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To drop-out, or not to drop-out, that is the question

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warrensaged said:
One last piece of advice for you, trying to do everything;
write & perform the music,
produce the album,
engineer the recording & mixing,
mastering the songs into a CD & duplication,
advertising & selling CD & other chachkees,
touring & shows...etc...does not usually equal a great end result.
Having different people involved, with their individual ideas & input, is what makes a legendary album, that resonates deeply with a large number of people!!
It is very hard to fully immerse yourself in the creative songwriting process and also be objective enough to make a fully realized recording. And the reverse is the same to.
I got into recording so I could record my band, we got to the point of doing independent CD's & tours, we were in meetings with some smaller record company's & one of the guy's wigged out & it all fell apart...classic story.
So I started doing it all myself, the music was alright, not great, but alright. the recording at that time were shit (I was just getting started)!!
Soon, I started trying to record every idea I had.
I would get a idea for a piece of music, or a whole song, I'd start getting a tone on the recording....an hour later I had a great sounds guitar, but the song had fluttered away into the ether...

These are the standards that the recording industry has set, making the production of music into something that requires a well-trained team of technicians and engineers. Not that it doesn't have its value; for example, this is integral for adequately recording classical music. The problem is that when people get accustomed to such methods for pop music (not speaking of the genre, but the whole array music outside of, say, jazz and classical), they tend to feel locked out of the whole art-form by social and material limitations. This isn't necessary, and the plethora of artist I've noticed popping up out of the decline of the industry illustrates this wonderfully.

The music I've been listening to lately has obvious technical constraints in their recording methods, yet the fact that they release them indicates their willingness to adapt to those constraints and use the distortion as a necessary desirable aspect of their work. Their work has inspired me greatly and has eased all of the anxieties preventing me from expressing myself musically. Bob Dylan made everyone feel like they could pick up a guitar and hit the road, which they could and still can, but they needed him to help them realize that. Punk made everyone realize that they could start a band and play rock and roll and relate to their peers on a level that was never before possible in pop music. When Daniel Johnston released his first album, he made and recorded every tape he distributed from scratch, by himself. The new bands have taken all of this to the next level.

When I come up with a new song, I can immediately record it satisfactorily because of the minimalistic nature of my recording setup and the way that I've adapted to it. If some comes over wanting to record, we can immediately get right to it, getting our levels in an amount of minutes. Certainly, my music isn't on the level of obtaining a large listener base yet, but if my influences are of any indication, it's on it's way.

I say this is the era to liberate music from industry.
 
SWIM has a nice fat student loan to pay off...
he dropped out of college at the end of his junior year and became initiated as a shaman with ayahausca and sanpedro among other medicines... he did healing for 3 years straight, nearly living on the streets and eating from the food bank... oh swim worked... but he gave everything away to help others... so there was little left but tobacco and prayer at the end of the day... maybe a beer. :twisted:
Swims peirs still call him the top ramen shaman because of that... which is kinda an honor in a way... they presented him with a rattle made out of a tums bottle on a cedar stick with top ramen in it... freinds like that eh... hehehheh...
when swims married home owning ceremonial freind called him the street shaman one nigth in ceremony and swims heart seized up... swim knew that it was time to try finding a way to work a tad bit harder at doing the good work in ways that helped him thrive... the more swim had the more swim could give he thought...

So... swim stayed out of school and started working with developmentally disabled sex offenders... terrible job... but some one has to protect people from these guys... swim still did some ceremonies but focused on writing and teaching more on the side...
then swim after 3 years worked in a involuntary psyche ward... having to wrestle people into restraints and try hsi best to actually help people when no one was looking... swim did not beleive inthe system but was trying his best to help people...
in the mean while swim was no longer doing many ceremonies... swim was getting wounded at work... swim was hurt a lot by trying to help people in this way... but swim was still in dept with student loans...
SWIM decided to finnish college and study ways of helping the world so that society didnt possibly need psyce wards any more...
swim studied permaculture and natural building, local food systems and continued to teach people and do ceremonies on the side... while still working 40hours a week in a psyceh ward... swim was a hurting unit...
swim graduated from college after workign with some of the most amazing people in the feild of alternative living... and went and lived on an island building straw bale houses for lower income families on a fully sustianable land trust...
that was good... but it put swim in the hole... money wise...
swim moved back to his town and got a job at the psyche ward again this time only on call...
the recession had hit hard... and swim was fucked...
swim held out and held the intention to do good work int he world...
swim found a new job working for one of the most amazing people in the world... orld famous for helping the planet... SWIM has for the first time felt he has a job that is really helping the world and swim... the balance is there FINALLY!!!
there is nothing to drop out for now for swim... swim did a healing ceremony the other night just as powerful as when he was the the street shaman and hes living well and feeling heal their and healing the truamas of working in a psyche ward for 4 years...


here is the thing COMMIT your life to humble service... pay your dues, have some faith.. say your prayers give your self as an offering to benifit the whole and have some fucking grace and dignity in the process... you will be put exactly where you are needed in life to help and life will help you... the more you dedicate yourself to selfless service the more life will give to you to help... you live a life of payer and offering... and you will be blessed in ways that include hardships AND joy...

swim does nto see it now... but swim knows that swim will get that peice of property... and that ceremonial hut made of cob and straw bales for his ceremonies withthe medicine... and swim will be able to live off grid and help the world by working his unholy living ass off...
while making a lower impact as well... he knows this.. because hes a sevent of the whole and he holds the intention of all that is in his heart.
 
"Into the Wild"
A facinating true story. But extreme... I wasn't thinking of going sole-hunter-gatherer!
A good reminder of the hazards of misidentification... which is what ended his adventure.
Of course other people do things like this and don't end up dead. And he went far further than necessary.
 
Really? You mean because of when he spoke about god on the mountaintop with the old man? I assumed from that that he was a transcendentalist, believing that everything was 'god' like some of use here do. And when he died with a smile on his face, I assumed that was the relief of someone in intense pain embracing death. I imagine that the note on the floor was really there in real life because it's meant to be pretty close to the truth. But yeah, it did go a bit flat once he was in the wilderness.
I just can't believe he didn't do the tests that you're meant to do to check a plant is edible (I'll type them up one day, out of my SAS survival book!).
Sad, because from his photo he looked like a real dude. And yeah he did some cool stuff, I liked the beach scene with the rubbertramps, and Slab City. Although he really should've given that 16 year old chick what she wanted!
That old guy with the painted mud mountain is for real, I've seen him on a programme about outsider art before.
 
ohayoco said:
Really? You mean because of when he spoke about god on the mountaintop with the old man? I assumed from that that he was a transcendentalist, believing that everything was 'god' like some of use here do. And when he died with a smile on his face, I assumed that was the relief of someone in intense pain embracing death. I imagine that the note on the floor was really there in real life because it's meant to be pretty close to the truth. But yeah, it did go a bit flat once he was in the wilderness.

Certainly he seemed to be rather transcendentalist, but the end seemed as more of a last-ditch and not so characteristic of a transcendentalist. Maybe I'll have to watch it again and read the book to confirm this, but I remember that as being my immediate reaction. I too once dabbled in transcendentalism (not in 'nam of course :lol: ), so it's not likely I would have felt such disappointment if it seemed truly characteristic of that sentiment.
 
I felt like the stuff he did on the way to alaska was cool and the people he met were great. But when he got there he was unprepared and not very careful. He should have been able to identify that plant, but he was rushing through what he was doing.
 
The book is a great read for those who haven't read it yet. I enjoyed it even more than the movie. It details much more than just Mr. Supertramp's journey.
 
I enjoyed dropping out but also enjoyed dropping back in, but I'm about to reach that place where dropping out may be in the works again. I'm older than dirt and pretty warn down by recent events. Seems like the economy is always throwing up roadblocks or the political situation changes or something unpleasant happens at work that just knocks me sideways. I work in education in a state that's going bankrupt and racial tensions are high due to recent changes in the law. Yep, I'm in Arizona, which is on a fast track to becoming a police state.
I just gave up loving Idaho because the winters are hard on my old bones, but I think I may have to divorce my love of the desert, or move over a state or two to be able to relax.

When I was young, no one ever questioned authority. The world was made of vanilla pudding and Howdy Doody. (Most of you won't get the reference to a cowboy puppet who hosted a cartoon show on early television). All a kid had to do was get up, go to school, pay attention in class, and wait for the final bell so you could go to a home where Mom in the kitchen and cokkies were waiting for you and your friends after an afternoon of play. Well, at least that's how they advertised life back then. And I believed it all the way through to high school, where I had to decide which college to go to (it was expected) and how I would spend the rest of my life (you pretty much stuck with whatever, back then). They gave us all some kind of test which was suppossed to help us choose the proper career. Mine came back "forrest ranger" which did not go over well at home. My parents decided "teacher" so that's what I went for. Art teacher, because I liked art but didn't seem to be very good at it. Not professional quality, anyway. So I went off to college thinking I was going to fit into some mediocre career track, and that was ok with me.

Then I actually got to college, across the bay from San Francisco. I arrived in the summer of 1968 (which, perhaps some will recognize as the Summer of Love) and suddenly the world fell apart like sand escaping under my feet at the ocean's edge.

Sex. Drugs. Rock and Roll...and not necessarily in that order. There was no order. It was suddenly EVERYTHING all at once. Suddenly, this stodgy middle class middle of the roader was spinning in the center of a new universe, located in Golden Gate Park.

There was a bumper sticker that explained everything: "Question Authority". Me? I never questioned anything. I never went out drinking in high school. I never stayed out all night or made my parents mad. I never consciously did anything I wasn't suppossed to do. Suddenly I was in the middle of choices I had no previous experience in even considering, much less making.

Oh, yeah. I dropped out. But only in my mind. I stuck it out and got my degree and my first real job. I was miserable at teaching. School had always been easy for me, so I had no idea how to get knowledge into students who were struggling. I had all kinds of institutionalize prejudices I had to work through, like being sarcastic about people in poverty (why didn't they just get a job?) or being cold about folks in trouble (tv sets in jail? we should treat prisoners like, well, prisoners!) Exposure to the hippies showed my I needed to question everything, but that didn't mean it was easy!

And, then, as time went by, I could see the Flower Power generation wilting around me. Pot was being badmouthed as a "doorway to the harder stuff", and although it never did that for me, I certainly watched way too many of my friends go down on heroin. It was like the dark side came in and took the flower children by surprize. It was all happy, and then it was miserable. I think the mob walked in, saw a bunch of stoners with no focus, and merchandized the lot of them into heroin addicts overnight. You like that stuff? You'll LOVE this stuff!

A rather perceptive and cool dude named Steven saw this comming, bought a bunch of old school busses and dragged a large portion of the street scene with him to the Appalachas to live in a commune. It was so successful they eventually operated their own "peace corp" sending folks to developing countries all over the world, training midwifes and carpenters, etc. There was a write up in National Geographic like ten years later. But that was only one of thousands that tried and failed.

I tried it with a group of friends still connected to the university...some grad students, some like me already employed. What I saw was families developing and as soon as the kids got to be school age, folks saw the need to drop back in, to support their families, and also...the kids got to the age when they could inadvertantly turn their parents in. So, the differences in morals and politics tore the communal relationships apart. Turn on, tune in, drop out became Get Real, get motivated, Get a Job.

I got a job.

But I couldn't stand it. So I moved out of the city and into the wilderness, bent on living off the land. I nearly starved to death. I got another job. I had more time to myself. I could continue to study meditation, to develop metaphysical skills with and without drugs. I went nuts for awhile, in the classical "wounded healer" trip. I made spiritual connections with the Otherside. I got stronger. I discovered I could heal in a variety of ways. It didn't feel right to charge for it, though. So I was torn. Stay in the wilderness, move to town, or go back, all the way back, to civilization. I tried all three, eventually going back to the Real World due to an eminent need for medical insurance (I needed surgery and I didn't want to owe anybody anything)

By this time, I had to go back to school to learn about computers in the classroom if I wanted to continue teaching (the only thing I had ever been trained to do). I enrolled in grad school, found a program called "Art Therapy" and, BOOM. Suddenly I recognized this made so much sense. I spent the next six years training to become a Real World therapist while also keeping up with my Alternative Medicine roots. Therapists are the new shamen. I fit right in. But then, I started actually working as one. The mental illness industry sucks. There's always this uppity psychiatrist with all sorts of his own issues dictating what I can or can't do. There's people trained in old school ways who disrespect new ideas. There's paperwork and policies and...me, who just wanted to help some people.

So I went back to teaching, only now in Special Ed. This allows me to be there, helping kids with emotional problems, very discretely doing whatever I can slip in to help them deal with their vibes. I cannot advocate drugs, but I can help them deal with their addictions in terms they understand, helping them understand, showing them spiritually uplifting takes on puzzline situations. But, of course, this is a difficult dance.

Looking back, I am challenging some of what the Baby Boomers did when we broke free from authority and I'm critical about a lot of long-term effects we didn't see (and should have). For instance, "free love" is cool if you're a male (translates to "free sex") but it's spiritually demeaning for most women (who are preprogrammed to love and be loved or be miserable). Being stoned was a necessary transition from knothead to enlightened seeker, but we smoked way too much and neglected our kids a lot. Those kids! Free love produced a lot of kids...birth control was just beginning to be available but felt wrong, like another form of control...so a lot of kids were born to folks who were going through a second childhood themselves. Not the best parent material. (I later counseled many of these kids, and I know it was rough on them)

We questioned authority and we broke it down. There was a time when violence and bad language was banned from movies and tv. What have we gained by allowing it? What government control program has allowed our unsupervised children (parents have to work and aren't able to watch what their kids do...and end up not paying attention) to nurse themselves into adulthood with violent video games as the underlying foundation for "what to do when something happens". Yes, we know the games aren't real, but we build our emotional reactions and our internal belief system based on things we do over and over again. Playing violent games may not push you into violent behavior, but it will curdle your through processes, making you restless for peace, but no longer believing peace is possible. It sours you on life, in a strange way.

So...a product of your times, you get into spice and WOW, there is more to life! You suddenly get the urge to go hug a tree, to move back to the land, to eat fresh homemade bread and grow your own vegetables. Yes! Those are all great things! But don't forget: you can buy a breadmaker at Walmart, you can shop at the local farmer's market, you can visit trees on your vacation, or move near a park. You don't have to quit your job and go build a new life in unfamiliar territories, where you have no skils and face perils you have no idea are out there.

Start, instead, by building a new life right where you are. Practice all the urges you are feeling, drawing in your friends and family. Go vegetarian. Be an example. See what it's like to nourish yourself with complete proteins, figure out what works and what doesn't while you have your present support system in place. Work with a community garden and find out how difficult it is to grow vegetables, enough, anyway, to feed yourself and your family for a whole year. Study on these things...Remember, 50 or 100 years ago, people lived off the land all over the world. And what did they do? They invented ways to get as far away from it as they could! It was back-breaking work, long hours, no pay. The only truly successful hippies were the trust-fund babies or the ones who wrote books or had some kind of home business who didn't have to work in the real world. And a lot of them ended up back in the cities as urban warriors, fighting the system from the inside.

Ok, so I said I'm about to drop out again. I hate to end of a dour note, but I began on one, so here it goes. I am about to qualify for social security. This is not something I have been looking forward to. I have led an on-again/off-again semi-alternative life style for years and haven't paid into it much. So, if I decide to take it, I will have to cut way back in my already meager lifestyle, which means I won't be able to pay the taxes on my land in the wilderness (my original hippie homestead has been invaded by upscale vacation homes so the taxes are horrible). Nobody's buying anything, so if I drop out before it sells, I may lose it to back taxes. If I wait to drop out until the property sells, I may go crazy trying to hang on in a world that makes less and less sense. Until I sell it, I have no way to start up anywhere else. In a life that has been full of interesting choices and continual movement, I am suddenly becalmed. I don't like it much.

So I am hamstrung by the realestate market, by "down turns" in the economy, at the other end of that long and winding road, ready for that cave to retreat to, but there is no cave.
My mind is clear but my heart is tired. I feel like Forest Gump...I have seen it all...but my shrimp boat never came in, and now there's this huge oil slick headed my way....(sheesh. good analogy) But oh well. A couple of deep sighs. A set jaw relaxing, a calm tone to concentrate on, some deep body yawns...a little drumming rhythm gets started...my feet begin to move, a smile starts to break through...Oh, what the heck. Life is beautiful. Something will turn up!

Light and love,
Chal
 
Chal, that was a great story. As the child of hippies, I can attest that the "peace, light and love" generation had good intentions, but were overly self-involved, and sadly, their kids paid for it. I am more fortunate than most, in that my parents at some point realized how self-indulgent dropping out can be when you have children being neglected or raised in unsafe and unstable environments paying the price so you can "find yourself" or whatever.

With that said, there is nothing wrong with seeking enlightenment, leaving the rat-race, finding yourself, or any of that. It's a hierarchy of values thing. You can still meet your moral and social obligations, and do those good things - you can't just do bad things in order to get good things, and expect a good result. That, at least, is the balance I am striving for - to be able to drop out, and still support my wife and children in a stable environment. For now, that means having to work a job during the day, as I build an online business at night. I made this choice 15 months ago, and am almost to the point where I can quit the day job and do what I love for the rest of my life, yet still meet my obligations.

I want to have the best of both worlds, and so am building the means to drop out, yet not starve nor put my family through hardship. The desire for freedom powerfully motivates me, yet it is freedom with responsibility, not freedom from responsibility. For me, the boat I am building out of the rat-race is an online publishing business. It's already more than profitable enough to support a single or couple, but I have four kids as well, and want to pay for their college, so a certain level of income is required.

The great thing about publishing is that you can write about things that interest you, or hire others to do so. Once the "bread-and-butter" part of my business is sufficient to support a family of 6, my next project will be an adventure-travel website; this will allow me to travel, have adventure, write about it, and get paid for it via business deals with adventure-travel companies that I will give reviews on, advertising, sales of books and gear, etc. And I can do the same thing with many of my other interests.

The big thing is that having an online business gives me freedom to live where I want to live, do work I enjoy (was able to quit a high-paying day job I hated for a much lower paying job), spend time with my family, and eventually move off-grid into a home powered by solar, wind and micro-hydro, grow our own food, and be as independent as possible.

So I guess my take is - Drop out, but do so responsibly 8)
 
going back to school was great for me, but i needed 12 years off to realize it was what i wanted to do.

if you're not sure about school. if you feel like you're just wasting time there then leave. if you have a goal, or purpose in mind already, then finish what you started.

either way be engaged in what you're doing. imo that's what makes life life.
 
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