• Members of the previous forum can retrieve their temporary password here, (login and check your PM).

Taking DMT orally, is 40 mg enough?

Migrated topic.
burnt said:
40mg with full MAOI inhibition floors SWIM. I mean SWIM winds up on the floor crawling around literally. Its too much. I think people have different pharmacokinetics with this substance and would recommend for first timers low dose like 20 mg and work up from there.
Click to expand...

Same for SWIM. 40 mg is nearly too much. I think it's best to start with 20 mg. You have no idea how sensitive you're going to be to it until you try it. If you’re like SWIM and you did 100 mg for your first try, you’ll probably never do it again. SWIM can barely handle 40 mg, and would never ever want to try 100 mg of DMT orally. 40 mg for SWIM is a full dose whether smoked or taken orally. For SWIM the potency of oral and smoked DMT is exactly the same.
 
[/quoteFor SWIM the potency of oral and smoked DMT is exactly the same
wow, ok thats good news.

As for the harmala's, I do strongly suggest just using reduced Caapi tea. It's worked for many hundred, if not thousands of years, AS IS...why mess with something that is already working. If you have pure alkaloids, I get that, but don't extract a perfectly good Caapi tea...well, you can, but I don't see why...that's all.
yeah, i understand the long history of shamanic use with tea alone. and i agree, this may be a great way to ensure full mao inhibition. swim had a couple hundred grams of old vine, and tried an extraction. not too sure how successful he was tho,... if 200mg wasn't enough. swim also has 9 ounces shredded yellow Cielo vine, was saving for aya, but would like to try this again, with mimosa fasw extracted.
how many grams of vine to start, boiled 3 times, and condensed, would it take for full mao inhibition?
Click to expand...
 
lonewolf123 said:
Does anyone have to take over 200mg harmalas to get full inhibition? Trying to figure out what swims doing wrong....
Click to expand...

Yes. Some people actually need 300-400 mg. But that’s rare. It also depends on which harmalas you’re talking about.

Harmaline is the most potent, being about twice as potent as harmine and THH. That means that harmalas extracted from rue which are about 40-60% harmaline are a little more potent then harmalas extracted from caapi which are mostly harmine and THH.

Rather than using dosage information from others, try 200 mg on it’s own. If you can feel 200 mg for sure, then it’s a large enough dose. If you can’t feel 200 mg on it’s own, then try 250, then 300, etc., until you can feel it on it’s own. Once you can feel it, you have enough in your system.

Also, make sure to take the harmalas and the DMT dissolved in a single glass of juice. Don’t take the DMT afterwards. The harmalas need to by in the digestive system along with the DMT in order to be effective. Taking the DMT afterwards is not a good idea. I don’t know how it came to be that people thought of this. The natives NEVER take the DMT afterwards. If you take the DMT after taking the harmalas, some of the harmala protection in the stomach will be lost. The longer you wait to take the DMT, the less effective it is.

There are two levels on which the harmalas work, one is in the stomach to protect the DMT from MAO, and the other is in the brain. Once the effect of the harmalas are noticed, that means they’ve moved out of the stomach and your stomach’s MAO system is getting back to normal. So don’t wait for the effect of the harmalas to be felt. That’s a big mistake. The harmalas are short acting reversible MAOIs. That means when they leave the stomach the stomach quickly regains its MAO functionality. So if you take the DMT after they leave the stomach, the DMT will not be effective.

Anyway, this is how SWIM understands it to work and so he always takes his DMT with the harmalas in juice at the same time. By doing this, he’s able to take much less DMT. It works better for SWIM than waiting and taking the DMT several minutes later. This is also how the natives do it, and I believe they know more about dosing with ayahuasca than anyone else does.
 
MAOs are found in the liver as well as the stomach and brain. Technically pretreating with MAOIs should be fine so long as enough is taken to effectively inhibit these enzymes. The inhibition occurs for several hours. Thus "it" does not "leave the stomache" but a portion stays bound to the MAO on the stomach sells mitochondria inhibiting it. Some of it then goes into the small intestine where absorption occurs into the blood stream where it goes to the liver and inhibits the MAOI there as well. The some is distributed to the brain where it inhibits MAO in the CNS.

Assuming these agents have similar pharmacokinetics properties (especially absorption and distribution) taking them together is fine as 69ron said this is how many native cultures do it with snuff and drinks. However there is nothing wrong with pretreating and many people pretreat with MAOI and still get strong effects. If for example DMT absorbed and distributed before the MAOIs they could not be taken together as much of the DMT would be degraded before the MAOI could occur. However this is obviously not the case.
 
If a Caapi 100:1 extract were used then please offer any corrections to my math here. If I were to simmulate a 50g vine brew then scarfing down .5g of the extract would do the trick (what would be the best method for ingestion) along with 20mg spice chased in OJ (I'm sensitive so I think 20 is enough). Any advice is appreciated.
 
I was thinking of doing 100mg THH, 50mg Harmine/Harmaline, 50mg DMT.

If for the first hour, only drink 1/2 of that mix, would that have enough of the alkaloids to provide for MAOI effect?
Then deciding at an hour if I'd want to finish it. That would cut the THH, and Harmala alkies in half, so I wasn't sure.
 
Is there any correlation between efficacy of smoked DMT and oral DMT in individuals? I know that both can vary hugely, but it would be interesting to find a connection between the two.

If you can post a smoked and an oral dose with perceived equivalent healing potential (when taken with full MAO inhibition), I'd love to look at the numbers.

(I can't provide a dosage pair because I haven't taken oral DMT yet.)
 
SWIM has used freebase twice orally. Both times approx 100mg was placed directly under the tongue and held for at least 30mins. 2 teaspoon ground Rue tea (well filtered) was drunk at least 30mins prior. Effects appeared after after about 20 mins and kept climbing. Total duration was around 5-8 hours. Burned the lining under the tongue intensely but proved to be an effective method of admin. At the time these experiences were the most powerful SWIM had encountered (SWIM had used 50g charuna 3 times prior). SWIM had no nausea at all and aside from an initial fear that he had taken to much it was pure bliss (so much so that he went telling everyone that theres no way someone could have a bad trip on this). In comparison to SWIM's experiences with MHRB 20g doses the overall experience felt 'cleaner', more 'controlled' but not as much OMG!
 
Back
Top Bottom