Self-Sustaining Entheogenic Community

[Lavos]

Here's some interesting quotes I found searching how big of a garden to build for a family of four. Myself, doing some gardening and research before, thinks 1/2 acre of gardening to feed 1 person per year, done well and with proper harvesting, probably feed 4. Then you want the orchards and nuts and what not too. Hope this helps.

I recommend getting THE HAVE MORE PLAN it is offered in the Countryside bookstore. Though it is over 50 yrs old it is still packed with useful information about the questions you are asking. It has a veggie planting chart that tells how much you need to plant for a family of five. (But I recommend that you plant in raised beds instead of the long rows that was common back then)

One of the best features is the homestead layout. They give examples of a 2 acre and 5 acre spread. Lots of tips on things not to leave out. It is excellent for getting you started thinking about your place.

I laid out our future homestead on graph paper using 1 square for 10 feet. I planned how big I wanted the house, yard (just right for mowing), garden, shade trees, orchard, berry patches, nut trees(double as shade), barn/chicken coop, garage, driveway, trees for wind break, and even space for a second little house for our elderly years or guests. When I was done I added it all up and was surprised to find it was only one acre! That didn't include pasture, which I would want, and maybe an acre or two for alfalfa. So anything beyond 6 acres is elbow room and I want some of that too.

We are a family of 6 , a dressed hog at 230 lbs lasts us about a year .It doesn't keep us in ribs though . This year we will put 2 in the freezer , as the kids get older they eat more ! I have not done a cow yet but figure 1 will do .This spring I will raise up about 100 chickens .

I would agree with those advising not to get so many species of animals at first. We started with horses (3)then chickens (20) then goats (9) then sheep(2) and geese (3)then added a calf, 2 turkeys and 2 pigs over a span of four years. Without a doubt, caring for that many species of animals is neither simple nor easy. My vet refers to it as a "zoo" with all the attending problems of a real zoo maintining numerous species confined to a small area. There is parasite sharing among species, certain diseases cross species lines and caring for all these animals can be a logistical nightmare causing more stress than is necessary. Managing the worming and vaccinations schedules for that many species alone is a task.

I am rethinking our farming model to decrease the number of species on our farm. The best solution, in my opinion, is to raise 2 or three species and then swap with neighbors who grow/raise something different.

A modest size back yard could grow nearly enough food to feed your family of four. The key parts of managing this are: 1. Grow what your family will eat! 2. Use space very wisely (e.g. Grow the 3 sisters - corn, pole beans, and pumpkins - together) 3. Keep on top of preserving your harvest 4. Use what you don't eat (think zucchini overload) to trade for things you don't grow 5. Seek out others who can help! (Check out Path To Freedom! <http://www.pathtofreedom.com/>)

Used raised bed gardens, which are more productive and grow more food in less space.


If you google "urban homesteading", you will find that others have fed families of four using as little as 1/10 of an acre. (conventional farming uses 1.2 acres to feed a single individual.


That being said, there are lots of variables: soil health, local weather, rain, pests, farming practices, etc. that influence yield.

Ah yes, and don't forget these man this will hold 50 people. Or you could also go with the isla san pedro

You can achieve whatever you can imagine, but enjoy the experience any way you can get it. Good luck. Not to insight doom, but I watched Mosquito Coast around the time I was thinking such utopian thoughts, that and the movie the beach, can help reconcile any fantasy. I see nothing wrong with trying where others have failed.

 

[PowerfulMedicine]

Has anyone considered an approach more like that which primitive cultures used. I have nothing against small scale subsistence agriculture but I have always dreamed of not just living off the land but living in harmony with the land.

One of my life goals is to someday spend a large amount of time living as a hunter-gatherer possibly in a "tribe" of like minded people. This lifestyle has some definite advantages. One major advantage is that, besides the costs of the land, there is little need for money or material objects. The main resource that will be necessary initially is knowledge. Everyone would have to have plenty of outdoor survival skills. Another advantage is that irrigation would be able to be kept at a minimum since there would be a lot less agriculture and less time would be needed for cultivating plants. We would only cultivate our entheogens or other very usefull plants. By relying on native plants to supply the food and medicine, the amount of "productive" land would be drastically increased while drastically reducing the amount of labor. Meat would be obtained by hunting.

The biggest advantage, though, is that a tribal lifestyle is the most effective way to harbor community and closeness. Not just with the tribal members, but with the land and plants and animals that live on the land. Everyone would truly be dependent on each other and the land.

This way of living does have some initial requirements though. As I said before, people would have to have sufficient survival skills and knowledge of plants and animals. The tribe would also need to have land that is relatively remote and not too affected by human activity. Wilderness isn't necessary but wouldn't hurt. The land would also have to be surrounded by a good amount of similar public land. Preferably something not too heavily regulated, maybe a large tract of state forest.

This method has its complications but I would say that it is the simplest approach and would be my preferred method. This may be too extreme for some/most people, so if a more modern approach was used instead, I have some suggestions. Instead of cultivating standard vegetables etc., use native and/or weedy plants that require very little or no extra water or care. These plants will often produce much greater yields multiple times in one year and even reseed themselves, providing a permanent source of food.

 

[Tropical]

"One of my life goals is to someday spend a large amount of time living as a hunter-gatherer"

Lets hope 7 billion people dont share that belief...we wont have a single tree or rodent left alive if iwe didnt rely on agriculture. its a nice fantasy, i share it. But it has great consequences if actually done in a large scale.

 

[SKA]

I only want to do this on a small scale, allthough there oughta be room to grow a little.
A village/town in which people can live without the use of Money, working for their own food, providing their own electricity, housing and sanitation.
A place in which people are not forced to pay monthly taxes or money-costs of any kind, in which people are free to practice Entheogenesis without any fear of prosecution.

I keep pondering the options there are of starting a politically, economically and ideologically autonomous town/village.

Here are some options I have recently thought of;

-I assume that if one finds an uninhabited Island that is not mapped and unclaimed, there is a good chance such an independant, self-sustaining village can succeed and grow into a small town there.
-There may be many tribal peoples that are not waiting for people like us to share their land and life with, but there may be tribal peoples that would very much welcome this idea. Might negociating this idea with Tribal peoples be fruitfull, a Tribe might just grant us permission to build such a community on their land.
-Perhaps there are Landowners or surrealistically rich individuals that are supportive and excited about this plan? We could try gaining support of landowners willing to allow our community on their land or unbelievably rich people willing to buy land for us and help pay for the work that needs to be done.
-Perhaps an official foundation could be founded devoted to this idea. The bankaccount of the foundation could be open to donations as well as supported by a monthly member contribution;
The more members the faster the money count goes up. We could keep raising money untill we've got enough to buy a small island.


Members;
I've been gathering people for this plan and have found some who really want to devote to this, but it's not going very fast.
I realise that there must be a more efficient and faster way of gathering members; Internet.
If someone here is supportive enough of this plan and is skillfull at making websites: It would be nice if this "project" could have it's own Website.
A website where the basic plan is explained clearly, from which donations can be made and from which a member network can be built.

Any interrested webdesigners around?
Untill then, To reel in more people and allign them behind this plan, I will create a special facebook account to gather interrested people.

We'll also need people with good organisatory skills to help found an officioal organisation/foundation to represent this plan.
Anyone willing and able is most appreciated.



I don't care this plan is "impractical" and "unreal" to so many who hear it.
I just need enough people, with enough enthusiasm, devotion and courage, and together we will MAKE it practical and real.
It is my Lifepurpose to found such a place and I will, slowly but surely, unite with those who share my Lifepurpose and realise this plan.

 

[Ellis D'Empty]

SKA, this hits me home. I'm planing on doing it, but on not such a large scale. Just me and my wife living off the land, growing our own food, catching our own fish, hunting our own game. I would very much like to find other like-minded people and start some sort of "community", but as you know it's not that easy.

I'd like to talk to you more about it if your willing. Let me know.

Also, I've kind of started a small forum for info like this... If your interested and we start to talk I can share it.

 

[SKA]

Good to hear you're equally excited about this Ellis D'Empty!
I'd be glad to talk more about this with you. Alot of planning needs to be done.

I'd love to join your forum. I tried starting a little forum about this myself, but didn't make such a good one.
I'm not very good at that kind of stuff. I have alot of ideas I would like to share with you aswell. Ideas for Energy, Watersupply, Foodsupply and sketches of them.

If you, or any of your mates, are good at creating a nice, clear and uniting site regarding this community, that would be a good way to gather the villagers to be.
Give me the link of your forum and I'll join in a heartbeat.

 

[SKA]

Couldn't help digging this old topic back up again.

I'm really determined to realise this dream, come what may.
I'm just very puzzled about how. I am quite the organisational disaster, so help would be much apreciated.
For such a rather large undertaking I need a clear, step by step plan of what is to be arranged & payed.

-First step would be to save up enough money, together with likeminded people.
-Then to form an organisation with these people and start donating money to the organisations bank account(s).
-Set up a contract to agree to common goals/interests for which the money is to be used.
-When enough money has been saved the organisation should buy land with building rights (Or settle on a remote, hardily accesable, nature rich piece of (is)land?)
-Build proper, but cheap houses and public buildings using sandbags, cement & plaster.
-Build fertile cropfields, drip-irrigration tube-systems.
-Buy equipment for Electric plant & Large Seawater destiller.
-Build Community Electricity Plant ( Solar & Wind energy, perhaps combined with my Selfsustaining-Hydrogen engine/Generator as explained in this Topic:
Concept for a Self-Sustaining Hydrogen Engine. - Science - Welcome to the DMT-Nexus )
-Build Ocean-water desalinators. Basically a series of quite large water-destillers; A cylinder-shaped watertank.
Picture a cylindershaped water tank in which oceanwater flows in through a hole near the bottom. This tank has an open top.
Around this tank is a cylindershaped, larger tank with a glass dome on top. This dome could be made into a large magnifying lens.
Solar heat would boil and evaporise the Ocean water, of which droplets of water will re-condense on the inside of the dome and
drip down to the bottom of the larger, outer tank. From there it could be pumped through a series if filters (sand, gravel, pebbles, wiremeshes, Microfilm?)
untill it's clean enough to drink.

With these main steps completed a relatively small human community should be able to live self-sustainably.
The Entheogenic Ceremonies, preparations and cultivation may have to remain underground for now ( unless prohibition-laws
suddenly evaporise or we can set up this community in a "lawless" island/teritorry that is in no nation's national waters.

I'd probably do good "recruiting" some construction-workers, engineers, survivalists, farmers & doctors/medics into my Organisation.
I need to make this step by step-plan more complete & concrete to present to other people I want to involve in this, so some people with organisational skills
better than mine(which can't be very hard) would also be very welcome.

If I'm missing mayor steps please let me know. I'm by no means experienced with buying land, nor raising human settlements.
Help me make this Step by Step-plan complete, conrete and presentable.

 

[MelCat]

Have you seen this?

We're trying to make it a reality.

 

[majesticnature]

This guy has the answer thevenusproject.com