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xylene fasa - strange xtals

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Phlux-

Phlux-

The Root
OG Pioneer
okay so swim did 2 xylene pulls and combined them then added fasa and the solution went cloudy - how long should it stay cloudy for ? within about 2 minutes 2 5mm disk shape xtal formations were spotted, in the next 2 minutes the size had doubled - the mixture is cloudy yellow and should contain jungle spice and spice - all the fumarate pix i have seen have been displaying needle like xtals - what is this - jungle fumarate ? and how does swim separate the 2, convert to fumarates then convert back into freebases then separate via a naptha wash ?
 
that sounds just about right...the fumarate to freebase then naphtha wash...SWIM hasnt seen the round disk shaped crystals..but there are so many different things that can happen..once freebased tell us how they feel!
 
Does SWIY have any pictures?? SWIM has never seen disc-like crystal formations. Not sure if that is supposed to be "jungle spice fumarate".

But yeah, if one wishes to separate them, just convert to freebases then wash them with naphtha.
 
il get a pic right now - you ppl have got swims knowledge up to where it is now - much appreciated.
 
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you cant see the definition but swim says it looks like mycelium. But the xtal like lines radiate out dead streight from the centre out.
 
these pix were taken 47 minutes after the last pix - its growing like a boeng.

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ah HA! This happened to SWIM when he did FASA on either hexane or xylene...cant remember...but those look like some pretty sweet xtals!
 
okay 1 more batch of pix 2hr10m after the fasa was added - in the morning il post how it looks - the solution is starting to clear.

i think they are this shape because they are precipping slowly - the xylene was not evapped down at all after the pull so it was not 100% saturated.

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keep in mind this is pull 7 in total - pull 2 with xylene - just goes to show what a crap solvent naptha is.
The whole bottom of the jar is half a cm deep in xtals


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Sweet! SWIM's FOAF has been amazed from how much more alkaloids xylene can pull after the naphtha pulls. But naphtha can be freeze precipitated which is a great advantage xylene does not have. FASA however really unleashes the true power of xylene, hahaha

BTW, how long did it take for the crystals to precipitate? SWIN's FOAF's would guess that overnight should be more than sufficient even though he sees full precipitation within 30min sometimes.

But this may be attributed to many different factors. Everybody gets his/her materials from different places. Xylene, acetone and fumaric acid can vary slightly from supplier to supplier and this may account for such differences observed by home extractors.

But anyway, thanks for trying the tek and congrats for having success so far. The more people try it the more problems/caveats can be identified in this tek, so he can revise it in the future.
 
the first xtals were visible minutes after the fasa was added - i think it was clear in about 5 hours - left it longer just in case - i am sure the reason for slow precipitation was the fact that the xylene was not 100% saturated - as in it was not evapped down at all after pulling.
im very happy with this technique and swim intends to use this method only from now on - a few mods here and there but i mean how could this work better - its the best tek out there imo.
oh and the only thing i would add to what swims doing is re-x'ing in heptane(swim cant find it anywhere) to grow some nice bigguns - can anything else be used that can give the success heptane can ?

also on evapping xylene then cleaning the spice off the residue with naptha - i find that some nonsense gets in the naptha along with the spice - what is spice in its fumarate salt form soluble that the other fumarates arent ?
thought perhaps if there separated before going to freebase a cleaner product may be possible - this is swims first extraction so perhaps the cleaning with naptha does work and swim did something wrong somewhere. - swim will be playing with this tek and recording all the results here.

:)
 
Phlux- said:
also on evapping xylene then cleaning the spice off the residue with naptha - i find that some nonsense gets in the naptha along with the spice - what is spice in its fumarate salt form soluble that the other fumarates arent ?
thought perhaps if there separated before going to freebase a cleaner product may be possible - this is swims first extraction so perhaps the cleaning with naptha does work and swim did something wrong somewhere. - swim will be playing with this tek and recording all the results here.
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Evaporating the xylene will give you a whole lot of crap from the bark along with the alkaloids. And plenty of this crap will also dissolve in naphtna when the residue from xylene evaporation is washed with it.

Spice and dmt-N-oxide and jungle spice in their fumarate forms are NOT SOLUBLE AT ALL in naphtha or acetone or any other NP solvents. What one gets from xylene and FASA is the fumarate salts of the alkaloids. Pretty pure, but not smokeable or easy to separate. If you want to separate them, get the fumarates, convert them to freebases (you'll need some sodium carbonate or calcium hydroxide), then wash them with naphtha to get the white spice out. There are quite a few ways to do it.

Xylene evaporation on the other hand gives you the alkaloids in their freebase form along with other crap.
 
okay excellent - i think its best to convert everything into fumarate then freebase and fp it when neede caus the fumarate has a longer shelf life etc...

does this sound perfect - where can steps be added or removed.

add mhrb to basified water
pull with xylene many times
add the xylene pulls together and evap somewhat
add fasa to the xylene
collect the fumarates
********clean the fumarates of any residual fumaric acid by washing with clean acetone********* is this step neccicary ?
convert to freebase
pull from freebase with naptha and freeze precip for pure dmt freebase - how many pulls are neccicary here and ^^^swim can only find flavoured calcium carbonate - how would one do it with lye
whatever is left over is the jungle ?

if lye is used or even calcium carbonate how does one recover the jungle from the water base ? xylene again ?

this fasa route really is the way foreward - the future of spice extractions

oh and here are the last pix of that extraction.

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Or even better, refer to the tek here.

This includes conversion of all the fumarates to freebase using calcium hydroll with acetone and evap. to get pure freebases. xide or sodium carbonate watery paste, dry totally, cut in powder, then pu

Then one can wash with naphtha.

But what SWIY proposed is fine as well. Just dissolve in basic water, pull with naphtha, few times, then evap it to get the spice. Then go on pulling few times with xylene to get the rest out.

SWIM's FOAF jsut finds the latter more troublesome. As a matter of fact, he does not even go around separating jungle spice from spice. Totally useless in his opinion and he likes the total alkaloid MHRB mix more. But that's only him. He would recommend people to try the total alkaloidal mixture as well as the pure spice before trying to separate the both. Just in case they may like them mixed up!
 
swims actual flight time in hyperspace is limited - he is nervous of the jungle and has never tried it - should swim perhaps take that step and try some -

also how to convert the fumarate back to freebase using lye - its about the only pure base swim has access to.
 
SWIY should have access to at least sodium carbonate. It can be easily made from sodium bicarbonate (or baking soda) readily available in any country where people consume bread or other pastie products.

SWIM's FOAF would be afraid to use NaOH instead of sodium carbonate or calcium hydroxide. A NaOH paste can have an insanely high pH (maybe even 16!) that may totally destroy the alkaloids. He would really avoid using it unless he had spice to waste.
 
what if he did a standard STB extraction of dmt fumarate? all you would have to do is make a basic water solution..put the spice fumarate into the water and then extract with naphtha then freeze precip..granted that means you will be doing two extractions for one..but then you could just evap the water down leaving the lye jungle mix..and then pull that with acetone and evap..
 
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