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Opinion: DMT is attractive because it gives people hope there’s an afterlife

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S

SickLilPsycho

Rising Star
Do you think people interested in DMT are subconsciously drawn to it because it suggests that perhaps there’s something else after death, in the same vein that ghosts, God and, to a lesser extent, UFOs do? I would have to say that it plays a significant part in my curiosity towards the subject

What about you?
 
A recurring outcome of psychedelics will be to reconsider one places in ones life, as perceptions have more or less drastically been shifted, it can draw a clear focus to death. As we modern monkeys spend a lot of time in boxes and their eternal slumbers, we sort of keep out of touch with it. Yet if the mind is taken apart, it can obviously feel like dying, what is interesting is that it happens by enhancing change, by swiping known structures to some that language and its lines more or less forbids.

In my case, having experienced those deathly moments, it really came to be understood that we cannot know death because it would be so outside of our realm of perception. That is the body and its component decompose, everything in the way we experience reality would be so drastically else we could not grasp it.

But the realms of hyperspace and associate might resemble more those of the womb, a time were the body was not yet active and the mind might roam freely and meltedly in the liquid paradise of the great big bubble waiting to be smooshed. Maybe from this it is then possible to understand the desire of looping the pattern and moebsdianizing the axis, whether or not this future that will undoubtedly come is what we have foreseen it to be is accurate or not, the feeling is true in itself and holds truth.

I guess what this whole meant is that, real or not, this past future sort of leads the flow of our lives.
 
I think it's a stretch to resemble hyperspace with death-realm. Other substances take you to significant other realms, why would those not be as equal candidates? I read that 5meo would be a better candidate than nn-dmt.

What I've grasped so far about Near Death Experiences (clinically temporary deaths included), its not like dmt hyperspace. Note that from a wide range of NDE's only a small fraction had remembrance of something to share about. For like 90%-ish there was no testimony to share, just pure total absence of any form of notion.

On the other hand if dying is considered like running and hard to anticipate for, then we are supposedly stretching our system more flexible for whatever task is awaiting us.
 
NDE's have everything in common with cosmic consciousness. its not about specific drugs or their specific effects, its about trascendance, higher insight. I have not heard 1 NDE which is not like a Dmt experience. And I have not read any part of the vedas or the suttas or any ancient text of eternal truth, where the experience of obtaining true awareness and entering heavenly realms or nibbana is not like a dmt trip. Its a unique field of knowledge, with signatures (love, beauty, emptiness, interconnectedness, oneness, bliss, childlike joy, equanimity, etc.)
 
Hi Franlover, I was referring mostly to the differences in form, the packages, how it presents, like roads. I said 'realms' but actually meant pathway's. The content however, the meaning, to where the different forms bring us, is likely form transcending and unifying as you call it nicely the field of knowledge.
Interpreting dmt and nde's and substances is a can of worms ;)
 
FranLover said:
NDE's have everything in common with cosmic consciousness. its not about specific drugs or their specific effects, its about trascendance, higher insight. I have not heard 1 NDE which is not like a Dmt experience.
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If you have read about NDEs but not experienced one, how can you say this? Perhaps your beliefs are bringing a bit of confirmation bias into the mix when you are reading other peoples accounts.
 
Hi Hug =) perhaps, perhaps...Wise is to see with no self, then one observes truly. Likewise it is wise to listen with no self, then one hears truly
 
Jees said:
Interpreting dmt and nde's and substances is a can of worms ;)
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...and dreams, lucid dreams, out of body experiences, meditation and silence, and fasting, and observation of natural phenomena; science, etc, etc...all very complex, but simplified with the understanding that the unifying thing is consciousness, psychic realm, unmanifest made manifest, dna, genes, memory, the purpose of bees in the ecosystem, of trees, of water, of stars, etc. All of which is Pratītyasamutpāda (dependant co arising.) :)♡ this is knowledge of Oneness. But I agree its a can of worms, complex, subtle, and something not everyone will experience or understand for various reasons, as various as different kinds of nde experiences, or dmt breakthroughs
 
I was never drawn or attracted to DMT because of beilfs in afterlife , God and all that spiritual thing , not that I don't believe in that stuff

I used to drop acid all the time and one fine day a friend showed up with some DMT and a sphongle CD , knowing me the tripper I was there was no need to convince me further and that was it
 
Actually in all honesty my belief in "afterlife" or the continuation of experience/awareness after the death of the physical body brings me no comfort. A lot of athiests will often say to me that I am just believing in that because it comforts me.. actually .. nah .. it kinda scares the hell out of me. The DMT flash is beautiful and intense.. but the idea of an eternal breakthrough DMT like experience at death is a hell of a lot more intimidating than just "switching off".. I get nervous before putting the pipe to my lips just to go there for 10 minutes..

In answer to your question.. I'm not really sure - i haven't really ever thought about it in that way. I guess I am attracted to it because I consider the experience "real" and valuable. It feels like your being unforgivingly ripped out of the "matrix" .. and the feeling is so deeply confronting .. but so fascinating its kind of hard to look away. Much grace is to be found when you stare down the barrel of the gun .. this is why I continue to use DMT and why I will always use it at differen't junctures in time. Over my lifetime I hope that DMT will help train me to die with excitement rather than fear when the time comes..

Actually I was initially drawn to DMT through Erowid's 5 levels of tripping in the psychedelic FAQ. Reading through the effects of the different tiers of psychedelic experience and getting to the 5th and reading the oh so casual line "this can be achieved with a common smoked dose of DMT" I knew that I had to seek that experience out. A lot of people say DMT needs to come to you.. well in my case I went looking for it. But you might say it found me through the literature I was reading which sparked my interest..

I suppose the beautiful acacia trees here in Australia draw me to it too..
 
5meoDMT instilled in me a better understanding of the death process, and allowed me to come to terms with it and accept it as a beautiful and necessary part of life. I won't go into the particulars about my personal beliefs because even with those perceptions, that is all they are, and death in reality remains an unknown. I will say that my prior concepts of the continuation of consciousness were destroyed and it is something i no longer hold onto, as i see that idea now as only grasping onto an attachment to somethimg i cannot hold onto. It is not that I had a lot of death anxiety, in fact quite the opposite before, i just didn't realize how little i knew the greatest certainty of my life.

N,n DMT, on the hand...I have no freaking clue what that is about. It is the singular strangest thing i know of except perhaps UFOs and Bigfoots, and kinda stays in the same realm of perceptible but uncomprehendable things for me, and that's okay.
 
I think people have vastly different attractions to the molecule. Some people are similar to me in that regard, and others are quite different 😁 One of my favorite parts of DMT is the dynamic array of minds it can touch. I did not believe in any kind of afterlife before, after, or any point during any of my drug experience though and such matters are of little importance to me. DMT reconnects me with the life in front of me.
 
VibeSurfer said:
I think people have vastly different attractions to the molecule. Some people are similar to me in that regard, and others are quite different 😁 One of my favorite parts of DMT is the dynamic array of minds it can touch. I did not believe in any kind of afterlife before, after, or any point during any of my drug experience though and such matters are of little importance to me. DMT reconnects me with the life in front of me.
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I guess i can say that that is what DMT does for me. It screams at me to LIVE LIVE LIVE NOW!
 
null24 said:
VibeSurfer said:
I think people have vastly different attractions to the molecule. Some people are similar to me in that regard, and others are quite different 😁 One of my favorite parts of DMT is the dynamic array of minds it can touch. I did not believe in any kind of afterlife before, after, or any point during any of my drug experience though and such matters are of little importance to me. DMT reconnects me with the life in front of me.
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I guess i can say that that is what DMT does for me. It screams at me to LIVE LIVE LIVE NOW!
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Yessssssss. LIVE LIVE LIVE. A lot of times I have come to and just went barreling out the door to touch my hands to the grass or put my feet on the ground.
 
No simple combination of atoms can teach anyone anything. Chemicals (just like meditation, conversation, diet, traveling, physical activity, etc.) can only create conditions for one to teach oneself and/or others.

In mammalian brains there are circuits of neurons that fire together at certain frequencies.

Imagine that a large group of people is told to start clapping. Each individual will initially clap at his own frequency, but very quickly the entire group will synchronize. The same effectively happens with neural circuits - neurons synchronize their activation rates and begin to fire together. The same happens in the society - protesters can form mobs that will self-synchronize without any leadership.

Now imagine one person in the group deliberately decides to clap at a different frequency. Synchronous clapping can easily be disrupted that way.

This is how hallucinogens work - by reducing the normal rate of activation of certain neurons they disrupt the established oscillation rhythms, throwing neural circuits into the state of partial disarray or even complete chaos ( known as "breakthrough" ), depending on the dose. Old, entrenched beliefs, ideas, perceptions can wobble and break down during this period of self-induced insanity. DMT (smoked or oral) with harmalas seems to be more useful than just smoked DMT because the experience is slower, longer and subjectively deeper.

Once the psychedelic wears off, the neurons will eventually find new ways to self-synchronize and oscillate together again. During this time ( known as "reintegration" ) one can recall memories, form new ideas, connect the dots differently, and answer difficult questions that one could not answer - or even ask - before.

One can only reinterpret the knowledge that one already has. Therefore, psychedelic experiences are the most useful in adulthood - late enough to build on enough prior knowledge, but early enough so that the people you love can still hear your words.
 
Hailstorm said:
No simple combination of atoms can teach anyone anything. Chemicals (just like meditation, conversation, diet, traveling, physical activity, etc.) can only create conditions for one to teach oneself and/or others.

In mammalian brains there are circuits of neurons that fire together at certain frequencies.

Imagine that a large group of people is told to start clapping. Each individual will initially clap at his own frequency, but very quickly the entire group will synchronize. The same effectively happens with neural circuits - neurons synchronize their activation rates and begin to fire together. The same happens in the society - protesters can form mobs that will self-synchronize without any leadership.

Now imagine one person in the group deliberately decides to clap at a different frequency. Synchronous clapping can easily be disrupted that way.

This is how hallucinogens work - by reducing the normal rate of activation of certain neurons they disrupt the established oscillation rhythms, throwing neural circuits into the state of partial disarray or even complete chaos ( known as "breakthrough" ), depending on the dose. Old, entrenched beliefs, ideas, perceptions can wobble and break down during this period of self-induced insanity. DMT (smoked or oral) with harmalas seems to be more useful than just smoked DMT because the experience is slower, longer and subjectively deeper.

Once the psychedelic wears off, the neurons will eventually find new ways to self-synchronize and oscillate together again. During this time ( known as "reintegration" ) one can recall memories, form new ideas, connect the dots differently, and answer difficult questions that one could not answer - or even ask - before.

One can only reinterpret the knowledge that one already has. Therefore, psychedelic experiences are the most useful in adulthood - late enough to build on enough prior knowledge, but early enough so that the people you love can still hear your words.
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Oh come on. A tad reductionist maybe?

And shoot, I'm very appreciate if the psychedelic experiences i undertook as a teenager and young adult, they were very instrumental and helpful in creating the work view i have now. And that which I've done in my adult years have also been thoroughly beneficial in a different way.
 
null24 said:
Oh come on. A tad reductionist maybe?
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This article refers to the same "people clapping" example. I do not remember if I took it from there.

For completeness, this one claims that hallucinogens promote permanent (positive) physical changes in the brain, so there could be a lot going on that my simple description above does not capture.

I'm very appreciate if the psychedelic experiences i undertook as a teenager and young adult
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I had no personal experiences, and I have not seen much written about the "psychedelics and age" subject either. "Adulthood" was my own guess / conclusion.

I do not feel good about "psychedelics and kids" after coming across a few warnings that discourage people under 25 from trying mind-altering substances. Apparently certain mental disorders lie dormant before that age and the individual risk may not be fully known.
 
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