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Crystals melting

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soulman

soulman

Rising Star
Hey guys,
Just aftr a bitof guidence. Been doin a bit of readin, and it seems that DMT crystals will melt at room temperature. Is this correct? SWIM currently has some extract in the freezer. how does he ensure that the crystals dont melt when he takes them out and drains the naptha. And if they do melt, how do you utilise the DMT?

Cheers guys
 
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This has happened to swim before and i think it was the oils and tannins from the root that were in the crystal that made it melt.He could tell when they were in the freezer they were looking yellow and after 10 min sitting at room temp they all turned to yellow goo.
It was nearly impossible to recover them becuase they melted into the coffe filters (which are porous) and he got very sad :cry:.

Actually he fears he is in the same predicament because the crystals in his freezer are looking yellow and he fears that once he takes them out into room temp,the same thing will happen. Mabey he needs to put them on something to dry that wont suck in the goo.

He also has a thermal cooler, so he's thinking of setting it at...say 50 degrees f and let them dry in there where it's a little cooler but he's a little concerned aswell.

If anyone has any suggestions to prevent yellowish crystals from melting into coffe filters (making it very difficult to recover) he would love to hear some suggestions,aswell.
 
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So am i right in thinking that recrystalising purifys the spice?
And am i right in thinking that to recrystalize you just dissovle in more naptha and allow to evapourate at room temp?
 
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There are two reasons crystals may melt: Firstly, as mentioned above, may be impurities. Give the spice saturated NPS a wash with an excess of sodium carbonate (washing soda) solution; some do this with baking soda as well.

The second may be that your crystals were still wet, and the residual NPS got too warm and dissolved the crystals. To avoid this, tilt you freeze-precip. chamber to about 45 degrees with the most bare spot on the bottom and allow NPS to drain to the bottom corner; if you have a dropper or a small pipette, use it to suck out that excess. Do all of this while the container and its contents are still quite cold. Scrape the product into a coffee filter and roll the crystals around to dry all sides. If the filter gets too wet, pour them into a new one and repeat. And yes, allow the product to dry at room temperature
 
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So am i right in thinking that recrystalising purifys the spice?
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yes for sure.

And am i right in thinking that to recrystalize you just dissovle in more naptha and allow to evapourate at room temp?
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no. Take the spice and dissolve it in the minimal amount of warm naptha needed to dissolve it. Then put it in the freeze for a day or two. Filter off the naptha no need to evaporate it you can reuse it a number of times like this or eventually evaporate it and SWIY will most likely be left with a yellow oil (which may be DMT oxide) or some other impurities.


About the crystals melting in the coffeefilters one could always extract them back off the filter or just rinse the filter with more solvent and they will be back in solution and SWIY can try again.
 
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no. Take the spice and dissolve it in the minimal amount of warm naptha needed to dissolve it. Then put it in the freeze for a day or two. Filter off the naptha no need to evaporate it you can reuse it a number of times like this or eventually evaporate it and SWIY will most likely be left with a yellow oil (which may be DMT oxide) or some other impurities.
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But i thought recyrstalising got rid of impurities?!!
If after doin this SWIM is left with a yellow oil, does this mean he/she has to keep repeating the above until the crystals remain, or does it mean that they aint gonna get any crystals.

What can one do with this yellow oil? Can one utilise it, or does one have to keep recrystalising in order to make use of it.

Thanks for your patients. SWIM really appreciates it :d
 
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^^Maybe I was not clear enough.

Recrystallizing means that you dissolve your sample in a solvent that it is only partially soluble in, in this case naptha (this is also why warming it helps). When the sample dissolves so does the impurities. When you freeze the solvent the compound you want in this case spice precipitates out of your solution and the impurities idealy remain in the solvent. So then you must seperate the crystals from the solvent by either filtering or whatever other method you can think of. But if you just dry the solvent without removing the crystals from the solvent the impurities are still there. You see?

What is the status of SWIYs imaginary extraction?
 
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SWIY got confused.

Recrystallisation will give SWIY white/off white crystals. He/she should do as burnt suggested, i.e.:

1) dissolving it in the smallest amount of warm naphtha that can dissolve it

2) He/she should see some yellow oil which is insoluble in naphtha to fall on the bottom. (Naphtha will dissolve and get saturated with spice, the yellow oil will not dissolve).

3) the yellow oil can be removed.

4) the rest of the naphtha is stuck in the freezer for a day or so. White precipitate will form.

5) the white precipitate is collected and dried. Presto!

burnt said:
Filter off the naptha no need to evaporate it you can reuse it a number of times like this or eventually evaporate it and SWIY will most likely be left with a yellow oil (which may be DMT oxide) or some other impurities.
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6) if SWIY decides to evaporate the filtered naphtha then he/she will be left with some yellow oil or other impurities

In SWIM's FOAF humble opinion the yellow oil is dmt-N-oxide, perfectly smokable and perfectly active, it can be mixed with some herb if one wishes to utilise it. It does not harm the pure dmt in any other way other than preventing it to solidify if it is present in big enough amounts (like SWIY's case?).

DMT with yellow tints still absolutely fine (as long as it is satisfactory solid!) not inferior to pure white dmt. Making pure white dmt (devoid of ANY dmt-n-oxide) is a masochistic tendency which SWIM totally understands but does not condone the slightest.
 
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burnt said:
^^Maybe I was not clear enough.

Recrystallizing means that you dissolve your sample in a solvent that it is only partially soluble in, in this case naptha (this is also why warming it helps). When the sample dissolves so does the impurities. When you freeze the solvent the compound you want in this case spice precipitates out of your solution and the impurities idealy remain in the solvent. So then you must seperate the crystals from the solvent by either filtering or whatever other method you can think of. But if you just dry the solvent without removing the crystals from the solvent the impurities are still there. You see?

What is the status of SWIYs imaginary extraction?
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Oh ok, i think he gets it now. Thanks for the info and I shall pass it on to him asap.

In his imaginary extraction, he had put the solution in the freezer overnite. This AM, he poured the naptha through a filter, which captured a few floating crystals, and placed the tray back in the freezer at an angle to make sure all the naptha gathers in the corner and hopefully doesnt redissovle any of the spice. There are a few crsyals, but it looks more like a coating, which im guessing will be like a powder when scaped. There is a little yellow colouration to some ares on the tray!!. He tells me he will scrape the tray after work and i will let you know what he says.

Thanks again guys
 
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In his imaginary extraction, he had put the solution in the freezer overnite. This AM, he poured the naptha through a filter, which captured a few floating crystals, and placed the tray back in the freezer at an angle to make sure all the naptha gathers in the corner and hopefully doesnt redissovle any of the spice. There are a few crsyals, but it looks more like a coating, which im guessing will be like a powder when scaped. There is a little yellow colouration to some ares on the tray!!. He tells me he will scrape the tray after work and i will let you know what he says.
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Don't worry bout the yellow tints. Its not a big deal. Getting pure pure pure crystals is difficult and not necessary.

If SWIY thinks their yield are too low concentrate the naptha solution. This will make it more likely that the spice will precipitate.

Success!
 
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OK he went home at lunch time. He managed to get a bit of powder of the filter. The tray, he has left on the side for the ice crystals on the side of it to melt before he tries a scrape.

He tells me he used this technique


Do you guys think he should do an ammonium wash on them or is it better to just recrystalise?
If he is to wash them, how long does it take as he was really excited about having his first experience tonight :d
 
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Honestly, do not bother washing. Even though it is sounds straightforward, many people have reported problems and it is best avoided, UNLESS one suspects that his/her final product is contaminated with sodium hydroxide. But this is almost never true, since NaOH does not dissolve the slightest in non-polar solvents. The extract should not have any hints of solvent smell of course, but that goes without saying.

If SWIY's extract looks like the end-product of the tek he just linked (it's still OK if it is yellower), he's fine to launch.

Enjoy!!!!!
 
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^^SWIM will second that. Washing although easy if you understand the idea it is not always necessary. Ammonia washing is also not the way to go. One should only wash the spice when its still in its non polar solution. There is very little point in washing crystals as any impurity would most likely be inside the crystals themselves.

anyway happy travels :shock:
 
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Saweeet,

SWIM was just worried about the harshness of the end product. Didnt wanna cough it all up again wasting valuble spice, but if you dont think its necessary then i shall let him know that i heard it from a more experienced bunch.

BTW it smells like cheap plastic. I believe this is what its sposed to smell like right
 
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Just make sure the spice is completely dry. Sometimes residual solvent is present that is probably worse (in terms of smell etc) then any minor impurities. NaOH doesn't burn at the temperautes people vaporize and a small amount of it won't do much anyway.

While its hard to describe the smell its very distinct just make sure it smells nothing like the solvent SWIY used.
 
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soulman said:
BTW it smells like cheap plastic. I believe this is what its sposed to smell like right
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Suggestion... Personally, swim does not like the taste of spice,it tastes like mothballs iho.

swiy can do 2 thing depending on the smoking apparatus. If it's a pipe you can put a layer of MJ under the spice to prevent it from melting thruogh the screen and put a thin layer of mj ontop to protect it from an open flame.

personally swim likes to experience DMT alone and will use that same technique w/ parsley. It almost completely eliminates the taste,although you'll still smell it in the air.

Also, swim has found jet flame lighters to be more effective
 
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Dwhitty76 Suggestion... Personally said:
SWIM has just had a little taster and agrees that it tastes like mothball. Its fuckin disgusting. It aslo remined SWIM of fart spray that you can get from joke shops. Its like smoking fart spray haha
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soulman said:
SWIM has just had a little taster and agrees that it tastes like mothball. Its fuckin disgusting. It aslo remined SWIM of fart spray that you can get from joke shops. Its like smoking fart spray haha
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Yeah...it's pretty bad. Parsley is definately the way to go or mj if you like...it makes ALL the difference.

Was this swiy's 1st time w/spice?

Swims first time was back in may and he just loaded his pipe up took to 3 big tokes and had his socks knocked off :shock:

It took him another two weeks to get up the nerve to smoke again.

Now,he's started to incorperate stuff to make the journey as peaceful as possible.

He likes to smile as he smokes (that helps),he also say's thank you a lot to any of the entities that might decide to drop by and it really..really helps.

The most important thing is not to fight it and just let it take you where it wants to take you or show you and saying thank you has definately becoming part of his spice mantra.....they seem to like it. :lol:
 
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