Massive Depression and Anxiety Post Changa

[Operculum]

Hey guys, long story short, I used some of my changa alone out in the woods with some music last week. I have a history of panic disorder and anxiety that really took over my life after I had a traumatic experience with MDMA.

A few things came up during the changa experience that I cried about. I noticed I felt better emotionally after the changa, but later in the week I started feeling really depressed. I wonder if I woke up my emotional body just enough to stir the dust from the bottom of my emotional vault and I am now dealing with old issues from the past. I went into work today for a meeting, and I felt the panic that I used to experience as a young man in my early 20's come back. Not as full force as it used to be, but I had to leave the work meeting early because it started to get so bad.

I know what you are all thinking, "You should immediately stop using changa", which, I am! I can't risk my job and lifestyle to try to self heal myself in the woods to deal with traumatic old emotional issues.

Sometimes I wonder if Ayahuasca would be the best way to deal with this emotional cyst that is sitting inside me. I've never done it but I wonder if it truly can heal me. I just know that right now, I can't afford to try changa anymore with it kicking up my depression like it has. This stuff is way more powerful than I imagined, and I must respect its raw power. I have no control over myself once the panic and anxiety kicks in. I've fought it my entire life and it just takes me away as if a hurricane blew over a tiny island.

Any input would be appreciated from anyone...I am trying to chill out and let my anxiety pass so that I can be ready for work tomorrow. It is not so bad, but if it kicks up like it did today at the work meeting, I might be in trouble. I went to my Dr. 3 days ago and am back on Antidepressants and anti anxiety medication. Maybe I have to suppress the pain for now, and carry it around with me until I am at a point later in life when I can safely take Ayahuasca without worrying about losing my mind at work and losing my job. I may have to face the reality that I might carry this pain with me for the rest of my life. Its just that I've felt emotionally numb ever since the horrible MDMA trip when I was 17.

Medications work pretty well, but they affect my sex life, and...why Can't I just live normally like I used to?

 

[lsDxMdmaddicThc]

Hey guys, long story short, I used some of my changa alone out in the woods with some music last week. I have a history of panic disorder and anxiety that really took over my life after I had a traumatic experience with MDMA.

A few things came up during the changa experience that I cried about. I noticed I felt better emotionally after the changa, but later in the week I started feeling really depressed. I wonder if I woke up my emotional body just enough to stir the dust from the bottom of my emotional vault and I am now dealing with old issues from the past. I went into work today for a meeting, and I felt the panic that I used to experience as a young man in my early 20's come back. Not as full force as it used to be, but I had to leave the work meeting early because it started to get so bad.

I know what you are all thinking, "You should immediately stop using changa", which, I am! I can't risk my job and lifestyle to try to self heal myself in the woods to deal with traumatic old emotional issues.

Sometimes I wonder if Ayahuasca would be the best way to deal with this emotional cyst that is sitting inside me. I've never done it but I wonder if it truly can heal me. I just know that right now, I can't afford to try changa anymore with it kicking up my depression like it has. This stuff is way more powerful than I imagined, and I must respect its raw power. I have no control over myself once the panic and anxiety kicks in. I've fought it my entire life and it just takes me away as if a hurricane blew over a tiny island.

Any input would be appreciated from anyone...I am trying to chill out and let my anxiety pass so that I can be ready for work tomorrow. It is not so bad, but if it kicks up like it did today at the work meeting, I might be in trouble. I went to my Dr. 3 days ago and am back on Antidepressants and anti anxiety medication. Maybe I have to suppress the pain for now, and carry it around with me until I am at a point later in life when I can safely take Ayahuasca without worrying about losing my mind at work and losing my job. I may have to face the reality that I might carry this pain with me for the rest of my life. Its just that I've felt emotionally numb ever since the horrible MDMA trip when I was 17.

Medications work pretty well, but they affect my sex life, and...why Can't I just live normally like I used to?

Just to clarify :
Did you use the Changa during the MDMA trip?

Here is my relation to your situation:
MDMA definitely stirred up my emotions and had a negative effect on me.
I look at it like the serotonin release showed me the blocks I set on myself.
We hold onto these emotional blockages to protect ourselves.
We set them up during traumatic experiences to protect ourselves.
Although they may have had a purpose in the past, they can inhibit you from releasing and feeling happyness.
You must decide whether these blockages/emotional traumas are beneficial.
I am in nearly the same boat right now.

Here are a few things that are helping :
Free-flow writing. No filter. Literally say how you feel. Pour out your soul. Don't pretend to be anything. Just feel where you are and accept it. That's the first step and I'm partially struggling with it because I don't want to be weak.
The next step is having someone who can connect to and resonate with your feelings.
This frees you from your personal cell of isolation and opens you up to infinite possibilities with another human.

I am also wondering if Ayahuasca would be beneficial to me.
I drank formosahuasca once and it took me to a dark purgatory where I couldn't purge.
I haven't thrown up in like 2 years despite forcibly trying after smoking DMT and changa countless times.
I always reach this block in all my trips.
Like I'm partially resisting this orgasmic spiritual release.
I think it's because I'm afraid to feel vulnerable and weak...
I power through it and I'm stuck in chaotic dark visions of blood, skulls, demons.
Needless to say I would like advice from an experienced shaman before proceeding to a full-dose Ayahuasca ceremony.

On a side note :
I just brewed up about 20g of Syrian Rue. I tried about 0.8g worth last night before bed.
It stimulated my mind and lifted my mood.
I would recommend you try a light dose of Syrian Rue or Ayahuasca vine alone just to awaken your spirit a little.
It was not uncomfortable in the slightest.

My advice to myself and you (a reflection of myself) :
Be present with yourself and your pain. Accept it. Love yourself.
Pour your feelings out into something : Art, Music, Poetry, etc.
Find someone who can understand your position.
I certainly can.
PM me if you want to connect more in private.

I wish you the all the best in your journey. Stay strong and don't give into negative emotions.
It's okay to feel them but don't do anything you will regret.
Self-control.

 

[Nathanial.Dread]

What happened with the MDMA? Normally it's never traumatic (quite the opposite, really).

As for this, it's hard to be certain it was the changa - after all, your feelings may have emerged without any drug use at all. It could be that you're due for a down spell. After a lifetime of OCD, I can tell you that sometimes you get worse for no reason, and then better again, it's part of life with a mental illness.

It's sort of a cliche at this point, but meditation might help with your anxiety. It won't cure all your problems, but it might give you a bit of a relief, which sometimes can be life-saving.

Longer term - I highly recommend a course of cognitive-behavioral therapy. If your problems really do stem from a traumatic expereince, CBT should help a lot. For me, it's been invaluable for dealing with my own anxieties. OCD is not PTSD, but they're related enough that I think I can speak with at least some confidence.

Avoiding changa in the future is probably a good idea. Maybe psychedelics in general are not for you. If MDMA can be traumatic, your brain might just not be wired to deal with these things in a healthy way.

Blessings
~ND

 

[DmnStr8]

The pain we suffer can begin to define us after time. We cling to it like badges of honor. Badges of stone. We collect them. One by one we take these badges of stone and place them around our necks. We carry them always. Until.... they weight of it all brings us to our knees.

Psychedelics can and do bring about the full weight for us to bear. The emotional scars become like riffs in our very being. Disconnecting us from happiness. These scars or riffs become something else entirely when using psychedelics. They suddenly appear to have substance. They can almost be smelled, touched, seen, and tasted. They become something that you can interact with and they can certainly interact with you. They become real and not some pit in your stomach or anxiety for the next day coming. Something tangible. It reaches out and takes a strangle hold. Grabs you and shakes you.

Who is causing this pain? What is it? We carry it around for what? Does it really define who you are? What will you be without it? If you were to not have this pain anymore, who would you be?

I think we attach ourselves to pain. We cling to it. We look at it as something of a badge of honor in many ways. We carry these badges of stone around until we can wake up and see the burden we carry. We see that we are the torturers of ourselves. When we see this we can begin to take of the badges of stone and lighten our burden. We begin to see when the torturer arrives. After carrying around these stones for so long we notice that when removed we have become stronger. We do not allow the torturer to torment any longer. We are too strong for that now. We recognized that the torturer took on the role to make you stronger. We see all this and accept it. We embrace the pain we have suffered and look at it in a new light. It becomes whole. The game is up. The roles have been eliminated. What are we now?

Venturing into the dark realms of our emotional scars requires strength and courage. It's hard. Any which way you approach pain and suffering will require commitment to healing. You make a line in the sand and do not compromise. Psychedelics in particular do not compromise. They only present what is within you. They show it to you and make it real.

When I ingested Ayahuasca it was the most terrifying experience of my life. I never knew that such fear, anguish, pain and suffering, confusion and terror could exist. I was broken in hell. Torn to pieces. Completely fragmented. This I think was necessary for me. This was something I needed to see and experience. It woke me up to what I was doing to myself. I could see the torturer and the stones now. I made it through the hell and I remained without my attachment to my pain. I was still here. It did not define me. This terrifying experience could have pushed me the other way. I could have lost all hope. It's a razor thin line some times. It hard to see the line you walk on psychedelics. You have to approach it with courage and great intention for healing with no compromise. You have to be strong.

Most of the work is done with a sober mind. Psychedelics and medications are tools of healing. You still have to work the tools for them to be effective. I highly agree with Nathanial on everything he said. CBT and meditation will help quite a bit. I would also add that you should look at your diet. Try and eat healthier. Lots of fruit and veggies. Start taking care of yourself in little ways and let it expand. Pat yourself on the back now for sharing and posting about your suffering. I respect anyone who can admit they are in pain. Your doing something about it. You are creating action. Tipping the scales in your favor.

Good luck with everything!

Please be kind to yourself.


P.S.
I have noticed something about every single psychedelic I have ever taken. It comes in waves. With MDMA in particular the waves come in one after another. Almost to the point where you feel like you are vibrating. It can feel like your going to break apart. The fear comes in and shades your experience. You will likely never feel like you did the first you did MDMA. It is just unique once. Sounds like you took a good enough dose to get the fear and it took over your journey. MDMA is not always so intense.

 

[Operculum]

Thanks for the input guys, there is depression on my fathers side and drug induced susceptibility psychosis on my mothers side.

I took the MDMA when I was a wee age of 16 and after that is when all the trouble started. I do enjoy changa as it really seems to bring to the surface a lot of emotional gunk, but maaaan, the depression I've been feeling afterwards has been enormous!

I could hardly go to the gym and lift today. My depression was so bad that it sapped my physical strength and I could barely lift my usual weight. I guess I just have to be very careful as when my depression gets too bad, I can't function at my job and we all have bills to pay.

Looks like I am going to have to put changa aside for a while and possibly get help through other means. Thanks for yalls input

 

[Operculum]

Also, to mention

My first MDMA experience was amazing! Something started happening though in each one after. I think it was because the parties I went to, I felt like an outsider to begin with, and not very welcome. Something scared me and the fear took over before the pleasure could over ride it, which turned into a nightmare trip for the rest of the night. I kept taking more x-pills in hopes that my negative trip would emerge into a beautiful one but it kept on going south. Anyway, I don't mean to rummage on about the past...just trying to figure out why I keep having hardships with Changa. I suppose Sobriety is my only choice in every possible way.

 

[tseuq]

I suppose Sobriety is my only choice in every possible way.

I suppose facing fears and learning how to deal with them is your only choice in every possible way.

When you take a look and think about where does the strategy of "taking more pills to get away from / avoiding my own emotions and thoughts" leads you too?

The imaginary cage, called your created reality, is getting tighter and tighter.

Love, tseuq

 

[Tommi]

As with MDMA xtal spirit, it teaches you to show empathy. It's not an easy "heart" path, MDMA wants you to show empathy ever and ever, no selfishness are allowed. It may be the drug of the future's saints, or so.

Just do something that would raise your heart vibration, make other people happy, and you got it. Or just rave your ass out of it.

Try Iboga, it fixes your ego.

 

[Bancopuma]

Thanks for the input guys, there is depression on my fathers side and drug induced susceptibility psychosis on my mothers side.

Hey dude, based on this alone I would advise treading with extreme caution when it comes to psychedelics and other powerful substances, research has flagged a family/genetic history of mental illness as something of a no-no when it comes to psychedelics, with their potential for unleashing a psychosis (say if you were applying to take part in a clinical psychedelic research study, you would very likely be excluded from any such research based on this).

The fact you experienced such negative feelings on MDMA is something of a red flag in itself I think. So I would personally recommend steering clear of these substances as they could make things much harder for you. I really hope you feel better.

 

[Silly(c)One]

I suppose Sobriety is my only choice in every possible way.

I suppose facing fears and learning how to deal with them is your only choice in every possible way.

When you take a look and think about where does the strategy of "taking more pills to get away from / avoiding my own emotions and thoughts" leads you too?

The imaginary cage, called your created reality, is getting tighter and tighter.

Love, tseuq

This +1.000.000 !!!

Depression and anxiety are the ways your subconscious tells you to change something drastic in your life.
They are just alarm signals.
Using products like benzos and SSRI are the ways Big Pharma has found to keep us in our cages, to fit in the box society wants you to.
But they don't fix the issue, they only cover the alarm signals !

You have 2 choices, really :
- keep being afraid/anxious and depressed for the rest of your life, medicating yourself so you don't have to change your lifestyle ;
- face your emotions, reconnect with yourself, change everything that needs to be changed and be happy.

The first choice, while being the one that will bring you the most suffering, is the easiest : it's what you've known all your adult life, what you learned from your parents, and keeping being a good boy (or a rebel, it's the same thing), further and further away from your real self. :twisted:
The second, while being the one that will bring you the most happiness, is the "hardest" (initially) : it's the most uncomfortable as you're about to face the unknown (your true self), and you're going to have to let go the belief that you have to be miserable like your parents were... But the rewards are unimaginable !

Changa, like all master plants and MDMA (it is a phenetylamine, transformed from a master plant after all), won't let you take the first road.
But the "spirits" of those plants are the greatest allies you'll find on your path, if you take the second road...

Now you don't have to take the second path alone... You can, but it's much longer if you're not accompanied by a "master" of sorts, a shaman or a spiritual "coach".
I walked the second path alone for many years, but have made huge leaps when I had my first shamanic ceremony (with Ayahuasca then the mushroom).
Changa is possible to work with, of course, it's an amazing medecine, but Ayahuasca and the shrooms are much more prone to a ceremonial use as they last much longer.

Much love,
Silly(c)One.

 

[Silly(c)One]

Thanks for the input guys, there is depression on my fathers side and drug induced susceptibility psychosis on my mothers side.

Hey dude, based on this alone I would advise treading with extreme caution when it comes to psychedelics and other powerful substances, research has flagged a family/genetic history of mental illness as something of a no-no when it comes to psychedelics, with their potential for unleashing a psychosis (say if you were applying to take part in a clinical psychedelic research study, you would very likely be excluded from any such research based on this).

The fact you experienced such negative feelings on MDMA is something of a red flag in itself I think. So I would personally recommend steering clear of these substances as they could make things much harder for you. I really hope you feel better.

No, those substances are to be avoided in case of a history of schizophrenia, not depression, at the opposite !

But you have to be clear of big pharma meds in order to take masterplants, as they interact in the same regions of the brain and that is potentially very dangerous or even lethal.

Both my parents were using benzos and SSRI, as well as I, for years, until I quit my job, quit SSRIs and started taking the mushroom on a regular basis.
They helped me get rid of all those poisons by Big Pharma for good.

Cheers,
Silly(c)One.

 

[Bancopuma]

It's not that simple dude, depression comes in different forms with a variety of potential causal factors. Also the OP describes "drug induced susceptibility psychosis" on his mother's side...this alone is a big red flag when it comes to psychedelic or drug use, surely?? With a history of mental health issues from both sides of the family, it seems to me that to experiment with powerful mind altering drugs with a family history of this is playing with fire, and one is liable to get burned.

 

[Nathanial.Dread]

Depression and anxiety are the ways your subconscious tells you to change something drastic in your life.
They are just alarm signals.
Using products like benzos and SSRI are the ways Big Pharma has found to keep us in our cages, to fit in the box society wants you to.
But they don't fix the issue, they only cover the alarm signals !

This is incredibly irresponsible to say, verging on violating the Nexus' guidelines about giving medical advice and conspiracy theories.

Sometimes depression can be a sign that things in your life are unhealthy, sometimes it can be the result of trauma, sometimes it can be the result of brain injury, sometimes it happens for no discernible reason whatsoever. It's absurd to think that you can condense depression and anxiety down into some simple solution.

As for the line about SSRIs, while the issue is indeed complex, there are plenty of people for whom SSRIs can be life-saving medications and succeed where psychedelics, meditation, and other 'alternative' psychiatric medications fail. One of the most important people in my life is one of them: psychedelics haven't helped her depression, but fluoxetine really does. Is her attempt to use the resources available to her to live the life she wants a symptom of being in a 'cage?'

Sorry if this comes off as aggressive, but as someone who spends a lot of time researching these disorders professionally, as well as caring for people who suffer for them, this kind of holier-than-though claim of a universal psychiatric panacea grinds my gears.

Blessings
~ND

 

[dragonrider]

I suppose Sobriety is my only choice in every possible way.

I suppose facing fears and learning how to deal with them is your only choice in every possible way.

When you take a look and think about where does the strategy of "taking more pills to get away from / avoiding my own emotions and thoughts" leads you too?

The imaginary cage, called your created reality, is getting tighter and tighter.

Love, tseuq

This +1.000.000 !!!

Depression and anxiety are the ways your subconscious tells you to change something drastic in your life.
They are just alarm signals.
Using products like benzos and SSRI are the ways Big Pharma has found to keep us in our cages, to fit in the box society wants you to.
But they don't fix the issue, they only cover the alarm signals !

You have 2 choices, really :
- keep being afraid/anxious and depressed for the rest of your life, medicating yourself so you don't have to change your lifestyle ;
- face your emotions, reconnect with yourself, change everything that needs to be changed and be happy.

The first choice, while being the one that will bring you the most suffering, is the easiest : it's what you've known all your adult life, what you learned from your parents, and keeping being a good boy (or a rebel, it's the same thing), further and further away from your real self. :twisted:
The second, while being the one that will bring you the most happiness, is the "hardest" (initially) : it's the most uncomfortable as you're about to face the unknown (your true self), and you're going to have to let go the belief that you have to be miserable like your parents were... But the rewards are unimaginable !

Changa, like all master plants and MDMA (it is a phenetylamine, transformed from a master plant after all), won't let you take the first road.
But the "spirits" of those plants are the greatest allies you'll find on your path, if you take the second road...

Now you don't have to take the second path alone... You can, but it's much longer if you're not accompanied by a "master" of sorts, a shaman or a spiritual "coach".
I walked the second path alone for many years, but have made huge leaps when I had my first shamanic ceremony (with Ayahuasca then the mushroom).
Changa is possible to work with, of course, it's an amazing medecine, but Ayahuasca and the shrooms are much more prone to a ceremonial use as they last much longer.

Much love,
Silly(c)One.

Look man...the matrix is just a movie. It's entertainment, fun. It's not real.

There is no big conspiracy going on, with big pharma, to keep us all in line.
Just like there are no chemtrails and there is no planet nibiru, and we are no clones from anunaki to dig make us dig for monatomic gold, or whatever.
(OK, it's ofcoruse totally useless that i'm telling you this because if you realy believe that stuff, you're not gonna listen anyway. And then the predictable response is going to be that you're gonna tell me that i haven't 'woken-up' yet, or that i should take the 'blue pill' or something like that).

Yes it's true, big pharma exists. And yes, they want to make lot's of money. And yes, sometimes at the expense of patients. And yes, if they can invent some fake disorder so they can sell more meds to people who're just a bit 'dificult', they will, and it's a very bad think that society just let's it happen.

But SSRI's can be very usefull to some people. They are very effective against a whole range of depressive, anxiety and compulsive disorders.

To me, all these things you're saying sound a bit paranoïd. And paranoia is a bad omen, considering your family history.

Bancopuma is right, you're playing with fire.
And contrary to what you're saying, those substances áre also to be avoided in some cases of depressive disorders. Depression and schizophrenia are not mutually exclusive at all. They aren't opposites.
Schizophrenia is almost Always paired with depression. Depression is very often a first sign.

I knew a girl, a good friend of mine, who actually developed schizophrenia. It was not a fun thing to see. In spite of her reacting very badly to hallucinogenic drugs (and cannabis as well), she kept taking them. Defending it with the same kind of arguments you are using.

At the time i believed that it was her personal decission to do so, and that i couldn't force her to quit. I now deeply regret that choice.

 

[dragonrider]

I know i was a bit harsh up there^. What i mean to say is this:Your parents and teachers, if they're good parents and teachers, will require a lot of you. And when you're very young, you'll all experience it as a form of slavery.

But in life, you sometimes just have to do some of these things. Not for them, but for yourself. Brushing your teeth is a good example. First, when you're a very young child, you don't want to brush your teet every day. It feels like slavery, to be told by your parents to go brush your teeth. But at some point you come to see the bigger picture: you're doing yourself a favor. Not brushing your teeth can have extremely painfull consequences. You don't want some stinking and rotting abcess in your mouth, infecting your blootstream with flesh-eating bacteria. So you're only doing yourself a favor to comply here.

That's the case with so many other things as well. Paying the bills, earning an income...you're doing yourself a favor by conforming to these norms. But there also are a lot of things that you don't need to conform to. Going to church could be something like that. Or maybe your parents want you to go to law-school, or to marry and get childeren.

When it's all like slavery to you, you're mostly a slave to yourself. Only when you've risen above that level, when you've become your own master, then you can realy decide wich of the things you're going to conform to and wich of things you won't.

But by that time, you can also make the system work for you, instead of the other way round. There are so many ways in wich you could do this, and it all depends on where your interests and your talents lie. And to what you would want to do with your life.

The DMT-nexus is a good example of a place that makes the system work for us. There are some real scientists here, and with their help we can use science to further our goals. and we help to spread real knowledge. But there are numerous other ways in wich you can turn it around, and make the system work for you. You can use the system to change things. As long as you're realistic and don't expect miracles.

Trust me, it works. It happens all the time.
But be your own master. And not a slave. Make sure you own yourself. I can't Judge whether you should take SSRI's or not, or whether DMT is safe for you. But as long as you're not your own master, you realy can't either.

I would reccomend meditation and maybe some kind of physical activity like running.

 

[Bill Cipher]

Depression and anxiety are the ways your subconscious tells you to change something drastic in your life.
They are just alarm signals.
Using products like benzos and SSRI are the ways Big Pharma has found to keep us in our cages, to fit in the box society wants you to.
But they don't fix the issue, they only cover the alarm signals !

This is incredibly irresponsible to say, verging on violating the Nexus' guidelines about giving medical advice and conspiracy theories.

Verging?

Silly(c)One - Congratulations, you win a month off!

 

[tseuq]

I relate this phrase ..

.. where does the strategy of "taking more pills to get away from / avoiding my own emotions and thoughts" leads you too?

.. to this posting from the OP.

Something scared me and the fear took over before the pleasure could over ride it, which turned into a nightmare trip for the rest of the night. I kept taking more x-pills in hopes that my negative trip would emerge into a beautiful one but it kept on going south.

Safe and happy travels, tseuq

 

[Operculum]

Well guys, 1 week out and I've got an update...

The depression has subsided, but I'm having mild anxiety that is being triggered at work. I'm not bashing Changa by any means. I'm just reporting my interactions. I think most people are safe with Changa. I am always treading thin ice when I venture into the psychelic realm due to my unofficial condition.

I am going to give it a long time again before venturing into the Changa realm. Thanks for the help and support. Luckily I haven't ripped open my emotional self so much that I can't function at work. I ALMOST put myself into that threshold, but I am ok. This is going to be a very tedious process I believe.

 

[fathomlessness]

Well guys, 1 week out and I've got an update...

The depression has subsided, but I'm having mild anxiety that is being triggered at work. I'm not bashing Changa by any means. I'm just reporting my interactions. I think most people are safe with Changa. I am always treading thin ice when I venture into the psychelic realm due to my unofficial condition.

I am going to give it a long time again before venturing into the Changa realm. Thanks for the help and support. Luckily I haven't ripped open my emotional self so much that I can't function at work. I ALMOST put myself into that threshold, but I am ok. This is going to be a very tedious process I believe.

Good to hear mate :thumb_up: It can be a rocky ride and certainly was for me. From what I have read it takes people weeks and sometimes months to either integrate or feel that they are ready to trip again. There is no hurry, DMT will always be waiting for you when you feel you are psychologically stable enough to test its stability again

 

[skoobysnax]

If you were taking MDMA frequently you experienced serious neurotoxicity. My daughters friend was hospitalized from overuse. Having blackouts and severe depression. The advice to roll only once in 3 months is good and redosing always made the comedown harder.