONS)

Prescription meds such as zoloft, prozac and celexa contain SSRI's that can be dangerous when combined with an MAOI.

This brew contains a mix of very powerful plants. I hope the user has a healthy relationship and respect for these plants. To me the wild-card here is the addition of Belladonna, which is generally considered dangerous.

if you want another perspective on the subject, were discussing it at topia. seems to be pretty common to dose 300mgs+.

http://forums.mycotopia.net/botanicals-cactus-misc-entheogens-psychedelics/68144-dmt-oral-dosage-guide.html

 

[taterboard]

Wow. Clearly this site is not for you. If you had done YOUR homework, you'd know a little bit more about who you were addressing, and you'd understand that your brand of condescension is neither encouraged, tolerated nor welcome here.

We got off on the wrong foot here. Are you willing to say anything to start over? I hope so. I hate to make anyone feel unwelcome here.

JBArk

i apologize for my statement that you dont understand. it seems that you do but just have an aversion to it. i can respect that.

sorry i was just a bit riled up after being called a liar both here and on chat.

 

[gibran2]

Why even mention dose sizes?

“First Steps” is an experience sub-forum. How does it help anyone to know how much you consumed? (This is directed toward everyone, not just taterboard.)

I’ve always found it interesting that people feel compelled to include dose information in experience threads (it’s rarely relevant, and extremely variable, so why include it?) Isn’t the experience what you’re trying to share?

I would recommend that no one post dose information when describing an experience. (I’m guilty of this myself, and from now on will make a point of not including dose size when describing experiences.)

 

[taterboard]

well thats what i did post. the trip report. no one said anything about it whatsoever. all anyone wants to talk about is how imprudent/unwise/arrogant my dosing methods are.

i posted the recipe when i 1st thought of it but the only attention that was received is over numbers.

it was one of the most beautiful experiences ever. 2nd strongest trip also. amazing.

 

[gibran2]

Well, the recipe was unnecessary.

What’s important is how the experience has affected you. Has it changed you? Do you look at things differently now? Are there any insights or knowledge gained?

Those are the interesting questions that I'd like to hear answered.

How “strong” the trip is or how much you take to get to where you’re going isn’t really important. Where you go, what you see and feel, how you react, and how you integrate it all - those are the important things.

 

[obliguhl]

I'm gonna trust the experts at erowid over what anybody on any forum (even this one) says

Harmalas are reversible maois and if i recall correctly, 69rons psychedelic friend has had first hand experience with caapi and cactus. A low dose of tropane alkaloids also seems to be safe but i don't know how consisten belladonna leaves are in alkaloid content, so this might be potentially dangerous. Better switch to datura strammonium seeds (1-3) for potentiation.

The recipe still made me feel uneasy. One really has to know his reaction to all these plants and plant combinations to make it a safe ride. And he would need to do a long series of testing in different dosages imho. Maybe the threadstarter did that, so there is no need to flip out. It also could be that his is a hardhead, everyone is different. But its understandable that this recipe seems to be dangerous and ridiciolous to most. I also feel, that experience is more important than dosage. It's a basic lesson.

I also don't like the tone of this thread.