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mdma before ayahuasca

Migrated topic.
Easy answer is about 72 hours.

Moar detailed information:

MDMA has a half life of 7 hours. It's metabolites MDA and HMMA have half lives up to 12.5 and 13.5 hours respectively (source). It's generally recommended to wait at least 4, and better 6-7, half life cycles before mixing any contraindicated compounds (moar info).
 
The depleted serotonin might make your ayahuasca experience darker. Something you should consider before going into it.

Ayahuasca is difficult as it is, even when you go in it after a fruit and veggie diet for 7 days, a water fast for another 3 days and no drugs whatsoever for a month including caffeine.

Most of us aren't that extreme and have probably done some drugs in the past week, ate junk food on the very same day because let's be honest mimosa and rue is something anyone could easily get and prepare.

If I were you I would wait a bit more to give time to at least replenish a good bit of that lost serotonin but you will be probably just fine if you wait the minimal amount of time to avoid an interaction.
 
It's interesting to note that ayahuasca has been demonstrated to upregulate serotonin receptors (source). While you may not be at your best going into an aya experience 3 days after MDMA, theoretically the ayahuasca may help combat some of the detrimental effects of the MDMA.

Please be aware of other contraindications particularly with pharmaceutical medications such as SSRI's and other CNS stimulants (like amphetamines which are a common cut in pressed pills and many street samples).

On a slightly offtopic and rather personal note, since I consider MDMA and ayahausca rather opposite ends of a spectrum, I'm a bit curious what would lead one to want to take them so close together anyway?
 
bionecrosis said:
pitubo said:
The contraindications apply to rue and caapi, not to mimosa.
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Contraindication sith Mdma?
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Yes, with.

harmalas (harmine/harmaline/syrian rue/B. caapi) = MAOI
MDMA/MDA = SSRI
MAOI + SSRI = serotonin syndrome

Also note that if you are on an anti-depressant, there is a good chance that it is an SSRI. If you are on any NDRIs such as Wellbutrin, this is also contraindicated.

And as a note to the mods, I read somewhere on the Nexus (can't find the page again but it was not just a thread) that Wellbutrin (bupropion) is contraindicated for use with harmalas due to increased risk of seizures. Increased risk of seizures is a risk of Welbutrin alone. After discussing with my psychiatrist, it is still contraindicated but the risk that combining any NDRI with MAOI poses is hypertension.
 
And what about shallow the mimosa but not fine powder just very fine hairs and shatered.My guinea pig will start in 30min.
 
As long as you do not mix high dose Syrian RUE and add MDMA you should be fine as long as you follow the rules as stated in this thread.
 
syberdelic said:
MDMA/MDA = SSRI
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MDMA is not a serotonin reuptake inhibitor, actually it's mechanism of action is quite the opposite, it basically busts open the door on that SERT pathway that normally only allows serotonin reuptake in serotonin specific neurons. This means any neurotransmitter present in the synapse can get into the neuron. These other neurotransmitters oxidize inside the cell and kill it. This is roughly the process by which MDMA causes neurotoxicity. In fact, taking an SSRI on the MDMA comedown has been demonstrated to largely prevent neurotoxicity in rat studies. I provide moar information and references for this here. NOTE: DO NOT MIX SSRI's AND HARMALAS! a little neurotoxicity is better than serotonin syndrome.

syberdelic said:
And as a note to the mods, I read somewhere on the Nexus (can't find the page again but it was not just a thread) that Wellbutrin (bupropion) is contraindicated for use with harmalas due to increased risk of seizures. Increased risk of seizures is a risk of Welbutrin alone. After discussing with my psychiatrist, it is still contraindicated but the risk that combining any NDRI with MAOI poses is hypertension.
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This is an important point. Harmalas should never be mixed with any kind of reuptake inhibitor (SSRI/SNRI/SDRI/etc) or any kind of neurotransmitter releaser (amphetamines, cathinones, ephedrine, etc) or neurotransmiter precursors (5-HTP, L-DOPA, Tryptophan, etc)

Neurochemistry is a fickle thing, be sure and do thorough research if you intend on playing with it.

Be safe folques
❤

P.S. - I fixed the thread title kuz it was bugging me.
 
So,a friend of me took 3.1gr rue in capsul,30min later he start feeling somehow heavy in front of the head and get like sleepy.He start taking the mimosa calsuls and it took around 30 min to take them all(10grams shetered)He toom 1gr rue more with t he capsules and 2h later he don't feel anything neither nausea.What should be the problem?Probably low dmt content in mimosa?
 
Tell your friend to try brewing a tea next time instead of eating capsuled plant powder. Boil 4 grams of whole rue seeds and 5 grams of shredded or powdered mimosa root together for an hour. Poor the hot solution through a coffee filter and boil the plant materials once again with fresh water. Filter and then reduce the combined liquids by simmering on low heat until you have enough to fill a small cup.
 
What is should be thd diferrence,should be same.The stomatch disolv anyyhing.
People on other forums say that it is due rue stop qcting.
Can I boil mimosa for 1h with 1lemon and dring 10min after 4gr rue.
 
1 gram is rue is generally not sufficient to fully inhibit MAO in most people. 3-4 grams is a moar reliable dose for that.

You don't need 10 grams of mimosa that's extremely overkill, even 5 is moar than most people would want or need, start with 2-3 grams and work up from there, you can always take moar if you are underwhelmed, you can't take less when you are overwhelmed.

Boil the materials 3 times in fresh water for 30 minutes each boil, combine all the boils and reduce to drinkable amount.
 
dreamer042 said:
1 gram is rue is generally not sufficient to fully inhibit MAO in most people. 3-4 grams is a moar reliable dose for that.

You don't need 10 grams of mimosa that's extremely overkill, even 5 is moar than most people would want or need, start with 2-3 grams and work up from there, you can always take moar if you are underwhelmed, you can't take less when you are overwhelmed.

Boil the materials 3 times in fresh water for 30 minutes each boil, combine all the boils and reduce to drinkable amount.
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I sayed that I took 3.1grams 30 later started taking he mimosa capsula.It took about 30min to take all mimosa capsuls.I took 1 more gram rue with the mimosa thats 4gr+10gr.And source is good.What it the problem.The mimosa wasnt very fine powder.It was wil some fibers but it is only the inner bark
 
bionecrosis said:
dreamer042 said:
1 gram is rue is generally not sufficient to fully inhibit MAO in most people. 3-4 grams is a moar reliable dose for that.

You don't need 10 grams of mimosa that's extremely overkill, even 5 is moar than most people would want or need, start with 2-3 grams and work up from there, you can always take moar if you are underwhelmed, you can't take less when you are overwhelmed.

Boil the materials 3 times in fresh water for 30 minutes each boil, combine all the boils and reduce to drinkable amount.
Click to expand...
I sayed that I took 3.1grams 30 later started taking he mimosa capsula.It took about 30min to take all mimosa capsuls.I took 1 more gram rue with the mimosa thats 4gr+10gr.And source is good.What it the problem.The mimosa wasnt very fine powder.It was wil some fibers but it is only the inner bark
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Are you dense? The problem you are experiencing has been explained & laid out for you very clearly already.

To reiterate what should be common sense:
Dont eat capsules full of whole rue & big hunks of poorly broken down wood & expect to trip.
You have to do some work on the materials to pull out the actives & conecntrate them down enough that they are not spread throughout 14g worth of plant material the digestive tract is not designed to process.
 
Ya thanks not dense just answer every guy posted so I can get there opinion.And last guy thout I took only 1 gr..
Regards
 
This isn't really falling in line with the respectful communication attitude of the forum, let's do try to keep it classy here.

I will say that I've found it quite interesting when people insist on taking doses beyond what is sensible, they almost always misfire and get nothing out of it. It's just another one of those curious things that happens with these plants.

You have to do some work on the materials
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^ Absolutely this. Invest some time in learning how to appropriately approach and work with these powerful substances. It's not a race or a pissing contest, proceeding hastily and/or carelessly rarely achieves the desired outcome. Honor the process, respect the teachers, be humble, and you may find many rewards waiting for you on this path.
 
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