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Theobroma Cacao 25x

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Delta-9-THC

Delta-9-THC

Rising Star
I read on here that Theobromine potentiates DMT. How does it alter/increase effects? Any idea how much of this is should take? I have 30 grams of the 25x extract. Smells nice and has noticeable effects at ~3+ grams. Mood lift and slight stimulation. Any ideas?
 
be VERY careful about how much dmt you take with it...SWIM took 300mg of 99.5% pure theobromine..with 50mg of THH and 20mg of bufotenine...nothing spectacular happened...so SWIM thought he would finish off the night with some pharmahuasca...he had forgotten about the theobromine...so he took 95 mg of thh hcl...40mg harmaline..and 55mg dmt fumarate..

well its been said that theobromine taken before oral dmt increases its effects by 3-5 times..and its also said it increases harmala alkaloids by 2-3 times...and its also said the larger doses of THH potentiate dmt...

so first the theobromine increased the potency of the dmt up to possibly 300mg...and it increased the THH to possibly 300mg and the harmaline to 120mg...now at 200mg..THH potentiates dmt...so the increase in the THH..increased the potency of the DMT...but the DMT was already potentiated by the theobromine..and thats not even counting the harmaline...so everything kept potentiating everything else...

needless to say ...it was the MOST intense experience SWIM has ever had to make it through...he even tried puking out anything left over in his belly once he realized what he did...

he started tripping harder than he ever has(even smoked dmt) as soon as the brew had hit his stomach..he lost all that he was..he couldnt remember anything..it took about 3 hours of staying calm..and collected...to put his life back together...remembering everything..like breathing..and night and day..girlfriends..and sex...it was intense and scary at the beginning..but he kept a level head and made it through..

so when combining theobromine with oral dmt and harmala alkaloids...make SURE you figure out what the dose will turn into once everything kicks in..because..its not always nice going farther than you think could be safe...
 
Interesting. I have never done any of the huascas. I was more wondering about smoked DMT.

I guess I will just take enough to feel it, then smoke a small dose like 10mg to gauge how much it potentiates it.

Maybe I should just wait till I am a little more experienced with DMT to try and potentiate it. I have only smoked spice about 10x.
 
It's sounds like you have 22% full specturm extract... it's REALLY nice stuff!

The full specturm of compounds is much more "interesting" than the isolated theobromine.
 
i think i remember somebody saying that oral theobromine with smoked dmt actually reduced the visual effects...but everyone is different..and a full spectrum extract may just happen to do something completely different
 
What exactly is the mechanism of action that causes the potentiation? How was it discovered that it potentiates DMT.
 
Delta-9-THC said:
What exactly is the mechanism of action that causes the potentiation?
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It looks like it somehow increases the absorption of dmt when taken orally. From the few reports on this forum, it does not seem to potentiate dmt when it is smoked.

How was it discovered that it potentiates DMT.
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Someone on the aya forum used to eat raw cacao daily and somehow found out that it potentiates the experience. Then someone on this forum found out that theobromine most likely is the culprit. Cacao contains substantial amounts of it, from 1-3% or so.
 
A couple on here have verified, including SWIM that oral theobromine weakens smoked DMT.

When taken orally, theo AFAIK potentiates THH (or any harmala alkaloid) which then potentiates the DMT (freebase or fumarate or other salt form).

SWIM will be doing pharmahuasca tomorrow morning using this recipe. Except he will drink it down in liquid rather than capsules. He won't be using theo yet until he knows what to expect without it:

"With the fumarate, you can make pre-measured pharmahuasca capsules each with 45 mg DMT fumarate, 45 mg THH, 55 mg harmine, and 5 mg harmaline. This would produce an effect identical to authentic ayahusca without all the nausea of ingesting the plant."
 
Nanaki said:
When taken orally, theo AFAIK potentiates THH (or any harmala alkaloid) which then potentiates the DMT (freebase or fumarate or other salt form).
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I don't think that is exactly the case. It may potentiate the maoi part, but that does not mean that it does not potentiate the absorption of the dmt part by itself. For SWIMs girlfriend there is definitely an increase in DMT potency, many times over, and not only because of an increase in maoi potency. I think most of the potentiation of the dmt comes from the theobromine and not only from an increase in MAOI.
 
I have taken Cacao + Pharmauasca and yes it does indeed increase both the intensity and length of the voyage.

I ate about 3 grams of cacao nibs which would have contained maybe 30 mg's thebromine and then took 3 grams syrian rue + 50 mgs of DMT and was tripping for a full day with after effects, buzzing, small tracer visuals and ringing warm vibes and such for at least another full day.

It was a difficult jouney which at the time seemed to last forever but never once lost my nerves or head and at the end of it felt absolutely rebirthed! :)
 
Linga Sarira said:
I have taken Cacao + Pharmauasca and yes it does indeed increase both the intensity and length of the voyage.

I ate about 3 grams of cacao nibs which would have contained maybe 30 mg's thebromine and then took 3 grams syrian rue + 50 mgs of DMT and was tripping for a full day with after effects, buzzing, small tracer visuals and ringing warm vibes and such for at least another full day.

It was a difficult jouney which at the time seemed to last forever but never once lost my nerves or head and at the end of it felt absolutely rebirthed!
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Interesting!
What really strikes me is that you had effects the day after too. Harmine and harmaline shouldn't usually be strong enough to last a full day and then into the next day, certainly not at 3 gram! I wonder what happened here? Did the rue become potentiated many times over?

Half life of harmine should be about 2 hours, the half life of harmaline about 3 hours. If harmaline and harmine peaks after 2 hours, then it should just be about 6% harmaline left in the body after 14 hours. Should not be enough to keep dmt in the body, unless much more of the rue got into the blood stream, which might be possible. I have heard reports of people drinking a lot of coffee, before taking ayahuasca and almost dying from hypotension. Caffeine is in the same family as theobromine.

Linga Sarira, could you elaborate a bit more on your experience? Have you taken the same amount of material before, without the cacao? How did it differ?

Linga Sarira said:
I ate about 3 grams of cacao nibs which would have contained maybe 30 mg's thebromine and then took 3 grams syrian rue + 50 mgs of DMT
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Did you take all 3 at the same time?
 
I had only taken DMT orally once about a week earlier and it was basically the same dose without the Cacao which lasted your typical 6-8hrs but was not very visual but heavy on my body with plenty of purging and mental/ emotional tripping, going through events, analysing life altering decisions, examining my relationships, friends family etc.

I had the idea to try cacao as id seen nibs in my local health food store and had read about jorkest's experience but did alot of searching on the net 1st as to try and get a better experience with the right dose. I had to guess how much theobromine would be in the nibs and found some information somewhere that told me it would be about 1% per gram in cacao nibs and went with that.

I started with the nibs, just ate them raw 3 grams they tasted very bitter and were quite difficult to get down, maybe grinding them up into caps would be easier. I then waited about 10 mins as you know coffee + chocolate doesnt take long to effect you, i felt the cacao stimulation almost immediately then downed the Syrian Rue in caps, just seeds i grinded down in m little coffe grinder. I then waited maybe 20 mins and took the pure white DMT in a cap.

Everything seemed supercharged, I went and layed down on my couch and within minutes felt the vibration and energy enfolding my body, then my consciousness. The "coming on" feeling was very intense but enjoyable sort of like being strapped to a rocket heading for hyperspace, this went on for an hour in which the feeling of needing to get up to purge crept on. I held off until i just had to and getting up from the couch was a exercise in remembering what gravity is and how to counter it with my limbs, i think i crawled to the bathroom, which thankfully is only few meters away.

After violent purging i somehow made it to my bed (it was closer than the couch) and held still through the next wave. The waves were deep and profound each one coming on and climaxing in more violent purging. There couldve been maybe up to 6 or 7 waves and purging sessions. At the peak i recall a huge panoramic vision of a million eyed buddha like entity which ecompassed a vast space and pervaded every pixel of my perception, it was truly awesome and mystical.

The whole journey was all about healing, I declared my respect and thanked the dmt for the experience and went through the spectrum of emotions and had several tearful moments.

Its not something ill be doing any time soon but definately will again when it "feels" right.
 
Ooops ! you actually ate the rue seed .>!? Always make an extract! NEVER eat Syrian Rue seeds, unless you like to puke... every milli-grain back out !!

I did that too, once .. ! I was thinking I'd be ready for it ... !Holey moley did I retch ! The seed coats apparently contain many other alkaloids ... 'abortifactient' ones ... and as I then mused 'puke-ifacient' ones too. !

50 mg of dmt ... and you tripped all day .>!? wow !

Hershey's Cacao is something like 105mg theobromine per tablespoon (5g). And so I drink alot - an estimated 200-300 mg of theobromine in about 3 heaping tablespoons in a mug of hot milk, sweetened by stevia (Chicolin brand oligosaccharides)... Perhaps I need more data to disprove the placebo effect (hot, sweet cacao makes you happy !), but 5 minutes after that, smoking a dmt-mj mix until breakthrough seems to make the entry-part have longer, 'warmer' veils, and the come down is also more 'luscious' .. if that makes sense . The Hyperspace part is always .. inexplicable ... but I met the 'star-children' in their star-craft with cacoa ... my first 'alien spacecraft' or 'alien-abduction' type experience ... And since then I've been quite 'proud' of my own 'star-child' inheritance ... Cacao, or chocolate and dmt just mix perfetly !
 
Theobromin inhibits the enzymes that break down cAMP transmitters, wich is, as i understand it some sort of a 'brain-echo'-system. Just as echo's make sounds seem louder, this 'brain-echo' makes brain signals seem louder. Therefore it's supposed to increase DMT's effects. Cocoa also contains other substances that may have a slight MAOI effect.
 
Just as echo's make sounds seem louder, this 'brain-echo' makes brain signals seem louder. Therefore it's supposed to increase DMT's effects.
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The only problem with that is that it does not seem to potentiate smoked dmt, while oral dmt is potentiated.
 
ElKaBong: ...And so I drink alot - an estimated 200-300 mg of theobromine in about 3 heaping tablespoons in a mug of hot milk.... but 5 minutes after that, smoking a dmt-mj mix until breakthrough seems to make the entry-part have longer, 'warmer' veils, and the come down is also more 'luscious' .. if that makes sense
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Dagger: The only problem with that is that it does not seem to potentiate smoked dmt, while oral dmt is potentiated.
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It seems DMT's effects being potentiated by theobromine is different from person to person & whether its smoked or ingested. Not just with these two examples either but throughout most of what I've read here & elsewhere, the opinion wavers from post to post.

I received a sm/med size sample of theobromine (cacao) with an order from Maya a while back that I've been adding to certain foods & snacks for a little while now. I've not put 3 heaping tablespoons of it into anything but I'll add like a 1/2 a tablespoon to a cup of yogurt, or something like that. I've been doing this a couple of times a day now for about 2-3 weeks.
I've really been digging the anti-depressive effects & the alertness/awareness it provides, like a small cup of coffee, without the jitters or caffeine crash.
I like it because it's nice & in the background, It's definitely not enough to make me feel high, it's effects are more subtle than that. Its more like a good day, or at least a good attitude towards things, which I don't always have when life starts piling up.
I'll be purchasing more with my next Maya order!

I am wondering though, if my adding a small amount of theobromine to my daily diet, will positively or negatively effect my next smoked DMT experience. Which will be within the next few days, I've just finished a new extraction & I'm waiting for the right time to sample it.
(also just got a new Vaporgenie, so I'm excited to try that too!)

Does anyone know how long theobromine stays in the body?
If the Cacao has a negative effect on smoked DMT for me, how long will I need to stop adding it to my diet, in order to clear it out of my system, when I've been eating a small amount with food, everyday for 2-3 weeks?

Haven't been around here much for a few months (our world just gets in the way of life sometimes, ya know), its amazing how much has changed/progressed/multiplied etc..., within this tiny subculture in just that short time!!
So many new members too!!


Cheers!!

WS
 
warrensaged said:
It seems DMT's effects being potentiated by theobromine is different from person to person & whether its smoked or ingested. Not just with these two examples either but throughout most of what I've read here & elsewhere, the opinion wavers from post to post.
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I have not seen any reports of big potentiations with smoked dmt. It may just change it somewhat, while orally the potentiation might be huge.

Just ordered some raw cacao nibs. I will try it out with caapi only and determine if there is any potentiation and by how much. Will also experiment some with cacao+dmt, just to see if it could make it active by itself.
 
Jorkest said:
be VERY careful about how much dmt you take with it...SWIM took 300mg of 99.5% pure theobromine..with 50mg of THH and 20mg of bufotenine...nothing spectacular happened...so SWIM thought he would finish off the night with some pharmahuasca...he had forgotten about the theobromine...so he took 95 mg of thh hcl...40mg harmaline..and 55mg dmt fumarate..

well its been said that theobromine taken before oral dmt increases its effects by 3-5 times..and its also said it increases harmala alkaloids by 2-3 times...and its also said the larger doses of THH potentiate dmt...

so first the theobromine increased the potency of the dmt up to possibly 300mg...and it increased the THH to possibly 300mg and the harmaline to 120mg...now at 200mg..THH potentiates dmt...so the increase in the THH..increased the potency of the DMT...but the DMT was already potentiated by the theobromine..and thats not even counting the harmaline...so everything kept potentiating everything else...

needless to say ...it was the MOST intense experience SWIM has ever had to make it through...he even tried puking out anything left over in his belly once he realized what he did...

he started tripping harder than he ever has(even smoked dmt) as soon as the brew had hit his stomach..he lost all that he was..he couldnt remember anything..it took about 3 hours of staying calm..and collected...to put his life back together...remembering everything..like breathing..and night and day..girlfriends..and sex...it was intense and scary at the beginning..but he kept a level head and made it through..

so when combining theobromine with oral dmt and harmala alkaloids...make SURE you figure out what the dose will turn into once everything kicks in..because..its not always nice going farther than you think could be safe...
Click to expand...


Dude.... your a soldier. My god!!
 
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