Changa, fever, shivering and headache

[Teamleary]

Hey everyone,

Unfortunately, I don't think I can provide a rigorous account of what I'm about to say, but here it is:

It's been year that, every time I smoke changa, say, at around 8 or 9 pm, I wake up in the middle of the night, with shivers, kinda like when you get fever, and the next day, I have a headache.

The first time it happened, I had smoke like... 3 or 4 bowls, and the next day, I had actual fever (like almost 39°c). I initially thought "well yeah, you overdid it".

But since, it has happened (less intensely of course) even with just one bowl. I'm pretty sure this has happened with changa from various sources.

Yesterday, I had a bowl that I didn't even fully kept within. Then some FB. During the night, I woke up shivering and sweated a lot. Today, at noon, my head started to hurt.

I'm a little worried. A little bit for my health. I don't want to mess with my brain too much. But mostly about my relationship to changa. I don't want to give up on that way of administration.

Has this ever happened to you? I have searched the nexus for threads related to "changa + shiver", "changa + headaches" and "changa + fever". I've read a few but it never really sounded similar. Most often, it was more intense (including vomiting and, more broadly, being very sick).

so mods: please do not hesitate to suppress that thread if you feel that it's useless. But what surprises most is that this didn't happen before WITH THE SAME changa! Could it be that it deteriorated with time?

Anyway, any feedback would be appreciated! thanks!

Team L

 

[Voidmatrix]

Part of me wonders if you may developing an allergic reaction to something in your changa blend. What combinations of herbs DMT and harmalas do you havecin your blend?

When did this start happening?

I also wonder if it's a reaction to neural overload.

How many days after do these symptoms persist?

When was the last time you took a break and for how long?

Just brainstorming so we can remedy this for you bud.

One love

 

[downwardsfromzero]

That does sound unpleasant and it's definitely worth going through VM's suggestions/questions.

However, this post stood out to me for another reason. This past week I've been taking modest doses of rue tea most evenings, typically in the 3 - 3.5g range specifically as an antiviral medication. In fact, I had held off with my harmala experiments specially until this situation - a flu-like illness - arose. Even when the signs of illness had all but gone the rue tea would still give me night fevers.

So the line of thinking here is that maybe (your) changa is initiating an immune response against some latent virus or other infectious agent. A possible way of testing this would be to drink some rue tea 2 - 3 hours before going to bed.

Then again, it could indeed be a neural overload/serotonin thing (one of the symptoms of serotonin syndrome is fever) and, again anecdotally, more than once an LSD trip has caused me to overheat somewhat but then that was always in response to physical exertion.

One final question - is anything in your sleeping arrangements (bedding, bedclothes, bedroom temperature/ventilation) like to exacerbate the situation?

 

[King Tryptamine]

Your case is pretty unique IME. It does resemble serotonin syndrome but it's odd that it didn't happen during the experience rather than later after the drugs have began clearing out of your system. Maybe it is a rebound effect or something? I don't know, just throwing suggestions out there.

 

[Teamleary]

Thank you all for your kind answers.

So, here is what I can say:

it started exactly a year ago. Before that, every changa experience I had went fine, with no side effect. Unfortunately, I cannot state with certainty what is inside my changa as I am not the one who extracted/made it. But what I can say is that it is the same changa that didn't provoke these side effects back then. It's supposed to have caapi in it. At least for one of the batches.

Symptoms always vanish on day 3 (day 1: smoking; day 2: feeling a bit feverish ; day 3 : all good!)

After the first time it happened (which was, coincidentally my first BT), I took a 3 month break, cause I wanted to integrate the experience. Since then, I lowered the usage frequency. I smoked a bit of changa while on 4-Aco and the next day had a massive headache (but no fever during the night).

Oh! wait! I think I just remember that I had an accidental breakthrough with some changa not long ago, while trying my new bonga and that experience didn't lead to the said side effects. So maybe it's not a 100% thing now, but just a very regular thing?

My question now: does one should be worried about your diagnosis (mild serotonin syndrome)? I mean, on paper, it's pretty frightening... I'm considering staying off changa and keeping on FB since that doesn't lead to any side effect... I know in that case I can't really complain since the gates of the hyperspace wouldn't be closed forever for me! But still, changa has its vibe!

I'm considering rolling a chamomile/changa joint to see what happens when I go for a non-BT/mellow experience.

 

[bismillah]

Dude... I would never smoke something that someone else made, especially when you don't even get told exactly what's in it. God alone knows what's in there.

Try making your own and then see if symptoms persist.

 

[Voidmatrix]

I'm wondering if there may be some kind of contaminant in the changa and it's just taken some time to start affecting you, slowly building up in your body.

I also wonder if it's just a new manifestation of your experience. Over a year ago, I started dealing with nausea with freebase and changa (some of which I attribute to GERD).

I'm very curious. Let us know how it goes with the chamomile.

One love

 

[Teamleary]

Dude... I would never smoke something that someone else made, especially when you don't even get told exactly what's in it. God alone knows what's in there.

Try making your own and then see if symptoms persist.

Hey,

I totally understand why you would say such a thing, but let me just say that : 1) some people who make the changa, are very meticulous and very serious people who think of this job as something sacred ; 2) I didn't say they didn't tell what was in it, I said that I didn't know. I'm pretty sure I knew at the time, but there was nothing alarming back then, so I lost track of what's in what bag ; 3) I also said that exact same changa didn't have any side effect before, and that it happens from different sources, so it'd be weird to blame the product.

 

[Northerner]

I've had reactions from residual solvents in changa that read exactly like your experience. Both the effects and the duration are identical. Even changa that appears to be dried properly, if not cured, can cause this sort of thing if one has developed a sensitivity.

The solution for me was to open my changa jar to air for a couple of hours every day for a week or so after the product was finished. Not only does this let out and potentially trapped solvents but it also makes the leaf burn better.

Maybe it's what's causing the issue for you too and an easy fix.

 

[Voidmatrix]

I've had reactions from residual solvents in changa that read exactly like your experience. Both the effects and the duration are identical. Even changa that appears to be dried properly, if not cured, can cause this sort of thing if one has developed a sensitivity.

The solution for me was to open my changa jar to air for a couple of hours every day for a week or so after the product was finished. Not only does this let out and potentially trapped solvents but it also makes the leaf burn better.

Maybe it's what's causing the issue for you too and an easy fix.

Boom! Northerner for the save! (Hopefully)

Ime, as I age the way I experience and process different things changes. In this regard, I never used to need to purge or vomit on DMT until about two years ago. Now it's almost a regular occurrence.

One love

 

[downwardsfromzero]

smoked a bit of changa while on 4-Aco and the next day had a massive headache

This is not so surprising as post-psilocin headaches are a fairly common phenomenon. So, the post-changa headache is by extension also not wholly unexpected.

 

[Voidmatrix]

smoked a bit of changa while on 4-Aco and the next day had a massive headache

This is not so surprising as post-psilocin headaches are a fairly common phenomenon. So, the post-changa headache is by extension also not wholly unexpected.

Shoot, I sometimes get those headaches during the experience. Just comes with the territory.

One love

 

[_Trip_]

Are you on medications?

 

[Teamleary]

I've had reactions from residual solvents in changa that read exactly like your experience. Both the effects and the duration are identical. Even changa that appears to be dried properly, if not cured, can cause this sort of thing if one has developed a sensitivity.

The solution for me was to open my changa jar to air for a couple of hours every day for a week or so after the product was finished. Not only does this let out and potentially trapped solvents but it also makes the leaf burn better.

Maybe it's what's causing the issue for you too and an easy fix.

well, that's very interesting! I might just do that then! thank you Northerner!

so that makes me wonder... could it be the plastic bag it's stored in? maybe I should find some glass container...

 

[Teamleary]

smoked a bit of changa while on 4-Aco and the next day had a massive headache

This is not so surprising as post-psilocin headaches are a fairly common phenomenon. So, the post-changa headache is by extension also not wholly unexpected.

yeah, I had a hunch... just wanted to confirm with you guys... thank you Downwardsfromzero!

 

[Teamleary]

Are you on medications?

absolutely not! but of course, this would have been importance to notice, thanks

 

[Ramma]

Get a free and easy Covid test.

Maybe you are locked out or starting to be locked out

Maybe the changa was bad

I reckon all psychedelic medicines are about getting sick or experiencing pain, even if its not and its entirely blissful.


“I realized that it’s pointless;
all that mortification in search of immortality
is as futile
as oars and rudder on dry land.
Ethics, immersion, and wisdom:
by developing this path to awakening
I attained ultimate purity.
You’re defeated, terminator!”
~~Gotama The Blessed One replying to Mara The Evil One, from a sutta, an original buddhist text.

 

[5-CNT-FAI]

I too have woken up in the middle of the night with a fever, a headache, and shivers. It was after a high dose of 5-MeO-DMT, which my body rapidly metabolises into bufotenin, so let's just call it a medium dose of bufotenin.

I'm pretty sure it was mild serotonin syndrome, since bufotenin can cause it pretty easily if you use it in combination with stimulants, like the ADHD medication that was definitely in my system at the time.

So my two cents is you had mild serotonin syndrome, but there's no test for that. Get some periactin on hand in case it happens in the future, and make sure not to take any stimulants on the same day.

12mg of periactin will wipe out mild serotonin syndrome in most people, but it will also make you super drowsy.

 

[Dirty T]

I get shivers sometimes on breakthrough or after breakthrough but never headaches. I'm also wondering about residual solvents. Depending on what they used there can be some nasty stuff left behind and it could cause some serious side effects. I'm of the same school of thought that I would never use acquired psychedelics, you don't know what's REALLY in there no matter how serious whoever you get your Changa from "takes their job" at the end of the day of they are selling Chang's for profit they are a "drug dealer". One of the beautiful things about DMT and Changa is no dealer necessary. Ever. Try making your own and report back. I personally wouldn't worry about Serotonin Syndrome unless you're on medication. I take Subutex and that can cause Serotonin Syndrome with psychedelics as well IT SERIOUSLY CAN CAUSE SEROTONIN SYNDROME AND I DON'T SUGGEST ANYONE DO WHAT I DO EVER! I also waited to do psilocybin and DMT until I was down to 2mg per day. I wouldn't do it when I was taking 16mg per day, that could kill me.

 

[skoobysnax]

I have heard of flu-like symptoms with changa. Never had such but i have had strange reactions before that I attribute to diet and possibly harmalas that were not mansked enough (my first rue harmalas were someone else's extract). My own rue extracted harmalas were pretty meticulously cleaned as is my spice. You might opt for sublingual harmalas (15-20mg) and vape the spice. For me it is much more pleasant, be sure to work with less spice until you gauge the effect. Toss that old changa into your next extraction and reclaim the spice and clean it up well.