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strychnine
- Thread starter polytrip
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Dwhitty76
Rising Star
I was alway's baffald by the strychnine myth myself,although i am certainly no chemist.
I had friends in the early and mid nineties...when i was taking LSD 2 -3 times a week,for about a yr. and a half. They were having crystal sent from northern california, then they would put it into blotter form.It was usually very clean, although sometimes the doses could have a real mindf*ck "heady trip" and sometimes it was beautifully visual and clear headed.Some of the best LSD i ever took was liquid.
Then there was the doses that were sold on the street (mainly in central park or greenwich village, NY), that was filled with what i assumed was strychnine.I never liked the combonation...it made my muscles cramp, mainly my forearms and calves, and it just didn't have the same feal as the lsd coming from the west coast, although i do know it all had lsd in it.
The other myth that baffald me was the fact that i heard that it was impossible to get pure LSD 25 since the early to mid seventies and i heard the dosage's were much higher then 400 -600 mics per hit :shock:
If Lsd 25 which was the 25th derivative of ergot alkaloid, what was the Lsd that was going around in the nineties? I know it was LSD....i had an intimate relationship with that hallucinogen.
I had friends in the early and mid nineties...when i was taking LSD 2 -3 times a week,for about a yr. and a half. They were having crystal sent from northern california, then they would put it into blotter form.It was usually very clean, although sometimes the doses could have a real mindf*ck "heady trip" and sometimes it was beautifully visual and clear headed.Some of the best LSD i ever took was liquid.
Then there was the doses that were sold on the street (mainly in central park or greenwich village, NY), that was filled with what i assumed was strychnine.I never liked the combonation...it made my muscles cramp, mainly my forearms and calves, and it just didn't have the same feal as the lsd coming from the west coast, although i do know it all had lsd in it.
The other myth that baffald me was the fact that i heard that it was impossible to get pure LSD 25 since the early to mid seventies and i heard the dosage's were much higher then 400 -600 mics per hit :shock:
If Lsd 25 which was the 25th derivative of ergot alkaloid, what was the Lsd that was going around in the nineties? I know it was LSD....i had an intimate relationship with that hallucinogen.
The muscle cramp could have been caused by LSD byproducts.
If you are familiar with the effects of LSA, then you know what i mean.
With very low doses of strychnine, you hardly notice such side-effects. The cramps you only get at higher doses.
If you take LSD more then once a week, during a longer period of time, btw, you are likely to build up significant tolerance to it. It's not the best way to take it. I think once a week is the max.
There are other forms of LSD that can be sold as LSD. Some of them are stronger then LSD-25.
One of them is ETH-LAD. LAD stands for Lysergic Acid Diethylamine.
Wich in german (hofmann was swiss) is LysergSaure Diethylamine. LAD=LSD. It just are different forms of LSD. Often you wouldn't notice the difference.
If you are familiar with the effects of LSA, then you know what i mean.
With very low doses of strychnine, you hardly notice such side-effects. The cramps you only get at higher doses.
If you take LSD more then once a week, during a longer period of time, btw, you are likely to build up significant tolerance to it. It's not the best way to take it. I think once a week is the max.
There are other forms of LSD that can be sold as LSD. Some of them are stronger then LSD-25.
One of them is ETH-LAD. LAD stands for Lysergic Acid Diethylamine.
Wich in german (hofmann was swiss) is LysergSaure Diethylamine. LAD=LSD. It just are different forms of LSD. Often you wouldn't notice the difference.
Dwhitty76
Rising Star
polytrip said:If you take LSD more then once a week, during a longer period of time, btw, you are likely to build up significant tolerance to it. It's not the best way to take it. I think once a week is the max.quote]
I was much older than, i am younger than that now.
- i have heard multiple reports of strychnine causing muscle cramps, but i have never taken strychnine by itself, so i cannot be 100 % sure.....but that was the word on the street back in those day's.
- i haven't taken LSD in probably 14 yrs.....but i absolutuely loved it and alway's had a heafty supply of it.
- I am QUITE interested in ETH-LAD, but i wouldn't even know where to begin to look.I only have access to whatever swim's friend extracts ,mushrooms & molly (and i don't like molly).
Miami is not the most ethneogen friendly place in the world.
69ron
Rising Star
Dwhitty76 said:
I doubt it has anything to do with strychnine. The times SWIM used strychnine with LSD, and more recently with LSH, the effects were nothing short of fantastic. Before strychnine causes convulsive cramping, it normally causes a tight feeling in the head, twitchy facial and neck muscles, stiff muscles, and a tight jaw. These effects indicate a near fatal dose. Acid users would be dropping like flies if they were taking acid with enough strychnine in it to cause convulsive cramping.
Several lysergic acid derivatives are known to cause cramping. HBWR seeds are notorious for causing cramps in the legs. This type of cramping is not life threatening like the convulsive cramps you get from strychnine.
The cramps you get form strychnine are cyclical. They come in waves. Your muscles all cramp up, and then are relaxed for a while, and then all cramp up again, and then relax for a while. It's a different symptom, although somewhat similar to cramping caused by some lysergic acid derivatives.
The cramping caused by some lysergic acid derivatives is not cyclical like those of strychnine and doesn't include the other effects of strychnine: stiff muscles, tight jaw, twitchy facial and neck muscles, tight feeling in the head.
You can know for sure if there isn't strychnine present by the taste of the acid. If there was enough strychnine present to cause any unpleasant effects the taste would be EXTREMELY BITTER. Strychnine is super bitter. Even just 1 microgram of strychnine in a blotter would taste bitter. LSD on blotter is tasteless or sometimes very slightly sour (from the tartaric acid it's usually present with).
For unpleasant effects to be felt from strychnine, you normally need doses of 5-10 mg or more. That amount cannot fit on 1 hit of blotter paper and people often report these "strychnine" effects from as little as 1 hit of blotter paper. It doesn't add up. Also, their blotter usually doesn't taste super bitter. So if your blotter doesn't taste bitter, it's completely impossible for it to have an active dose of strychnine on it.
Here's a very simple strychnine test. Drop 1 hit of acid in 1 cup of water. If there's any strychnine preset at all in active amounts, the entire glass of water will taste very bitter, even just 1 drop of water on your tongue from that cup of water will taste bitter! If the water doesn't taste bitter, there's no strychnine present in active amounts.
Dwhitty76
Rising Star
Ron,
your plethera of knowledge never ceases to amaze me.
The liquid and blotter that was coming from northern cali, never had any taste to it.My friend put some crystal on the end of a toothepick to dose me and i chickened out !!
The "street acid" from NYC, come to think of it....i remeber some bitterness or sensation when placing on the toungue.That acid was dirty.....the blotter wasn't even perferated properly and they were about twice the size of normal sized blotter.
Actually, if anyone was around nyc in the mid nineties probably remembers "the green mosters" or "the orange monsters". They alway's would give nice visuals but you'd would get muscle spasm's and like you said twitching of the jaw.Just dirty acid i guess.
your plethera of knowledge never ceases to amaze me.
The liquid and blotter that was coming from northern cali, never had any taste to it.My friend put some crystal on the end of a toothepick to dose me and i chickened out !!
The "street acid" from NYC, come to think of it....i remeber some bitterness or sensation when placing on the toungue.That acid was dirty.....the blotter wasn't even perferated properly and they were about twice the size of normal sized blotter.
Actually, if anyone was around nyc in the mid nineties probably remembers "the green mosters" or "the orange monsters". They alway's would give nice visuals but you'd would get muscle spasm's and like you said twitching of the jaw.Just dirty acid i guess.
Dwhitty76 said:Chances are that you've already taken ETH-LAD. it's supposed to be three times as strong as LSD so for acid manufacturers it's worth the effort of converting LSD into ETH-LAD. It also has had a semi legal status in some countries for a while.polytrip said:If you take LSD more then once a week, during a longer period of time, btw, you are likely to build up significant tolerance to it. It's not the best way to take it. I think once a week is the max.quote]
I was much older than, i am younger than that now.
- i have heard multiple reports of strychnine causing muscle cramps, but i have never taken strychnine by itself, so i cannot be 100 % sure.....but that was the word on the street back in those day's.
- i haven't taken LSD in probably 14 yrs.....but i absolutuely loved it and alway's had a heafty supply of it.
- I am QUITE interested in ETH-LAD, but i wouldn't even know where to begin to look.I only have access to whatever swim's friend extracts ,mushrooms & molly (and i don't like molly).
Miami is not the most ethneogen friendly place in the world.
Ron is right about the muscle cramps from acid. If you've ever taken LSA seeds you will recognize the effects. Badly made LSD has some effects that are reminiscent to those of LSA seeds.
Besides muscle cramps it makes your body feel as if you've just taken a run, very fast for a while.
69ron
Rising Star
Another "FUN FACT" about strychnine.
Did you know that the human brain naturally contains strychnine! It's believed to be synthesized from tryptophan:
The rest of that article talks about possible medical problems associated with naturally high levels of strychnine.
It’s amazing how many things found in plants are also found naturally in the human brain.
Did you know that the human brain naturally contains strychnine! It's believed to be synthesized from tryptophan:
Ravi Kumar Kurup said:
The rest of that article talks about possible medical problems associated with naturally high levels of strychnine.
It’s amazing how many things found in plants are also found naturally in the human brain.
69ron
Rising Star
Another "FUN FACT" about strychnine all of you smokers will appreciate is that nicotine is just as deadly (some reports say more so) in humans as strychnine is, and yet people smoke tobacco all the time. How strychnine got to be known as a deadly poison and nicotine became one of the world’s favorite addictions is quite fascinating. 60 mg of either strychnine or nicotine is enough to kill most adults.
The adult human LD50 reported for nicotine is the same as strychnine: 1 mg/kg (that comes to 60 mg for a small 132 pound adult).
A typical medical adult oral dose for nicotine is the same as strychnine: 0.5-6 mg. Both are plenty strong enough to fit on blotter paper in active doses, but not deadly doses.
The adult human LD50 reported for nicotine is the same as strychnine: 1 mg/kg (that comes to 60 mg for a small 132 pound adult).
A typical medical adult oral dose for nicotine is the same as strychnine: 0.5-6 mg. Both are plenty strong enough to fit on blotter paper in active doses, but not deadly doses.
Dwhitty76
Rising Star
I thought that nicotine could only cause "instant death" from injesting it orally.Ofcourse there's lung cancer and all, but i was under the belief that you could chain smoke a carton of cigs and be fine (meaning not die).
If you were to soak just a fraction of the amount of tobacco that is in a carton of cigs into water and drink it than you could possibly die from a nicotine overdose.Is that just urban myth?
I forget where i heard this but, apparently one of only a couple of reported deaths that accured after taking ayahuasca was actually a nicotine overdose. Apperently it was an older women.....do curendero's sometimes add mapacho to the brew? I am not sure if this was a just a rumor or not.
If you were to soak just a fraction of the amount of tobacco that is in a carton of cigs into water and drink it than you could possibly die from a nicotine overdose.Is that just urban myth?
I forget where i heard this but, apparently one of only a couple of reported deaths that accured after taking ayahuasca was actually a nicotine overdose. Apperently it was an older women.....do curendero's sometimes add mapacho to the brew? I am not sure if this was a just a rumor or not.
69ron
Rising Star
Another "FUN FACT" about strychnine. It’s use in sports continues even in modern times as a performance enhancer in athletes:
Strychnine is also the NUMBER ONE STIMULANT used in cockfighting. All of the pros swear by it. There’s a tincture available for this purpose called "Dr. Blues Nux Vomica" which nearly all the pros use. I added a pic of it below.
Strychnine is still in use today, but its use is sort of "undercover". It's known only in certain circles and not talked about much.
Strychnine is also the NUMBER ONE STIMULANT used in cockfighting. All of the pros swear by it. There’s a tincture available for this purpose called "Dr. Blues Nux Vomica" which nearly all the pros use. I added a pic of it below.
Strychnine is still in use today, but its use is sort of "undercover". It's known only in certain circles and not talked about much.
Attachments
Dwhitty76
Rising Star
not to convert this into a nicotene thread, but i wanted to confirm the nicotine overdose during an ayahuasca ceremonie...i found the article.
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/dll/ayahuasca_canada.html
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/dll/ayahuasca_canada.html
69ron
Rising Star
The woman who died was elderly and may have been about to die anyway. That ayahuasca healer uses nicotine containing plants in his brew and has treated many hundreds of people without a single death until that one case where he treated many people with the same brew and only one single elderly woman died. I’m not convinced that’s truly a case of nicotine poisoning.
Elderly women in particular are more sensitive to drugs. The lady may have been extra sensitive to nicotine. She apparently didn’t react well to the first two healings and on the third session she died shortly afterwards. It could just be a coincidence. She was old, and perhaps she was going to die anyway and the nicotine didn’t really cause it.
At any rate, nicotine can kill. It’s just as deadly as strychnine with nearly the exact same safe dosage and fatal dosage range as strychnine.
It’s funny how people react to drug names. If you say, “I’m adding strychnine to the ayahuasca”, people will freak out, but if you say, “I’m adding nicotine to the ayahuasca”, people think little of it. Both are just as toxic and have the same safe dosage range, but still people think of strychnine as being poison and nicotine as a drug.
SWIM has personal experience with both nicotine and strychnine. SWIM finds strychnine to be a far more enjoyable drug than nicotine. Strychnine is actually SWIM’s number 1 favorite stimulant. But he would never publicly admit that.
These days strychnine is synonymous with poison. But in the early days, strychnine was considered the most valuable medicine there was. I think too many murder stories used strychnine in their tales and that’s really what caused an end to its use. Once it was seen in the public eye as a poison used to murder people, no one wanted their doctors giving it to them.
Elderly women in particular are more sensitive to drugs. The lady may have been extra sensitive to nicotine. She apparently didn’t react well to the first two healings and on the third session she died shortly afterwards. It could just be a coincidence. She was old, and perhaps she was going to die anyway and the nicotine didn’t really cause it.
At any rate, nicotine can kill. It’s just as deadly as strychnine with nearly the exact same safe dosage and fatal dosage range as strychnine.
It’s funny how people react to drug names. If you say, “I’m adding strychnine to the ayahuasca”, people will freak out, but if you say, “I’m adding nicotine to the ayahuasca”, people think little of it. Both are just as toxic and have the same safe dosage range, but still people think of strychnine as being poison and nicotine as a drug.
SWIM has personal experience with both nicotine and strychnine. SWIM finds strychnine to be a far more enjoyable drug than nicotine. Strychnine is actually SWIM’s number 1 favorite stimulant. But he would never publicly admit that.
These days strychnine is synonymous with poison. But in the early days, strychnine was considered the most valuable medicine there was. I think too many murder stories used strychnine in their tales and that’s really what caused an end to its use. Once it was seen in the public eye as a poison used to murder people, no one wanted their doctors giving it to them.
Kannamate
Rising Star
69ron said:
I think it's because tobacco leaf is lower on the nicotine(the common kind nicotiana tobacum)than nux vomica is of strychnine seeds you said 1 of of them could kill so you have to know extractions well it seems. If somebody told me they're adding pure nicotine I would freak out, a small amount of organic tobacco leaf though not really I would check the amounts though.
69ron
Rising Star
Kannamate said:
No, you're thinking they are small like the typical seed from a plant. Nux vomica seeds are gigantic! They are the size of about 3 large coins stacked together.
1 nux vomica seed weighs up to about 2 grams (1.4 being typical) and has up to 2.7% strychnine with 1.23% being common. 2 grams of the tobacco used for cigarettes contains up to 6.5% nicotine with 3.4% being common.
A 1:1 tincture of tobacco is 2.4 times more lethal than a 1:1 tincture of nux vomica.
By weight, tobacco is up to 2.4 times more poisonous than nux vomica seeds are. Tobacco is definitely a more dangerous herb, as well as extremely addictive and known to cause cancer. Nux vomica seeds are used in China and India for all sorts of medicinal benefits. They are not addictive like tobacco is.
Kannamate
Rising Star
I didn't say they were small btw I worded it I would have thought they were somewhat large like some big yopo seed I had no idea they were that big though.
It seems it would be easier to use a safer dosage of tobacco leaf still since you can use smaller amounts of leaf unless you could cut the seeds easily into little pieces. Does the leaf from the nux vomica tree contains reliable amounts of strychnine?
You said nux vomica feels like LSD and is a an enhancing stimulant used by athletes. How is it both and how long does it last?
It seems it would be easier to use a safer dosage of tobacco leaf still since you can use smaller amounts of leaf unless you could cut the seeds easily into little pieces. Does the leaf from the nux vomica tree contains reliable amounts of strychnine?
You said nux vomica feels like LSD and is a an enhancing stimulant used by athletes. How is it both and how long does it last?
I can think of a few other things that are stimulants like a small dose of acid and a pharmaceutical dose of strychnine: low doses of mescaline and probably some other cactus phenethylamines like lophophorine, low doses of some of the caapi and rue alkaloids, and very low doses of shrooms.
And ofcourse caffeine.
I have no experience with hydergine, nicergoline and cabergoline, but these ergot compounds, also develloped by hofmann, are even solely used for this reason.
Most performance enhancing substances work, without altering counsciousness. You don't feel you are being stimulated, like with acid or strychnine.
But basically the best performance enhancers are anti-oxidants in the right amounts; They prevent the body and brain from aging and support the body and brains natural regenerative system. It is known that fruits and vegetables make you smarter and live longer.
On the short term they also provide the right carbohydrates, and acids like citric acid, wich stimulate metabolism.
And ofcourse caffeine.
I have no experience with hydergine, nicergoline and cabergoline, but these ergot compounds, also develloped by hofmann, are even solely used for this reason.
Most performance enhancing substances work, without altering counsciousness. You don't feel you are being stimulated, like with acid or strychnine.
But basically the best performance enhancers are anti-oxidants in the right amounts; They prevent the body and brain from aging and support the body and brains natural regenerative system. It is known that fruits and vegetables make you smarter and live longer.
On the short term they also provide the right carbohydrates, and acids like citric acid, wich stimulate metabolism.
69ron
Rising Star
Kannamate said:
The entire nux vomica tree contains strychnine. I haven't seen a report of the leaf ever being used though so I can't really comment on that. It may contain other toxins that make it undesirable.
Normally the seed is ground to powder before being used. A small fraction of the seed is used for medicinal purposes. One 2 gram seed contains about 25 milligrams of strychnine on average, but can contain up to about 55 mg. 25 mg of strychnine is enough for 5-50 medical doses (0.5-5 mg) depending on the dose needed.
Kannamate said:
Yes the effects are similar to LSD but without the psychedelic and "mind fuck" effects of it. It has a very similar stimulant effect, it enhances all of your senses (sight, sound, smell, touch) in a way very similar to LSD. But then again it improves memory and concentration. It's a nootropic and powerful stimulant and not a psychedelic. Its effects on the nervous system feel almost "psychedelic" because you see colors brighter, see things sharper, hear sounds with more detail (music is fantastic to listen to on strychnine), all of your senses are revved up just as with LSD. In that way it's very much like LSD and can fool people into thinking they had a small with of acid. It also feels similar to acid, with that excited butterflies feeling of acid, but its not as "electric" or "artificial" feeling as acid can be.
As far as stimulants go, it's more like LSD than any other stimulant. But it's NOT psychedelic, although extremely high doses have cause visual distortions.
The stimulant effects start after about 15-20 minutes and peaks after about 30-60 minutes and then fades from their. The effects last 6-12 hours.
AluminumFoilRobots
gufyg
This thread is one of the few that I have read in its entirety.
bravo, all!
bravo, all!