2nd attempt at caapi + freebase dmt failed. help please.

[stargaze]

I have searched through many threads on this site and others trying to narrow down what I could be missing here and I just cant seem to get this yet. I would like to draw on the experiences of members who have succeeded here who are willing to help me out.

I am using a peruvian red caapi from a vendor that I can only find good reviews on as far as plant quality goes although it is mostly in regards to their mhrb. I was also happy with it. The caapi was boiled for about an hour at a time, decanted, stored and the process was repeated four times. The remaining 1 1/2 ish gallons were reduced to the size of about 16 fl oz. The first time I used 50g of caapi the second 95g.

not being really familiar with the effects of caapi or any harmalas for that matter makes it kind of difficult for me to tell if this is the faulty component. I did notice psychoactive effects both times before the administration of the dmt which was at about 30min after I drank the caapi. those effects most notable were calming which is not a typical self generated psychoactive state for me pre dmt experience. not typical at all. Some increase in visual "noise" and Im not sure what to call it...... when you look at a bright abject and close your eyes and it creates a dark shape. It was comparable to the very first effects of aminitas in a way. I feel like I am fairly good at following directions and deducing the logic behind them and the process of preparing the caapi seemed to go well other than it did not get any lighter in color (the water put to store and reduce) as the process was repeated.

The freebase dmt was put in a shot of lemon juice before I began the caapi process. first attempt I used about 50-60mg and the second attempt I used about 110mg. I am very certain of its quality as a freebase material as I am experienced with using the drug that way, have sampled other extracts, and have performed the process a few times. I used a recrystalized STB material that was the result of cool agitations (white as opposed to more dense yellow seems to be the difference in my experience there) and was stirred at 40 minute intervals until the caapi was prepared. I was a little suspicious about the lemon juice part as not all of the dmt dissolved in it. maybe none of it, hard to say. I usually smoke about 30mg for a near breakthrough experience about 55mg for a sure out of body experience and the experience becomes impossible to integrate for me after about 80mg.

I am very sensitive to psychedelic drugs and I did not notice any effect that I would attribute to dmt other than the weird anxiety that a very small threshold dose gives me but I cant be sure that is the case as I dont ever use it like that.
I weigh about 235 lbs.

If anyone who reads this has experience they can share to help me find the issue here I would appreciate the help immensely. Thanks.

 

[jdubs]

Did you keep your caapi?

You say you boiled for a total of 4 hours... Many people say 9-12 hours is prefferable, in 3-4 3-hour stages.

Also did you acidify the boiling water, at least once?

Even if you got all the alks out, some caapi just isnt that strong. I had some white vine once that took 120g to get proper effects.

Got some now where you only need 25g though... Vine can vary greatly. Generally from 95g you should be getting quite strong harmala effects(eg. strong tracers, very strong sedation, closed eye dreamy visions, possibly incapacitated for many hours).

So if you are not getting strong harmala effects, I would guess you need to alter your vine brewing technique, or you just have weak vine.

Never tried it, but I hear red is supposed to be one of the strongest. Its the next on my list for this reason

Maybe try boiling a few more hours?

EDIT: Also, don't decant too much. The residue after filtering can sometimes be very active.

 

[biopsylo]

i have no experience with red caapi, but was it finely shredded?

also, you may want to take freebase at the same time as the caapi.

i have never taken fb with caapi tea. have you considered extracting the harmalas?? im a big fan of gibran2 tek.

the same 95g caapi extracted would yield approx 4 -200mg doses. iirc

 

[Global]

If you drink your DMT, and you're not feeling it and feel that it's not really coming on, smoking some freebase is one of the quickest, easiest (and fun) solutions to the problem.

 

[stargaze]

yeah I still have the caapi and plenty of it. you say I should be getting tracers just from the caapi huh? I plan on boiling it for a day next time. I did add vinegar to acidify but I hear tons of conflicting approaches about the tannin content being enough for that or you only need to boil for 30 min a wash from experienced members. Makes it hard to narrow down whats going wrong. I didnt have tracers like tryptamines give me but I did experience a visual activity resembling aminitas somewhat. Not nearly incapacitated in a literal sense. I did smoke after I knew the oral dmt wasn't coming on but the longer more maneuverable experience is what I am looking for here. I appreciate the replies. If you know anyone with experience taking freebase with the caapi maybe run it by them. I will be doing a harmala pull if the next brew doesn't work out. I'll check your recommended tek. thanks again.

 

[jdubs]

Perhaps just brew up the rest of your caapi. 3x3 hour boils. It is important to change the water each time, to allow enough room for the alkaloids to escape into the water. Also, a little vinegar helps, just dont overdo it as it tastes BAD. This method has worked every time for me, even with the aforementioned weak white vine. Brewing for 12 hours really made a brew to be reckoned with.

If you brew it all at once, you can always drink more if your first dose doesnt work. Also, you can try some vine-heavy brews to get a feel for the harmalas. It seems as if perhaps you arent fully MAO inhibited. When you have plenty of harmalas, you really know about it - weird ectoplasm-type tracers and very heavy sedation. The tracers arent really tryptamine like, more like a very 'real', semi-physical kind of energy field of some sort. Ive never seen them on tryptamines anyway, though some may have. Harmalas feel very calming and rejuvinating, grounding 'the light' of the DMT.

I'm unfamiliar with the Amanita experience so cant comment on that.

Brewing it all at once also saves time in the long run, with not having to brew up for hours every time. If its reduced, it keeps in the fridge for ages. I had a brew sat there for almost a year. It had fermented a bit but after boiling the alcohol off, it was as good as fresh.

So maybe try it again, have 50g, then if you need more, have more. Bare in mind you may make a much stronger brew, so dont go straight away taking like 100g, as your brewing method may have improved, especially if you are adding light. High dose harmala and high dose DMT could potentially put you off for life if you jump off too far at the deep end. You can always drink more, but never less.

If you have a load of pre-made brew you can find your sweet spot with the harmalas, then add light a bit at a time.

I would say your priority would be to ensure noticeable harmala effects to get an optimum all round aya experience eventually. It may take a few times, but you'll get there in the end. You do appear to have described some of it's subtler effects already.

My 2p, for what its worth. Hope it helps

Good luck with your voyages, and let us know how it goes!

 

[stargaze]

Perhaps just brew up the rest of your caapi.

good call. I gather from your description that there is a very different side to this experience than I have anticipated. Maybe I should focus on a good all at once caapi brew with an extraction attention span and get used to the harmala effects alone. I have heard multiple accounts of more intense psychoactive effects than I am feeling when I partake. harmalas worry me more than just dmt though. I guess I had reservations about making all into a brew at once but if I did that I would have a baseline for this and I would only need to guess on one of the components at a time and also spend one day or two purifying it instead of many sessions.

especially if you are adding light?

not sure what you mean.

oh dmt. correct me if Im wrong.

what would be a safe dose to experience a high of harmala with no light? using the peruvian red vine powdered assuming the 9 x 12 hour brew is more efficient. I have about 350g more. what should I expect?

thanks. This is making more sense intuitively already.

 

[Global]

especially if you are adding light?

not sure what you mean.

oh dmt. correct me if Im wrong.

what would be a safe dose to experience a high of harmala with no light? using the peruvian red vine powdered assuming the 9 x 12 hour brew is more efficient. I have about 350g more. what should I expect?

thanks. This is making more sense intuitively already.

Yes, adding the light is adding the DMT component. I'm no caapi expert, so hopefully you'll get a response from someone who can address your question better, but when you end up taking it with DMT, I would use 100g. For that reason, I might also use 100g to test the waters as that would be the dose you'd be taking. Of course if you use 100g on a trial run, then you can still decide to take more when you add the DMT out of the amount you'll have left over from the 350g. Perhaps 150 and 150 if you're looking for a bit of a higher end caapi dosage?

 

[jdubs]

Yes the vine is the DMT. The Vine is the spirit, and the DMT is the light.

This is the importance of the caapi - it is the ayahuasca. The light just illuminates it.

With 350g you should have AT LEAST 3 strong brews if its very weak vine, and up to 7 if it's average strength.

You can't really overdo the harmalas. Its overdoing the light that you want to be very careful about.

It's not over in a few minutes like vaped spice, yet still can come on very quickly in a bewildering rush. The light grabs you, and it feels you have been possessed by some kind of alien force. This can go on for many hours. For this reason, getting acquainted with the harmalas first will ground you when you add the light.

The vine is warm, healing and caring so seriously don't worry about it. Just have somewhere to lay down for a while!

The stronger the vine brew, the less spice you should need. Generally I find its the moar vine the better! (within reason hehe)