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THH+Mushrooms

Migrated topic.
i have yet to try it.. trying to locate some mushies as usual without much luck.. i am very tempted to cultivate, but am sooo space limited.. i only have my bedroom to work with so i would need to do a tubberware container deal.. i havent done enough research to try anything yet but have been reading here and there..

good tip on the datura seeds i ordered some up... i love lucid dreaming.. and who wouldnt want their mescaline potentiated :D

as an aside... 5-htp seems to greatly enhance mescaline
 
69ron said:
970Codfert said:
SWIM has wanted to try the passion flower LSD combo for a while but the LSD has disappeared. SWIM dislikes the "electric feel" of LSD as well in higher doses.

would THH or rue extract help with nausea that accompanies mushrooms at all?

SWIM experiences extreme nausea with mushrooms... SWIM is not new to mushrooms and it happens almost every single time he takes them, no matter how he takes them (he's tried everything). He knows it is very common to have nausea, even horrible nausea, but sometimes it is absolutely unbearable and produces a really unpleasant trip. Is there a strain SWIM could grow that are notoriously gentle on the stomach? Any suggestions would be great because SWIM really enjoys the mushroom trip!
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1-2 Datura stramonium seeds should completely block the nausea, but it might also make the trip stronger. SWIM tried 3 seeds with 74 mg of mescaline (isolated from San Pedro) and it made the trip much more psychedelic. 2 seeds were enough to completely block the nausea from 100 mg of bufotenine taken orally (oral bufotenine always causes nausea), so I'm sure it will block the nausea from mushrooms too. But only take 1-3 seeds and no more than that. You should never take more than 10 seeds in a day to be on the safe side (26 is the maximum safe dosage).
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Thank you so much ron!! SWIM knows of at least 3 Datura stramonium plants growing in front yards near his home. How wonderful!!!

SWIM would have never guessed Datura would have so many uses... but considering how powerful of a substance it is, SWIM is not surprised. SWIM can't wait to see what that does the mushrooms, should he take less with the datura seeds?
 
69ron said:
psychosisdoses said:
as an aside... 5-htp seems to greatly enhance mescaline
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Do you take it at the same time or pre-dose?
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took it since monday 100mg 3 times a day
dosed some 200mg waxy tan acetate extract of sanpedro with 200mg 5htp...
felt zero tolerance to the dose and it was more euphoric and blissful then normal
some 12 hours in to the trip 7 hours since redose.. still rising?
 
970Codfert said:
SWIM would have never guessed Datura would have so many uses... but considering how powerful of a substance it is, SWIM is not surprised. SWIM can't wait to see what that does the mushrooms, should he take less with the datura seeds?
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Remember, never take more than 10 in one day. 1-3 seeds should be enough if they are good seeds. 26 seeds is the maximum safe dose for potent seeds.

Note that I'm talking about Datura stramonium seeds exclusively here. The amount of alkaloids present in other Datura can be quite different.

Probably he should take less mushrooms. I would say maybe 1/2 the usual amount. When SWIM took 3 Datura stramonium seeds with 74 mg of mescaline, it seemed to almost double the effects, but in ways that were not expected. It altered the experience making it a new experience. There where psychedelic and visual effects with a character not normally present in a mescaline trip. I would expect something similar with mushrooms, but probably not as dramatic as with mescaline.

When SWIM used 2 seeds to block the nausea from 100 mg of bufotenine taken orally, the enhancement was there but not nearly as dramatic as with mescaline, but then again he took 2 and not 3 seeds, so that may have something to do with it, but I doubt it. I expect only slight enhancements with mushrooms, but I'm sure it will cause complete blockage of the nausea.

Let me know how it goes!
 
SWIM will make sure to report back, thank you so much! SWIM is really excited to have a mushroom experience that isn't accompanied by multiple nightmarish vomiting episodes... oh god...
 
Harmala tea boosts OEV for swim. Pure THH would be interesting to try, but swim has an access only to harmine/harmaline. will it work as well?
 
SWIM took about 35mg of pure THH sublingually 40 minutes after ingesting 3.5grams of mushrooms.
It seemed to add an amazing touch to the experience. The visuals were very DMT like, more so than any of the 40 or 50 other mushroom trips SWIM has had. He had a really awesome trip, and said he can't wait to try the THH with some LSD!
 
Yetserday SWIM took 40mg of THH subligual, and then proceede to drink his mushroom tea, which consisited of 3.5g of dried ground up redboys.
Within half an hour he could feel it. Then within an hour he was feelin very sleepy, yawning alot and finding it hard to concentrate on the tv.
There were some nice mild visuals and threshold giggles, but was fighting the nausea pretty hard. After about an hr and a half, he had to spew, couldnt fight it any longer. Needless to say that after this the nausea still continued. He shall try some ginger next time.
Anyway, obviouisly after the barfing it didnt last as long as he would of liked and was only feeling a little funnt after 3hrs
 
I took .3 rue extract and 5 grams of some mostly dry cubes and smoked a little dmt, This was a great experince for the beginning very visual and defined then my mind kinda snaped and freeked out a little and broke some stuff in my house. then i calmed myself down and layed down and had a what seemed like a 3 hour peek that was very scary!! My mind got caught in a loop that i did not like. That is one thang i donot like about this combo is your mind can get in a loop and repeat thangs over and over again I have had this happen before but not quit like this. It was the very best and worst experience in my life. I doesed at 5pm and stayed up all night and the next day. I have great peace now!! something killed the little voice in my head that tells me you are "not good enuf" very positive thoughts now! I dont know if i need to trip for allittle while so i can meditate on what happend.
 
69ron said:
Yeah, that's the theory anyway. SWIM says it works, but there's no proof to back it up. Psilocin causes less side effects than psilocybin, so it's always preferred.
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I disagree. I find Psilocybin much more enjoyable than Psilocin. The body effects of Psilocybin is absolutely amazing, while Psilocin has little to no body effects. This is the reason I think P. semilanceata is many times better than P. cubensis.

I have never ever experienced nausea from any Psiloc(yb)in mushrooms or pure Psilocin, so it is hard for me to know if Psilocybin is the bad one when it comes to nausea. You could always put your mushrooms in an acidic solution, like lemon juice, to convert the Psilocybin to Psilocin. However, that will make your trip shorter and more intense, as the body will not need to convert the Psilocybin.
 
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Evening Glory, 69ron...Swim has done 'shrooms before dozens of times. His doses have ranged from small to low. (bit of a wuss). He has full blown tripped twice on half a small cap. Serious cheap date. Okay. My question is...

I always thought that 'shrooms were all psylocybin and that all psylocybin was changed in the gut to psylocin, where 'cybin is not active and 'cin is...

Then what is the diff? You have both mentioned body load and side effects...

So..Do different mushies have diff alkaloid profiles? Swim had only tries cubies...




I would love to be cleared up in this area. As well as specifics about what each of your side effects are...

Thanks...


J
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All of the mushrooms SWIM has tried have very distinctly different effects. You could tell most of them apart blindfolded by their distinct effects.

Most mushrooms contain psilocybin and psilocin as their main alkaloids by weight, but that’s not to say that psilocybin and psilocin are the main active alkaloids in all psilocybin mushrooms. It may very well be that some of the other alkaloids present are stronger than psilocybin or psilocin.

Psilocybe azurescens has an effect very unlike psilocin or psilocybin. Its far more like DMT and can easily give you a DMT-like breakthrough experience if enough is taken. This mushroom has substantial amounts of baeocystin (up to 0.4%), nearly equal to the psilocin content (up to 0.5%), while being mostly psilocybin (up to 1.8%). This alkaloid ratio is higher in baeocystin that most other mushrooms. This mushroom is considered the most psychedelic and most visual of them all.

Different ratios of psilocin to psilocybin can also have an impact on the experience. Psilocybe cyanescens has a higher psilocin to psilocybin ratio than Psilocybe cubensis. Their effects are quite noticeably different from each other. Psilocybe cyanescens produces a cleaner more LSD-like effect and has much less body load than Psilocybe cubensis. Most mushrooms with a higher psilocin to psilocybin content have less body load. This is to be expected. Psilocybin is NOT psychoactive at all and produces only bodily symptoms. It’s not until it’s converted in the human body into psilocin that it’s able to have psychoactive effects. That conversion takes more time than people realize. By the time it’s converted to psilocin, it’s already produced dramatic effects in the body. Psilocin is immediately psychoactive. It passes directly into the brain without any delay.

So while it’s true that psilocybin eventually converts to psilocin in the body, it’s also true that this conversion takes time, and before it’s complete a lot of the psilocybin has already been absorbed as psilocybin and has made it to many 5-HT sites in the stomach. This is why it produces far more side effects than psilocin.

It’s been erroneously reported many times that psilocybin has effects identical to that of psilocin. This is most certainly impossible. When psilocybin is taken orally, some is always absorbed before being fully digested. It can be absorbed through the flesh in the mount, the throat, and many other places before being converted to psilocin. This is true for nearly all drugs. By the time it makes it to the point where it’s converted to psilocin, quite a bit has already entered the blood stream. So it is impossible for the effects of psilocin and psilocybin to be identical. They have different rates of absorption, and some of the psilocybin passes into the blood as psilocybin by bypassing the digestive system and effects the body as psilocybin, and some enters the blood as psilocin after it’s fully digested. The amount that enters as psilocin is dependant on many factors and will vary from person to person and from day to day. This is a fact for most of these kinds of drugs.
 
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Wow..

Thanks 69ron, for the clarification. All of that is very helpful. I have only ever tried cubies. Looking forward to philosophers stones.

Thanks for such lucid answers,

Peace,

J
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SWIM did another experiment combining 35mg sublingual THH with 2g of thai cubensis. It was easily the most visual mushroom trip of his life, having around 50 prior mushroom experiences under his belt. He normally prefers to take 3.5g+, and was pleasantly surprised by how good these mushrooms were. The THH escalates the visuals of a normal trip to a DMT-like level. Elaborate visions become possible. The hallucinations are SO similar to that of DMT. It's so wonderful! SWIM told me he doesn't think he will ever eat mushrooms without THH, or at the very least some rue, ever again!
 
Psilocybin is converted to psilocin within the body by phosphatases in the liver [Horita, A. and L.J. Weber. "Dephosphorylation of psilocybin to psilocin by alkaline phosphatase." Proceedings of the Society for Experimental Biology 106(1): 32-33 (1961)]. Some may also occur under acidic conditions like the stomach.

Thus a significant portion is likely absorbed prior to being converted to psilocin. A great majority of this metabolism likely takes place during the first pass effect ( first pass metabolism) and thus most is rapidly converted to psilocin prior to distribution. (Blood from digestive tract can NOT by pass the liver). Many people have said that psilocybin and psilocin have quite similar effects (Shulgin said they are indiscriminate). Although due to the different pharmacokinetic properties they may have some differences. Certain individuals may likewise have metabolic phenotypes that makes them have drastically different responses to psilocybin and psilocin (such as differences in expression of phosphatases). I have not seen any evidence that said that psilocybin is responsible for the adverse effects that some people exhibit from mushrooms. Where was this data obtained from? It is just as likely that some of the other alkaloids such as baeocystin and norbaeocystin are (or even psilocin) responsible in susceptible individuals.

I also agree that diff mushrooms have consistently unique effects. More research needs to be performed on the other alkaloids present. Another possibility is that the matrix (ie the mushroom material) that the alkaloids are embedded in my influence absorption and thus peak plasma levels.
Some mushroom have non-psychoactive components such as serotonin. These may also influence the pharmacokinetics and subjective effects of the mushroom strain.
 
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