Blabbing about ego and whatnot

[Aviator]

It's been a few weeks since I've really WANTED to smoke DMT. It's called to me and I've smoked but I just wasn't that thrilled to do it. I have a couple buddies that I introduced DMT to and they seem to still be all about it. One wants to smoke with me a lot. It's hard to explain to someone who seems to have positive experiences with DMT how you can't just be ready to blast off on a whim.

In the last couple months I've had my perspective on life, death, existence, thinking, and pretty much everything else changed through DMT use. It's been a struggle to integrate some of the things I've been through. It's been a struggle just getting through the experiences. So, I've been thinking a lot about why that is...

My theory is pretty simple. Ego.

One experience seemed to have a really big affect on me. I was in the folding room. I mean this was as real as me sitting here on my bed typing this out. Everything was folding, shifting, unfolding, repeating, and for some reason it was totally maddening. It just didn't make sense and it scared the sh*t out of me. I was convinced that I broke reality which was terrifying. I was convinced that I was never coming back which was the moment when I mentally fell apart.

Why did I mentally fall apart? I was afraid I had lost everything I had known for the last 27 years. I was afraid I would never see the people I love again. I would never reach the goals I set out for myself. I wouldn't be a part of this life again. Why? Because now I'm stuck in this place and it's absolutely bat sh*t crazy. I wanted back to this life so badly.

Today I thought what a hell it would be to be stuck in that place. I wondered why I felt that way though. It's mostly because it has nothing to do with this life whatsoever. The last 27 years didn't matter there. The people I love didn't matter there. Wtf would I need a goal for there? It's not like a need to work a crap job to make money to buy junk there. None of these things matter there. So, what does matter there? Well, I don't know... my best guess is simply existing.

What is simply existing? Ego death. What is ego death? Take your life experiences and throw them away. You're now purely feelings and a viewpoint(s) with no contemplation of the past or future. Everything you once had predefined ideas for no longer exist and everything is defined on the spot for what it truly is. That might mean something that once scared the complete sh*t out of you now... just is. It's not scary. It's not not scary. It just is. That's what it's like for me anyway.

So, I've experienced ego death before. I know that I simply exist underneath my ego. So, I know these experiences that I find hard to handle with an ego are completely different without an ego. They're not scary. They just are.

Goodnight

 

[Infectedstyle]

"Oh my god. I broke it. I broke reality."

I totally dig your post! Rings so true. Only psychedelic users seem to understand these thoughts that are so hard to define and harder to convey succesfully.

I have never experienced Ego-death. I have often contemplated this. It just never happened. I do understand the creeping eeriness of places so alien and void from any human reference point that simply seeing it is scary.

But ego death is not something you can call on yourself is it? My biggest fear are my own emotions. I can scare the crap out of myself by scattering my thoughts and paranoid convictions. Perfect control of myself is something i should aspire to. I hope to meditate into hyperspace peacefully one day. And calmly witness what is on the other side. I just can't wait for that day to come.

 

[The Unknowing]

Everything was folding, shifting, unfolding, repeating, and for some reason it was totally maddening. It just didn't make sense and it scared the sh*t out of me. I was convinced that I broke reality which was terrifying. I was convinced that I was never coming back which was the moment when I mentally fell apart.

Yeah...I've been to that place. The level of fear I got to in that moment was similar to when I almost drowned at a beach.
The light on my ceiling was reaching down at my face and the walls were collapsing inwards.
Truly maddening. What made me panic the most were the sounds...like someone opening and closing a door, over and over and over.

Although this was on Ayahuasca, so the terror lasted hours.

I will NEVER be careless with dosage ever again.

 

[Aviator]

But ego death is not something you can call on yourself is it? My biggest fear are my own emotions. I can scare the crap out of myself by scattering my thoughts and paranoid convictions. Perfect control of myself is something i should aspire to. I hope to meditate into hyperspace peacefully one day. And calmly witness what is on the other side. I just can't wait for that day to come.

You'll know it when the things that make you what you think you are start to disappear. You'll also know it when they start to come back. It's a unique feeling. I'd also like to sail into hyperspace at an easier rate to handle than instantly haha. I'm thinking caapi leaves...

Yeah...I've been to that place. The level of fear I got to in that moment was similar to when I almost drowned at a beach.
The light on my ceiling was reaching down at my face and the walls were collapsing inwards.
Truly maddening. What made me panic the most were the sounds...like someone opening and closing a door, over and over and over. Crying or very sad

I'm sorry to hear about the fear you experienced and that noise... it's just click, slam, click, slam, click, slam, click, slam, and it never ends, right?

Now, doesn't this make you wonder a little bit about what's REALLY going on here? You, I, and others have been to the folding room. This isn't something that happens every time you smoke DMT but it seems to happen. How is it possible that DMT can have so many varied effects and yet so many similarities. I'm convinced that we're not just "tripping" here. We're there wherever that is.

That's basically the same argument that people give about the elves.

 

[Elpo]

I've had a similar kind of experience on mushrooms. At the peak I just blacked out on my bed and the only thing I can remember was that the whole existence was ripped to pieces continually. It felt like my own head was blown to smithereens. The word that best fits was Fractal. My ego totally dissolved in those instants of which I have no idea how long they took.

Everything is just the way it is even in this world and in this existence.

 

[Aviator]

Your mushroom experience sounds similar to my very first breakthrough on DMT. Fractal mind shredding...

 

[The Unknowing]

it's just click, slam, click, slam, click, slam, click, slam, and it never ends, right?

Now, doesn't this make you wonder a little bit about what's REALLY going on here? You, I, and others have been to the folding room. This isn't something that happens every time you smoke DMT but it seems to happen. How is it possible that DMT can have so many varied effects and yet so many similarities. I'm convinced that we're not just "tripping" here. We're there wherever that is.

That's basically the same argument that people give about the elves.

Interesting thought, yeah, that's pretty much what it sounds like. I don't find the noise very pleasant at all, it just keeps getting louder and louder until everything you know about yourself collapses. I wonder if it is the state of consciousness before a breakthrough into the next dimension? Definitely comes with a feeling that everything in this reality is merging...powerful stuff...

 

[Purges]

An excerpt from my travel journal - 22/02/2012

"Feeling comfortable, I loaded up a second bowl with a much bigger blob of wax, filled up the chamber and ripped that sucker good and hard. BIG MISTAKE. Within an instant the room had disappeared. My heart was beating at what felt like a million miles an hour and I was struggling to breath. I am pretty sure at that moment I was having a full blown panic attack looking at the symptoms.

It was absolutely terrifying, I felt like I had completely lost my grip and was being plunged into death and insanity. Everything was moving incredibly fast and I certainly couldn't distinguish any lessons or meaning from the visual aspect of the journey, which as far as I remember was a series of interconnected tunnels that kept collapsing in on themselves, imagine being in a building where the walls were collapsing towards you and you spent the whole time narrowly avoiding being crushed to death, it was like that. Don't get me wrong I have lost contact with reality many times before, but the nature of the trip combined with the physiological symptoms was just TOO MUCH it was a complete over load. I think about this point I passed out for a while, who knows."

Now, doesn't this make you wonder a little bit about what's REALLY going on here? You, I, and others have been to the folding room. This isn't something that happens every time you smoke DMT but it seems to happen. How is it possible that DMT can have so many varied effects and yet so many similarities. I'm convinced that we're not just "tripping" here. We're there wherever that is.

That's basically the same argument that people give about the elves.

I too am convinced by now that it isn't just "tripping" - my theory is that we are peeling back layers of conscious mind into layers of pure, unbridled consciousness this is why we witness and experience things that just wouldn't make sense on the physical plain. This is also why some places we visit are more cohesive, and some are in a constant state of flux. The variables are infinite and it stands to reason that areas of this infinite space are indeed too much for us to manage. This is reality, but at a different frequency and density to the one we are used to perceiving on our usually very limited bandwidth. That's where I am at the moment anyway, my opinion on this is in constant flux too

 

[Aviator]

I too am convinced by now that it isn't just "tripping" - my theory is that we are peeling back layers of conscious mind into layers of pure, unbridled consciousness this is why we witness and experience things that just wouldn't make sense on the physical plain. This is also why some places we visit are more cohesive, and some are in a constant state of flux. The variables are infinite and it stands to reason that areas of this infinite space are indeed too much for us to manage. This is reality, but at a different frequency and density to the one we are used to perceiving on our usually very limited bandwidth. That's where I am at the moment anyway, my opinion on this is in constant flux too

I pretty much agree with this. If any of you are bored maybe you should watch this.

Anyone that has experienced DMT should have a unique perspective about the episode of "The Universe".

I found it entertaining that multiple countries and a mass of scientists have spent countless man hours and billions of dollars colliding particles to see if they can observe them entering higher dimensions while I'm seemingly visiting these dimensions myself. Just imagine if this is actually happening. :lol:

 

[Hyperspace Fool]

As the author of the Folding Rooms entry in the Hyperspace Lexicon... I can say I know exactly what you mean. Personally, I don't find the folding rooms scary. I don't feel like I have a physical body to be crushed, so I don't have the urge to flee like Purges through his folding tubes. I also don't have the desire to try and "make sense of it" either. But I suppose my experience of the folding rooms is colored by the fact that I am generally in telepathic communication with at least one entity while there... often a bunch of them... and that the architecture and objects that are so befuddling are actually sentient.

The door slamming sound generally comes to me as the clunk of powerful machinery, and like when you are in the engine room of ship... once you grok that this is the sound the engine makes, you can almost tune it out or at least it ceases to be distrubing.

On the topic of ego-death, I just posted a rather long post on that so I will direct you there rather than rehash my thoughts. Technically I am discussing ego manufacture, but ego-death is included in my exposition.

Finally, on the "just tripping" theme... I have long since abandoned the idea that this stuff is all in my head. The fact that so many things about Hyperspace seem universal (or at least widely experienced by a wide variety of people with no contact and no cultural expectations)... makes me think that having jesters, carrier waves, chrysanthemums, folding rooms, unfurling crystalline structures, and fractal hyper-dimensional perspectives hardwired into our brains is somewhat less likely than the hard to swallow concept that we are visiting a real place. For one person to experience something on a drug that is something he or she not only never experienced before, but never imagined experiencing before is already strong evidence that the individual might not be manufacturing it. For dozens of people to have the same experience with the same substance makes that case far stronger. But, for literally hundreds of thousands of people to report identical experiences... often without having been aware of the memes beforehand... this is rather big. The most common thing people tell me when the shock wears off, is that they absolutely know they couldn't have imagined the things they experienced because they are not capable of imagining them. Their experience was so utterly beyond anything they could possibly dream up, that there is little doubt for them that this could not have originated from their subconscious.

Naturally, all of this still leaves room for doubt. It doesn't approach any kind of certainty and is no explanation whatsoever. For me, that stuff came with the entities being willing to share with me information that I could confirm for myself later. When a glorious light being that can read your mind tells you things you never even considered before and you come down and check it out to find that information to be precise and undeniable... that is the game changer.

Anyway, I have enjoyed your thread. Nice to see a fellow psychonaut grappling with the same things that I was grappling with and being rational and wise about the integration.

Note: Don't let your joy-ride buddies influence you to blast off more than you know you should. You absolutely don't need to get a big hyperslap. (another one of my many additions to the HL)

 

[3rdI]

hello HF,

im just gonna play a little devils advocate here,

these things that happen to lots of people, things they couldn't imagine themselves, the things that people say show that something else is going on here beyond just tripping, could they not just be what DMT does? the reason the same things happen to lots of people is because that's what is meant to happen when you vape DMT, a hugely hallucinogenic substance.

in a simplistic comparison most people will smoke weed and get the munchies or the giggles because that's just what weed does, or when you take MDMA you are happy/loved up, well that's just what MDMA does.

i may have asked you this before (I don't remember because damn it, that's just what the weed does:lol: ) but can you let us know something that you have been told in hyperspace that you have confirmed in consensus reality, I understand if you cant/don't want to.

for the record I think its way beyond tripping but I pose this question because when I have discussed these things with clever strict materialist they always end up saying "that just what it does, its a hallucinogenic drug and your having hallucinations to think otherwise is just deluded" and I have trouble coming back against it without saying you just cant understand unless they have been there.

 

[Hyperspace Fool]

Indeed brother 3rdI.

We have discussed this stuff on other threads, but the short version of my list of proofs includes:

1) Locations of objects I didn't know existed in places I have never been.
2) Obscure details about a field of study I have never undertaken.
3) Things that were unknown when I tripped but come out in the news during the following week.


... and even more mind-blowing shit.

When (If) this kind of thing happens for you... skepticism dies on the vine. When it happens dozens of times and you get those kinds of deja vus that last for 15 minutes where you not only have "seen this before" but know exactly where you saw it, and which entity showed it to you... you would be rather obtuse to cling scared to your sacred guns of "this is not possible."

After all, skeptics are basically saying that their current understanding of reality is, if not complete, at least superior and objectively universal to all the other minds out there.

To me, this idea is at least as laughable as they find all the airy-fairy "impossibilities" that the rest of us continue to experience... and have experienced since the dawn of written language anyway.

I am not claiming to have all the answers. The answers I have won, all blossom into more questions even knottier than the originals. The naive questions of my youth are mostly all answered for me... but I am at least as clueless as I ever was.

Hehehehe.

The thing about the "that's just what DMT does" argument... or any variation of it... is that it says nothing. It explains nothing. Sure, that is what DMT does. So? What on Earth does that little bit of stating the obvious say about the reality of the experience?

It is a bit like talking about how children come to be... and saying "Well, that is just what vaginas do. Every now and then they spit out kids."

Sorry if this analogy offends anyone... but I assume we are all adults here, and know the birds & the bees.

The thing is, we don't have to understand the mechanisms for how it is possible that a human can consume an endogenous neurotransmitter and find themselves in a vivd, startling and inhabited realm, in order to verify that the realm and its inhabitants are authentic and not hallucinations. You can't hallucinate things you have never seen before. You can combine a turkey and a water-balloon in your mind. You can experience synesthesia... and smell colors and see music. You can't invent Hyperspace.

So, what the skeptics are saying is that the code for Hyperspace is written somewhere on the DMT molecule itself. That you plug this program into a matching socket and this particular and rather specific film plays. As if the DMT molecule was a USB stick containing Skyrim or GTA 5...

Not entirely unfeasible, but it says nothing about who programmed this game, why, how characters in the game can know things about you AND things about your world you don't know, how such a monumentally complex program could be encoded on what is a rather simple molecule... a "mono amino" no less.

In essence they are wildly speculating with no proof whatsoever. And worse... their speculation answers no questions at all. Rather poor sci-fi IMHO. That these people often take up the mantle of scientific authority is rather disturbing, because we all know that in science you have to make a hypothesis that can be disproven.... and then attempt to disprove it. Their model has nothing in it that can lead anywhere.

Whereas... on the contrary... having Hyperspace Entities direct you to hidden objects and information is eminently testable. My hypothesis has never been proven wrong to me in many decades of trying my utmost.

That's my take on it... Take it or leave it.
HF

 

[3rdI]

I like that, I think I will take it.

thanks for the answer HF, a pleasure to read as normal:thumb_up:

 

[Aviator]

Naturally, all of this still leaves room for doubt. It doesn't approach any kind of certainty and is no explanation whatsoever. For me, that stuff came with the entities being willing to share with me information that I could confirm for myself later. When a glorious light being that can read your mind tells you things you never even considered before and you come down and check it out to find that information to be precise and undeniable... that is the game changer.

Hey, Hyperspace Fool, can you tell me more about your experience with this being?

We may have met a similar being here. When I saw it it was hard to distinguish details but oddly enough it was incredibly detailed... hard to explain. It was a blazing white, yellow, but mostly orange. I felt completely inferior to it deep inside of me so I lowered my head in shame. It said simply, "It's Okay..." Immediately I was filled with pure joy and looked at it again. Completely memorizing, beautiful, immense, and flowing with raw energy and power. Just woah... wow...

After I returned from the visit I yelled and screamed like I was insane from the shear power of the experience. Tears gushed from my eyes for a good 15 minutes after. It was incredible.

This may add as another support for the "we're not just tripping" house we're building.

 

[Mr.Peabody]

Why did I mentally fall apart? I was afraid I had lost everything I had known for the last 27 years. I was afraid I would never see the people I love again. I would never reach the goals I set out for myself. I wouldn't be a part of this life again. Why? Because now I'm stuck in this place and it's absolutely bat sh*t crazy. I wanted back to this life so badly.

I went there about a year ago. I actually didn't get all the way to the room, but I had the exact same feeling. I fought it so hard, which I think made things far worse than if I had just accepted my fate. It took a long time before I had the nerve to take a decent dose of DMT again. It was the single most terrifying experience of my life! It still stands as such.

I have often wondered where the line is. Is it all in my head? I think people mistake skepticism for just crappy science. The scientific approach, to me, is to accept all possibilities equally until disproven. The fact is, very little is still known about the nature of consciousness. It is very possible that the mind is capable of visiting other dimensions, the same dimensions that current models that are generally accepted of the universe. It would obviously be very chaotic for a generally three dimensional being to partially exist in fourth dimensional space.

To me, the idea that the visions, states, and experiences attained under the influence of these simple molecules are 100% a product of the mechanics of the atoms making up the being, well, that is the most far-fetched and extreme explanation available! That would mean that my brain has powers far beyond anything I have ever imagined, or could imagine. It seems less of a stretch to explain it as a perception of something real, something that exists outside of the tripper.

But like I said, I entertain all possibilities equally, as I have not had any of the possibilities proved false as of yet!

I really like this thread, thanks for the mind-candy!

 

[Elpo]

I have been reading a lot about the "real/not real" question.

Ken Wilber wrote a really great book which tackles this. It comes down to the simple fact that science studies the objectively possible, while spiritualism studies the internally possible. He says none of the two is better, but that both are necessary. That is exactly where I find myself in at this point in my life. As much as I love science, it does not explain to me what I have experienced when having psychedelics, or just even when walking through the world...

Nevertheless science is still important to teach us what these substances do to our body. The only thing that worries me is the fact that society nowadays is only focused on the objectively possible (external). If scientists could they would like to get the active agent out of any psychedelic, and toss away the spiritual experience (internal). In my opinion these two go together and should not be seperated, because mind and body are connected.

Science will be able to tell us all about the brain, neurotransmitters etc. but in my opinion it will never succeed in explaining what consciousness is, because consciousness is simply internal.

I also found this great discussion which is worth watching for anyone who is interested in the subject:

 

[Hyperspace Fool]

Hey, Hyperspace Fool, can you tell me more about your experience with this being?

I have met a plethora of beings. An astounding variety actually.

I collected a bunch of the most common ones some time ago and posted them here.

But this list is far from comprehensive. I left entire classifications of entities out because I didn't want to give them attention (dark entities for the most part) and a bunch more just because I didn't have time or energy to make the list endlessly long. As it is, it is probably as long as the rest of the Lexicon put together.

I recognize the being you spoke of though. It appears to be a kind of light being that in popular vernacular are called angels. There are dozens of angelic beings from cherubim and ophanim all the way up to the archangels. If you encounter that particular entity again, you might wanna ask its name.

It is a great blessing and an immeasurably useful thing for a psychonaut to have a light being as a friend or guide. Knowing one by name who will come when you call is so ridiculously cool that you will wonder how you ever tripped without it. (of course, they are not pet genies and may cut you off if you don't behave in a worthy manner as they see it.)

Heheheh.

 

[Aviator]

I recognize the being you spoke of though. It appears to be a kind of light being that in popular vernacular are called angels. There are dozens of angelic beings from cherubim and ophanim all the way up to the archangels. If you encounter that particular entity again, you might wanna ask its name.

I'll try... but I was so dumbfounded :lol: This being didn't feel so much like an angel. It felt more like god. The power of it was insane... cut me down to size then brought me back up in an instant.

It seems that the folding room is a difficult place to be in. In a way I feel like traveling back there may be a good experience knowing what I know now. Although, there's no guarantee that I'll remember any of this when I'm up to my eyeballs in 4d insanity.

 

[Hyperspace Fool]

I feel you bro.

Nothing like awe and flabbergast to make you forget everything you wanted to do in Hyperspace... make you forget your name and identity... heheheh.

But it is possible. At a certain point you do learn to maintain the requisite equilibrium. A certain level of proficiency with meditation helps a lot.

There are plenty of beings that can pose as G*d. Many of them even deserve the title of a god (with a lower case g). But as awesome and humbling as an archangel or the Earth Mother may be... they are not the totality of existence... hence, not the big G in my theology.

I am certain that the gods that most people witnessed and made religions around were not the truly Universal "one god" that includes and manifests itself as everything. From the descriptions I would guess that most of them were aliens, powerful spirits, entities that enjoy posing as the divine for a variety of reasons, hyper dimensional genii... even demons. The typical, kneel before me in awe and humility thing is not how the big guy works IME. If you have even the slightest doubt about the totality of infinity you are witnessing, the unbounded and unqualified love you are experiencing... and the total lack of any kind of agenda or desire... then you are probably hanging with something less than the Ultimate.

At any rate, these "lesser" beings are plenty. And, as they have interest in humanity, they are the ones that tend to offer you assistance.

That's how it seems to me anyway.
HF

 

[Aviator]

I agree with everything you've said.

I'd like to say it was the ultimate that I met. But... I had once thought I knew what DMT had in store for me but I was so wrong. Over and over. Now, it just seems silly to say I met the ultimate when I could just as easily meet the ultimate's ultimate. Honestly, it's a little frightening to think about. Haha and writing that out made me remember that I said out loud to it, "I'm frightened..." at one point.

Anyway, thanks for the wise and thoughtful comments everyone!